Oh I wouldn’t go that far- there are surely plenty who would appreciate being allowed to take their gloves off. I’d guess it’s just Blizzard that thinks/feels that way- or that they think that all their Alliance players ARE like that maybe?
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I think there are plenty that THINK they want this, but would get buyers remorse super quick if Blizz actually let them “take their gloves off” without all the insulation. Because I genuinely do not think many Alliance players realize just how much Blizz goes out of its way to insulate, whitewash, or invalidate what few grey acts the faction actually does commit. So losing that insulation that they don’t even recognize … might result in some freakouts… It might be more jarring than they’d expect.
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I wish I knew just what the hell blizzard is thinking half the time, and who’s really making the final decisions over there. Because it just feels like there is this massive disconnect between them and the fan base in general.
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It was like just you upset of Geya-rah, thank you for admiring finally you were upset.
I for one, don’t need the Alliance to get their hits in. It’s to late, we should have been allowed the hits in from the beginning, but nope. Someone’s got to feel empowered, because we’re being led by a boy-king. Couldn’t imagine who that might EVENTUALLY screw up too. Hmm?
There’s no reason at all I should want/advocate for an Alliance toon to be villain-batted, considering I enjoy them. I’d normally say something like that for someone who enjoys the Horde, but it’s not the case. You get to enjoy earmarking any past reprisal to total evil behavior as ‘Ah yes, this wasn’t a faction thing, they were belligerently evil Alliance at work!’. People still act like Genn’s responsible for Teldrassil, he isn’t. That doesn’t mean people can’t enjoy the burning, but it does mean NE players can’t. What kind of lunatic needs Tyrande to seem like an evil person? I wonder.
Or, maybe just maybe. They’re worried the Horde might not appreciate getting stomped.
So basically…
Re-enact Daelin Proudmoore’s coastal invasion of Kalimdor.
I don’t see a reason to villain bat her, especially with how destitute the AU Mag’har character roster truly is. And doing so would not benefit anyone but the Alliance playerbase, who would thus be given an opportunity to act as the Aggressors … while never having to tarnish their pristine reputations. The entire premise is meant to give the Alliance an out to retain moral absolutism … but also get their long overdue hits in. Which makes it little more than a ma**turbatory power fantasy for the Alliance. A way to reassert their Moral Absolutism AND their Absolutist Power Fantasy working together like they had in Legion.
So lets meet in the middle. Frame Geya’rah or perhaps Belmont for the murders. Have your catalyst. But in truth they are innocent. Have the Lightbound show up, make friends, give the Alliance the power they need to offset any costs on taking out the Horde … and then instigate the conflict by pinning it on one of those two easy targets. People that due to their own temperaments the Alliance will believe with little question are the perpetrators. Perhaps killing someone of note like Velen or Faol, who are close to Turalyon; who got a little too close to the truth of the Light Mother. Thus, the Alliance gets their hits in thinking they are in the right … but it doesn’t require a genuine villain batting for our remaining cast.
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Well, it’s the nature of groups I guess. Maybe they figured 'Since we know it’s impossible to please everybody, we’ll just do what we honestly want to while trying to hopefully displease as few as possible." Not all Horde players feels the same way or want the same thing from the story. Same with Alliance. And some don’t care much about the story at all. The people here on the Story forum are a tiny minority and sure as heck don’t agree on everything. We have to accept at least the possibility that vast sections of the customers are either happy enough or apathetic enough with what they’ve been given that Blizzard really thinks that any problems we raise here aren’t important.
EDIT: Also there are surely people IN Blizzard who gets into disagreements about the story directions amongst themselves which explains some narrative flip-flops.
This was my suggestion, with Ner’zhul being freed from the helm of domination. Thanks for reading anything I post, wow.
Maybe. I just think back on all the BS lies they fed us the last two yrs and I admittedly don’t trust anything they say anymore. Maybe that’s just me though
Ner’zhul is gone dude. And again, your first instinct is to try to find a way (even through someone like Ner’zhul) for the Horde or a Horde race to “start it”. Even something as benign as like the Lightbound genuinely just framing a member of a Horde race (and there are easy targets for that) … is not sufficient for the catalyst, because that would mean the Alliance would be doing crappy things unjustly. Even if they didn’t realize it while doing it. But if a Horde villain starts it, even an old one of the past, then any moral ambiguity is thrown out the door. Because the Horde or Horde race is the baddy.
Its a simple enough settup to get the catalyst you want, but leave the villain batting of a member of a Horde race or Horde (even a Horde villain like Ner’zhul) off the table. Just have the Lightbound show up, make friends, and then someone on the Alliance gets too close to the truth and they die. And their deaths are pinned on one of a handful of easy targets on the Horde. No Horde villain batting, but the “Horde started it” from the Alliance’s perspective. There ya go. Not complicated, especially with the peaceniks gone.
You don’t see a reason to villain bat her, yet I was able to provide a reason to do it. I even made it so she was ‘MCed’ in the suggestion, to avoid her being evil. Villain batting Alliance characters is the true definition. They aren’t allowed to ever react meaningfully, not because the player base is worried about how they might look, like the Horde playerbase in this thread is retching about. In my opinion, it’s because the Horde playerbase couldn’t handle it at all. You’re allowed to side with Sylvanas in the story, not just behind the screen. You’re not even allowing the Alliance that when you REQUIRE them to be villain batted, so you can sleep at night.
Where are you getting this from, that I’m stating someone like Vol’jin, or Thrall, or Blaine could start a legitimate conflict, and I would easily know they’re evil? Where?
Okay. This is solidifying what was blatantly clear from the beginning. The only one worried about mora absolutism is players like you. How about the Alliance get to do something that makes sense in the moment, instead of having to see Horde players pinch themselves, and toss and turn at night over the idea an Alliance character might fly off the handle, and do something that makes no sense?
I don’t want to villain bat an Alliance character, but the ONLY possible reason you think villain batting the ONLY character the AU Mag’har has (even possessing her to do it) is because you genuinely are coming from the stance of “The Alliance CAN NOT EVER start it. It HAS TO BE the Horde”. Which is the exact sentiment that led us to BfA, where the Horde (the faction not allowed ANY motives, let alone valid ones) HAS to play the aggressors. While the Faction with all the motives and reasons in the world to hit the Horde … CAN’T do it. Its your desire to ensure the Alliance strongly maintains the good guys.
There is a massive spectrum of morality when writing, but this total inability for Alliance players to allow themselves to be anything more than “flawless, vibrant, blindingly pure and white” is why Horde players genuinely roll their eyes any time one of them says “they want to take the gloves off”. Because they don’t. What they want is the return of their Moral Absolutism and Absolutist Power Fantasy working in tandem like they had in Legion. Rather than like in BfA where their Moral Absolutism is being used as a tool to stymie and restrict that Absolutist Power Fantasy.
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At this point. The reason I made that suggestion at all, was to watch you go bonkers about it, and take it as some deep personal slight. Holy cow.
When you can’t admit the Alliance have legitimate motives, you’re the problem. If you try to make Genn seem crazy over Broken Shore instead of reasonable, you’re defending a character like Sylvanas. I appreciate what people saw in Sylvanas, but it was never represented in the character as a warchief. You don’t have to agree with it, but other Horde leaders should have given him a nod of semi-understanding, and the reaction should have been reasonable. Nope. Sylvanas convinces Saurfang he was trying to eat kids, while she used the soul cage, and were burning down someone else’s house. Which was reasonable only up until she literally claimed they were nothing.
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Yeah, its a bit personal. Because I genuinely believe one of the single most destructive and detrimental themes in Blizz’s current writing is in fact their constant maintenance of the Alliance’s Moral Absolutism. Their inhumanly flawless and virtuous nature. Because, in a two faction setting where one faction is untouchable … that means the other is going to be forced to pick up the slack. Which is part of why the Alliance is oversaturated in virtues, but allowed little to no tangible flaws. While the Horde is drowning in flaws, and being allowed few avenues to virtue. That massive imbalance is hyper problematic.
So no, I don’t agree its necessary to villain bat Geya’rah to “allow” the Alliance to finally act on decades of grudges. Especially since that would mean villain batting a genocide survivor, and thus validating the genociders … with the primary justification being “The race of the victim and the perpetrator”. Rah has already shown she cares deeply for her peoples well being, and is able to learn and adapt (even with how little screen time she’s been allowed). The only reason you’d hit her with the villain bat is if what you want is an excuse for the Alliance to “take their gloves off” … but also “keep their hands clean”.
EDIT: And I’m not sure where you’re getting me saying the Alliance doesn’t have valid motives. Of course they friggen do. What aggrivates me is the kneejerk need for the Faction allowed ZERO motives, let alone valid ones, to always start this crap. Simply because the Alliance (the ones with all the valid motives and justifications) … can not be allowed to. “You’re the good guys, the good guys dont do that.”
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Oh how DARE you 
Tyrande might as well not have been allowed to reclaim Dark shore, with this type of logic. The Horde should have built an orphanage over the dead elves, and when she knocks it down act as if she had no right to do so.
She didn’t get to that much a all, and by virtue of wanting to save her people, is being made to be a ‘wow drama queen’ in the story.