How a M+ Solo Queue System could look like

Community General Discussion
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This post is about exploring how a solo queue system for Mythic+ (M+) could function and replace the current manual group-forming system. The goal is to address some of the key issues players face today:

  • Queue times are too high, especially for non-meta roles.
  • The meta is overly restrictive, limiting group variety and discouraging creative playstyles.

Here’s a proposed outline for how such a system could work:

1. Flexible Queuing Options:
Players would queue for M+ in a way similar to normal or heroic dungeons. You can:

  • Queue solo.
  • Queue with friends or a fixed group (up to 5 players).
    This allows flexibility for players who enjoy playing with specific people while still opening up opportunities for solo players.

2. Dungeon Selection:
You can choose to queue for:

  • Specific dungeons you’ve already timed at any keystone level you’ve completed.
  • Random dungeons, providing greater variety and faster matchmaking.
  • Random dungeon push, only queueing you for a key at least one member of the group has not timed yet.

3. Pushing Keys:
If you want to push, you can only select to queue for random dungeons. The system will only queuing you for keystone levels that at least one party member still needs to time. This ensures meaningful progression opportunities while keeping a varied experience.

4. Pre-Run Preparation:
After matchmaking, the group is moved into the dungeon instance. The party leader can start the run, allowing time for:

  • Discussing routes and strategies.
  • Preparing (using the auction house, placeing target dummies etc.).
    This ensures everyone is ready before the timer starts.

5. Random Group Compositions:
Group compositions would be random within some limits:

  • Every group has one tank and one healer.
  • Beyond that, there’s no guarantee of specific utility (e.g., bloodlust or battle res). This encourages adapting to different team dynamics.

6. Universal Bloodlust:
To mitigate the lack of group composition control, bloodlust would become an item or ability that every player in the group can use.

7. Leaving and Abandoning Runs:

  • A run can be abandoned by a group vote without a deserter debuff for any member.
  • If a player leaves before the key starts, they will not receive a deserter debuff.
  • If a player leaves during the dungeon, they will be replaced by another player via matchmaking, but the run will be marked as depleted. This avoids exploiting the system by rotating in specific classes for particular parts of the dungeon.

8. Ranking System:
The existing M+ ranking system would remain. Players only gain points for completing dungeons, encouraging them to work with the group they’re assigned to, rather than abandoning runs prematurely.

Conclusion:
This system could drastically reduce queue times, make M+ more accessible, and foster a more inclusive environment by removing some of the meta-driven barriers. It wouldn’t replace the challenge or cooperative aspects of M+ but would shift how groups are formed, making it easier and faster to jump into the action.

What are your thoughts on this idea? Would such a system improve your M+ experience?

1 Like
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Ok, but what do you do when DPS suck and then tanks and healers stop queuing because the aforementioned bad DPS.

Like the fundamental problem with M+ as a queue based system is that Blizzard tuned queued PvE around the idea that anyone who can get upgrades from the system can queue for the system, and thus the system is tuned around people who do the bare minimum gameplay at the bare minimum gear level.

Like we saw in Cataclysm, that tends to fall apart when the content isn’t ridiculously easy. What do you do when DPS queues balloon to 60+ minutes like we saw then?

Also how would you handle leavers and keys being bricked? If you get a leaver, does the group just disband, do you rope some poor soul into backfilling? If the key is bricked, are you expected to finish it?

3 Likes
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I would just like a system where by i can put myself into it with a small note of what I’m looking for, then i can go about my daily business until someone sees my note and decides i am a good fit.

My note would be something like: Looking for chill groups for lower/easier keys, not fussed about timers, just want to run with nice people and tick off my vault slots :slightly_smiling_face:

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Why would I as a tank queue into a random group when I could make a custom group with a higher chance of success?

My suggestion is that the tank:healer:dps ratio required for dungeons does not match player role preference.

So the solution is to change the ratio required for dungeons. Increasing from a 5 man to 6 man dungeons system is a 33% increase in dps per tank!

I’d even suggest giving a 10 man option for dungeons with 1 tank:2healers:7dps.

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I eddited in OP how i would handle leavers.

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This doesn’t work because M+ only gives drops at the end of the dungeon. This prevents players from kicking others or 5-stacking and leaving right before the boss dies to funnel loot. What happens when you go through 10 pugs? Who gets the loot?

What’s next, universal battle res?

People are literally complaining about failing keys with player-made teams. M+ is not made to be random queued. Imagine Normal or Heroic raids being queued after how LFR goes half the time with 3/4 of the dps doing less DPS than the tank who’s there for the goodie bag.

There’s a reason LFR has some mechanics doing zero damage while still showing the visuals and a stacking buff per wipe. There’s a reason LFD gives you a queued buff for Heroic Dungeons that you don’t get when manually walking into a Heroic Dungeon.

The only guaranteed thing that will happen is people running to the forums to complain about wasting timed being queued into M+ with even worse success rates.

2 Likes
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I vote yes simply because I can’t wait to see the explosion that would happen on the forums and other places with people losing their minds for how horrible the experience would be. I have learned in the last 19 years the only time I can truly enjoy the game is when I’m playing with friends or with guild mates. That said I still vote yes.

1 Like
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Wich you still can even in this System.

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Sounds like a nightmare.

No, you don’t get your +10 done because you’ve been in it for 10 hours and finally roped enough people inside,

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I said I’d vote yes just to watch all the drama unfold :rofl:

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stop using chatgpt to write posts for you

and a resounding “no” to random queued m+ groups. it would be a giant failure and we’d all pay the price for it.

4 Likes
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You’re making it unnecessarily complicated.

Just make it a random queue that preferentially gives you your lowest timed dungeons. If you time a given key level for a given dungeon you become eligible for the next step. Then you turn it into a true ranked ladder by allowing IO to drop if you fail a key. To keep it from being too volatile, you expand the pass/fail system into a pass/draw/fail. E.g. if you’re eligible for NW5, timing the key means your next NW will be a 6, drawing the key will make your next another shot at a 5, and failing the key will send you back down to complete another 4.

PvE players would probably grate at the idea initially, but beyond enabling a true relativistic ladder it would provide the most stable experience. The actual purpose of MMR systems is to create the most balanced possible matches, with our ability to create a rank ladder out of them being kind of secondary. Being able to drop rating is crucial to that function. Currently someone can bash their head into keys and brute force their way up, but in my proposed system everyone in your group would be proven capable (or just under capable) of that dungeon at that level, to the greatest certainty manageable.

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Why would any tank or healer participate?

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I did a random TWW Normal dungeon this morning. There was an Evoker popping Aspects every 10 minutes on trash and a Mage wandering forward face pulling random things. Both stood in telegraphed AoEs.

I’m not so confident the world is ready for open M+ queue.

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Omgawd no , why you want solo queue for that ?? Premades are already filled with nightmare stories , players have shared so many of those

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What if you get grouped with specs that dont have much CC?

That’s a huge issue tbh.

What if I intentionally afk then so you are forced to vote to end the run?

What would happen if queues actually wont be shorter, but longer instead?
How would grouping based on RIO work? Matchmake 2000-2500 rating together?
You provided plenty of bullet points but I dont see them solveing anything tbh…

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What do you when when tanks and healers stop queueing because the success rate of a PUG like that would probably be 10%, judging by the competency of PUGs in LFR and Heroics.

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Que times are high for low IO players. Off meta good players get in realtivly fast. M+ solo q will have mucu higher q times for solo dps.

Meta only matters in world first keys. Skill is more important and most groups take the best skilled players. I assume chat gpt didnt tell you that i ran this trough a AI checker and it said this was 100% AI btw.

Blizz said no they want randomness so people dont do thw same 3 keys over and over. So pure random has to be it

This would make it never used. Having a lust, brez or anything is a must. I coukd see them having like offbrand versions for the mode tho to insure you dont go without.

Yea you chat gpt this bud. You just contradicted yourself. -_- embarrassing…
Im not reading the rest as this is a obvious AI post

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As a tank main, no.

As a dps alt, yes.

I don’t want to carry your dps alt on my main.

I want my dps alt to get carried by your mains.

That’s what this system sounds like to me.

3 Likes
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That’s way too complicated. If we do see solo queue it’s going to be similar to solo shuffle or bg blitz. Players will queue and be put into a key appropriate to their current IO. They won’t be able to choose dungeons or key levels. There won’t be backfilling. If someone leaves they will get a more powerful desserter like in solo shuffle, but the key will be bricked unless the group wants to continue. There won’t be any guarantee for lust, brez, soothe, etc…

As sad as that sounds, a system like that would 100% replace the current LFG groups for keys up to 7. Nobody would try to put together their own groups until they need specific things for higher keys. We saw the same thing with solo shuffle when it killed the 3’s bracket. It turns out most players just want to log in and play without the social networking required to form groups.