If Blizzard does involve them I feel that they would end up working together with Renthar and Cyndia respectively serving as the Alliance and Horde represent in that regard. Alternatively if Cyndia remained with Sylvanas, there’s a quest revealing that their brother and sister, and it ends tragically with Renthar forced to kill her.
Everyone’s got Sunstrider fever when Kael’thas has only ever been two things: a joke. A failure.
Lor’themar deserves the throne.
2 Likes
Yeah. We both know that characterization is spun beyond recognition.
Lame bait.
3 Likes
I always read the implication being he was worried Lorthemar might claim it.
1 Like
Interesting.
“Kael’thas himself decreed that Anasterian will always be the last king of Quel’Thalas. The crown is unclaimed.”
Renthar narrowed his eyes. “And if someone were to lay such a claim?”
“There are none alive with any right to it.”
Renthar looked him right in the eye. Lor’themar matched his gaze just as fiercely. Renthar Hawkspear could doubt him in any way but this one."
I read that as Lor’themar (lowkey) telling Renthar that he has no right to invoke a claim and daring him to make one.
Though I can certainly see your interpretation of it now that you said it.
Regardless, he’s still has so much potential to be included in the story and would be an interesting political antagonist to Lor’themar if only they had the guts to do it.
1 Like
Yeah I agree. Blood elves have been kinda boring since TBC ended. It’s like the writers have been out to portray them as perfect as possible. The conflict with the Void elves was interesting but it doesn’t look like they plan to make that a major conflict. So something like this would be nice.
My only worry is that they may just try to portray the whole thing as black and white. Seems Blizz is incapable of writing nuanced characters anymore.
3 Likes
This. The only hint of emotional baggage the Horde still has of this comes from the rescue of Baine scenario in the war campaign with the blood elf NPCs.
While I can sort of understand the rest of the Horde keeping the belves at arm’s length, the sin’dorei should be clamoring to have her head on a spike adorning the gates of Silvermoon. That angry vengeful energy that Tyrande channeled for the Night Warrior stuff, should’ve been channeled by someone high up in Thalassian society because we all know Lor’themar can’t grow a pair to save his life.
This is why they never should’ve killed Kael. It would’ve made for some great character development and internal conflict to see his reaction to the woman he lusted over painting Dalaran red with the blood of his people. Either he bites the bullet and confronts her (epic fire v frost mage showdown anyone?), or he simps out and tries to satiate everyone, leading only to more angry voices and possibly a coup against him.
/rant
2 Likes
How about we don’t have another case of an Alliance character putting forward a claime to a horde city. Lor’themar earned his position. He is the reason there is a Quel’Thalas.
See, this is exactly why I was worried about High Elves/Void Elves. I didn’t care about Alliance players having them as long as they didn’t start demanding our stuff. You know, like a Horde city.
7 Likes
ah yes. another “horde” thread turned out to be just about blood elves.
No.
Death will have no meaning anymore if we can just grab people out of the Shadowlands. It’ll completely deflate the stakes of every sacrifice or defeat forever.
Besides Warcraft desperately needs to stop being this soap opera about the big hero characters.
What I thought held up about Classic more than anything was that the story was about the world and your toon’s adventure through it.
Thrall is just a guy on a throne in Orgrimmar. Sometimes he’s got a quest for you, but you really don’t interact with him much. Hell in the Undercity you interact with Magistrates and Executors and Varimathras before ever talking to the Banshee Queen. So it actually feels kinda special when you finally earn an audience with her.
Flash forward to Cata and Slyvanas is going on horse rides with your toon, where she gives you an exposition dump on what the Forsaken’s deal is (for the people who apparently couldn’t figure that out in Tirisfal I guess) and calls your toon a cool dude.
The leaders should be a backdrop. Interactions with them should be sparse and feel special. They should have more important things to do than talk to murder hobos about their problems.
Lor’Themar is fine, Thrall is fine, Thalyrssa is fine, Baine just needs to stop being damseled, Talanji is fine, Gazlowe is fine and if they just give us Voss instead of trying to force Calia down the Forsaken’s throat they’ll be fine too.
Keep the named characters as the set dressing and WPvP bosses they’re supposed to be and keep the camera on the world and the bit players just trying to survive and thrive in this crazy place.
Have the leaders very occassionally turn up as shorthand for ‘ish just got real’ and leave it at that.
7 Likes
This story is driven by characters. And that won’t change anytime soon. So bringing some loved characters in the roster to shine in some spotlight is the right thing to do. Kael should return to the blood elves.
Classic is character driven. Its driven by your character and their interaction with the world. The big movers and shakers appear as boss fights or quest givers. This is why I actually really liked Zenkan. The story has gotten so bombastic the perspective of a relatively normal guy was sorely needed. I’d actually prefer more characters like him, player surrogates who aren’t basically demi gods. I really hope he doesn’t turn out to be a secret troll super sayian or something.
But speaking of leaders I do not understand why anyone’s disappointed with Lor’Themar. He’s more of a soldier than a leader but he’s learned to carry the burden of command well. He’s stern and uncompromising when he needs to be but it’s an act, he’s quietly a gentle warrior poet who gets nervous around girls he likes. But he actually seals the deal. Unlike Kael who got curbed by Proudmoore. He’s a nuanced character that actually comes in orbit of being relatable.
And also, I think the Horde really could use anything other than another undead elf leader right now.
4 Likes
OP, the only legitimately good thing Kael´thas can fulfill narrative wise is to be used to give some more depth and characterization to both Lor´themar and Rommath, but frankly after the massive and idiotic villain batting of TBC is too late to get him back proper for Belf leadership.
In which universe would be “nice” to have the moronic selfish (yes, moronic AND selfish cause only a stupid entitled prick sacrifices the chance to give the subjects he´s in charge of more resources to survive just to nurse his hurt ego) rando Ranger making absurd political claims in the name of the Alliance?
Smells like average entitled helfer argument.
Omg…no wonder our disagreements, cause that was quite the faulty reading comprehension back there.
Also, how is a rando nobody an “interesting political antagonist” for the actual person decreeted to get the job by the actual former ruler of the country? Specially when he got kicked out and not even the Fartriders cared over that, lul.
Smells like the usual “muh Silvermuun!!” entitled Helfer argument.
Give them a hand and they try to take the whole freaking arm ffs…
Unfortunately for you, Belves are kinda Horde, dude.
Don´t participate if you dislike the race so much.
Are you even aware that, by proxy of deeming Kael´thas “a joke and a failure” you literally imply Lor´themar too by association IS a joke and a failure too?
Way to “help” Treng. And no, stop trying to make him king, his refusal to take the throne is literally one of the things that makes a good character out of him.Stop trying to channel rando Helfers, dude (who, as you have seen in this thread, are thirsty for putting literally NOBODIES from the Alliance as people “worthy” of representing political rivals for Lor´themar regardless of how ridiculous the claim).
2 Likes
Perhaps the fact that he gets presented as the voice of reason, but doesn’t seem to present this voice of reason in critical or crucial moments. He winds up just following along with the plot without having much impact on it.
That’s a fair criticism but I think that has more to do with the utilization of his character than the character itself.
1 Like
No my issue is that the elves are whiny as usual, instead of talking about the whole faction the discussion turns around to be about blood elves instead.
Instead of, you know… The horde.
1 Like
It’s never too late to do something right. See Illidan. The story can only profit from Kael.
1 Like
But sylvanas become darth vader when she died, the horde sylvanas was never a hero, while the high elf one was
Also as a aside, kael thas coming back would be one of the biggest slaps in the face in the story, specially when blizzard is finally giving lothermar story
I think one can make the argument that Sylvanas was a Horde heroine even after her death. She broke free of Arthas’ control, founded the Forsaken and organized a rebellion against him. She saved what was left of Quel’thalas by offering the aid of her forsaken forces and she was also the one who convinced the Horde to accept the Sin’dorei into their fold bolstering their strength.
Deeds that can be interpreted as heroic. I don’t think she turned completely bad until she met the Jailer.
6 Likes
Her intent was never to help the horde, they where always a pawn to her.