It’s literally 2 mins atm at 1 am if you play the real faction.
Why is horde the “real” faction :d
I think one of the issues with this system, aside from it being poorly thought out and implemented, is that there’s no accounting for the future or changing demographics. 500k cap is a joke now but will it still be a joke in 6 months when most people got their easy epics and went back to doing PvE stuff. Nekrage is correct that this seems unintended / a bug or whatever you want to call it. I wouldn’t call it a bug, I’d call it bad design that is being exploited. The exact same as when people were exploiting DHK’s a month ago to get better/easier paths to R14. Blizzard stepped in and changed the formula then, so they probably will and IMO should do the same here.
Now, does that mean the system will be in a good state with that done? absolutely not. Every week as more people hit their goals for ranking. “I’m done at R14” vs “I’m going to stop at R13” etc etc. We get more and more people leaving the population of pvpers. This affects queue times, which affects hours required to reach 500k for the week.
I don’t know exactly how long it will take but at some point in the coming months, it’s likely to get so bad that you can’t get to 500k in a given week. Unless you did nothing but AV queue 22+ hrs a day and ruined your life, health etc to do so. That’s not good design and should not be encouraged.
They should fix this ‘issue’, yes. Nekrage is correct. But they also need to change the system to not have static caps. The caps should change. Grow higher as more people pvp and shrink as less people pvp.
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How exactly is this different from PvP before this change?
This is pretty much exactly how people operated in the ranking system prior to any changes as well. One you got the rank you were aiming for, usually you stopped participating in the premade scene and just focused on other things.
You either enjoy PvP enough to play with your new toys or you put them to work in PvE, leaving behind the PvP scene. It’s the same story.
The difference is that the old system, the “cap” was determined by the player base, or the players with the most honor, roughly speaking. All else being equal, the faction with longer queues would get lower caps. Therefore as the population got smaller, the queues got longer, the “cap” would decrease GENERALLY speaking. Just look at era before the “boom” under the old system when the population was smaller “caps” were what? 300K? lol
In this system, the cap remains at 500k for BOTH faction regardless of the population. Imagine if queues for AV were 40 min? 500k wouldn’t be so feasible. Obviously players could wake up and queue other things but I have a feeling the majority of players that are ranking just want title/gear rather than being hyped about “PVP”, which AB/WSG would force them to do (although queuing AV in the last few days, it seems that a lot more players are engaging in PVP action, thank god).
So yes, the two systems are incredibly different in that regards.
I believe that’s what Pierck was referring to.
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Right.
Well 500k is basically what Blizzard has determined is a reasonable “endgame” amount of honor to hit for players who are serious about PvP and have the logistical ability to put in the effort needed to hit rank 14.
You’re right that it doesn’t scale to the player base in the same sense of the older system, but that’s the precise element of the old system that made it suck so bad, because scaling with the players is what birthed all of the most cancerous elements of playing in to it in Classic Era.
Potential solutions could be Blizzard changing the cap depending on their metrics (unlikely), but there are other things they need to fix about it as well, even mechanically.
I somewhat agree but I still think this current system is far worst, and I think that’ll show itself very shortly in the coming weeks/months, when queues get longer and 500k will be near impossible for the most dominated faction (alliance). It won’t be so different from the previous system where the only people being able to reach that cap without killing themselves would be those part of premades, which will be limited to players with higher rank/ skills. Bot farming spots will be monopolized by a subset of players and the remainder will just have to accept that a higher rank isn’t gonna be feasible. I think those that believe that this system isn’t beneficial to « mafias » and think they can grind 500k ez without talking to anyone will have a reality check pretty soon (on alliance anyway). I 100% agree about the variable cap relative to the population or a metric but ya if anything is gonna change, it’s either a reversion or a different cap per faction? Either way, unlikely any of those things would happen. Besides, given the higher population of alliance, one could argue there’s more potential players to group up with, but oddly enough the alliance pre-made discord is relatively dead in comparison to the horde one.
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I just realized what is gonna happen in the future. They’re gonna do what they did in BC Classic. Make it so Alliance can fight Alliance in BGs, which will reduce the queue times when not enough horde are available, to what I expect will be the same debate that happened at the time.
There is a way to fix it, but this would make the cap faction specific based on a calculated value of how many average hours the development team wants the “grind” to take.
Setting it up this way isn’t hard, they could even establish a mechanism to automatically detect and adapt the cap based on balancing automatically across 3 factors tracked by the system.
- Last week average points gains per hour across the whole of the faction.
- 30 days moving average of points per hour.
- Active PvP participation of both factions as a ratio.
Its a simple problem to fix, and doesn’t take a genius to build.
Got back into raiding returning to era and i think pve is a million times easier to gear and requires literally HALF the time to do it.
Not even half.
I am spending 10 - 12 hours on non-raid days and 8 - 9 hours on raid days grinding honor, trying to get r14 for the healing mace, because it’s the best 1h healing mace prior to AQ40 vs a grand total of maybe 5 hours of raiding a week.
LOOOOOOOOOOL what???
How are you spending 12 hours raiding my guy lol
I would unsub if i had to spend 12 hours any day for any raid at this point. That is craaaazy
You have it backwards.
12 hours pvping.
OH I misread that, I apologize. I was thining wow thats insane. My fault, Good luck with the mace grind!
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No one has actually responded to the most cogent post of this thread.
Blizzard has never outright come out and said 500k is required for progression in Rank 13. They simply said that is the weekly cap.
If you’ve been keeping up with the CP calculations and the number crunching going on, it’s clear the 419k honor should give progression in Rank 13 because the qualified rank for that amount of honor is Rank 13.
The REAL question people should be asking for ALL ranks is: did they intend for the base amount of honor in a given rank to prevent decay to count as one break point in progression for said rank?
As Skrotems is saying, this is the case with every rank. The problem is the lower ranks are fuddled because people are able to gain multiple ranks at lower levels - so the issue seems a lot more magnified at higher ranks.
Isn’t the cap for rank 12 500k tho? Wouldn’t it make sense that higher rank (13) have an equal (or greater) cap than 500k? I think that’s what the OP is referring to
You really think the cap is intended to be 500k then drop LOWER as the rank goes up?
Rank 10: 500k
Rank 11: 500k
Rank 12: 500k
Rank 13: 419k.
You really think that throughout the entire process the honor cap is supposed to go up and up and up then on the last rank drop down?
And rank 11 is 1 week
Rank 12 is 2 weeks
Rank 13 is 3 weeks
Given you start at 0% at each.
Like I said, the real question is did they intend the minimum honor decay to actually give progression?
What is the “minimum honor decay”? That makes no sense.
There is no honor decay at all, so what’s the “minimum”?
Yikes, you might want to re-read the blue post. De-ranking and honor decay are not the same thing. Only the former was removed from the current honor system.