History reminder

WoW Classic Mists of Pandaria Classic Discussion
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https://www.method.gg/raid-history

then it turned into this mostly cuz of belf pallies

https://www.method.gg/raid-history/the-burning-crusade

humans had a good pop in wrath cuz of emfh and other than naxx which no one cared about look at this

https://www.method.gg/raid-history/wrath-of-the-lich-king

still kinda mixed here

https://www.method.gg/raid-history/cataclysm

horde racials went bonkers here

https://www.method.gg/raid-history/mists-of-pandaria

emfh and pre nerf stoneform couldn’t keep things from still being horde dominated cuz of the pve racials we got

https://www.method.gg/raid-history/warlords-of-draenor

world of hordecraft continues and eventually warmode comes in to try to save the day. doesn’t work

https://www.method.gg/raid-history/legion

horde’s perceived better racials and actual better population strikes again

https://www.method.gg/raid-history/battle-for-azeroth

and here are are right at today

https://www.method.gg/raid-history/shadowlands

tell me again how it wasn’t that ally was just as competitive until blizz coddled horde to the point of having an iwin button and the keys to the castle as far as the entire game goes.

edit

you can see the dwarf in this link of method vs rag in vanilla

https://www.engadget.com/2012-11-01-top-guild-method-discuss-their-world-first.html

How’s the faction change working out for you?
Artzie: Reaaaaaaaally nice, the Horde racials are far better than the Alliance ones, thank god we went Horde!
Vailaine: To be honest I don’t think we would have made it on Spiritbinder and Elegon as early as we did. Those kills were so close that the DPS racials give Horde players the edge once again.
Treckie: The faction benefits are hard to quantify, I still think it was a case of “the grass is always greener”, but there’s been close kills this tier, so I guess extra DPS isn’t bad. I’m sure we would have done excellently as Alliance, although most DPSers will say the complete opposite for their DPS racials!

posted this as a comment to someone about 20 minutes ago but realized it should probably be a separate thread. because… well… you can see stuff in real time where the catering to horde ruined the alliance population.

remember folks, all those method world 1sts for 93875934875934854 years would’ve been ALLIANCE world 1sts if it hadn’t been for the racial benefits of faction changing to horde.

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People have this misconception that there’s some sort of Horde vs. Alliance RP rivalry but the reality is that people against HvH BGs are just trying to save the game from becoming retail, where 85% of the PVP playerbase is on Horde. Seriously, try to find decent partners on alliance side, unless you already have a bunch of btags climbing past rival is nearly impossible.

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yep. and it doesn’t just ruin pvp. the entire population shifted to horde so while ally has better pvp racials right now people would be forced to leave a much larger pve community AND pvp community because of shift that happened in MoP. once method switched it was all she wrote. we’re now seeing it again, and again blizz does nothing.

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There’s nothing Blizzard can do. Horde was the dominant faction in Classic Era despite the disadvantage of not having paladins. They’ll be dominant in Wrath Classic as well. You can’t nerf community perception.

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You’re someone that had to go from alliance to horde because of the massive population difference. You know that while they won’t do anything that they should. You’re also ally on classic and it’s about to happen to you again.

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Wasn’t Method the guild that broke up because of accusations of sexual abuse and sexual assault?

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Yep. Their priest. They were the #1 guild in the world for retail for a thousand years though. Limit the guild who is now #1 has said many times they’d go ally except the cost would be like $9000 and it doesn’t seem worth it.

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I honestly don’t know what they can do. I’m not too worried about it in classic. The raids are so simple that I don’t think it matters all that much.

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i said to heck with it. moved all my ally to moonguard and told the wife that i will play this toon but mostly focus on my alliance alts. the reason i’ve been feeling like i cannot escape horde is because all my friends (and wife) are horde4lyfe aotc heroes. they all said they were horde because it was easier to get into good raiding guilds horde side. and it is. honestly, i am so sick of world of hordecraft. but what i like to do is world content, low keys, lfr, maybe clear normal a bit here and there. and unless blizz just removes the alliance from retail they cannot force me to play horde there. essentially, classic lives or dies for me based on what happens with this hvh queue thing. if they do the right thing i’ll use my boost on ally. if not. i’ll uninstall.

i don’t have issues with old school horde players. they’re good people. these people though who are crying so much, are NOT those people.

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Anybody who is that serious about pvp has max level characters on both sides so they can adjust to metas. The types of players that push high rank like that dgaf about what faction they are on, or if they have to shelve a character from one season to the next. They aren’t the players influencing your economies either. This is all old news and part of the reason “git gud” became a mantra in pvp.

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Cool faction imbalance and horde BG queues are separate issues.

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argue against the op. it shows expansion by expansion what happened. you can also google how horde racials changed in MoP which is where the mass exodus really happened. argue against the truth. seems to be your shtick.

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It’s definitely easier to play as horde in retail lol. It’s gotten to the point that I think they should just allow cross-faction play in the current game. I do think that HvH bg’s are coming back in some fashion though. I just don’t believe that Blizzard is going allow those kinds of ques to continue.

Maybe there’s a compromise to be had. Maybe just do it on the weekends or something.

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racials were a mistake

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Why do you need to worry about this so much? What does it validate for you, and why can’t you just be happy to play whatever you want?

This goes for every game. If everything was always perfectly balanced, the game would be extremely boring.

People buff heroes in MOBAs so you play a hero that wasn’t getting played a lot. You can still win with the lower win % heroes consistently though.

They add guns to FPS games for a season and it might be kinda OP, then they remove it. You can still win consistently without using those guns though.

Hunters suck in one expansion and they don’t in another. It’s all to get people to play and try different things, which prolongs the life of the game. You can still manage to get into any guild and do amazing things, or be rank one in PvP if you’re good enough though.

From there, it’s your choice to play a FOTM thing, or play what you genuinely enjoy, but the choice is yours.

Not executing your rotations in PVE absolutely perfectly, or not taking advantage of cooldowns perfectly in PVP are what is holding 99.9% of players back from performing better. Not some racial bonus or the fact that they’re missing one BIS piece of gear.

On a level that is rank one competitive against another rank one contender, yea dude that stuff absolutely matters. But to compare most of us to method players is kinda silly. We just aren’t, and those kind of things that affect them don’t really affect us as much because there are other things we need to perfect that matter way more.

I’m pretty sure if method had 0 racials and 10 less ilvl, they would still destroy the majority of us at any content. Some people are just naturally good at things, and not acknowledging their talent, or suggesting in any way that they’re just good because they FOTM everything is silly.

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They’re related, Horde BG queues are long because of faction imbalance, people stack one side because of perceived benefit/the already compounding faction imbalance, removing the one detriment to the majority faction leaves no reason to play the minority and further reason to play the majority and again compounds imbalance. Horde shouldn’t have to wait in long queues for BGs, but there has to be some alternative that doesn’t force the playerbase to Horde - or at least there should be, but judging by the blue post (which mostly lauded the results of the test), there is a good chance that HvH BGs are here to stay.

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In what way? If every class did similar dps, who would be bored? You’d have more options and less inclination to sticking with meta picks. If factions were equal, you’d have equal choice in which faction to roll on. Parity doesn’t imply stripping differences away, it’s done by levying the advantages/disadvantages that exist to a point nearer to equality.

Having a much smaller PvP player base is not conducive to fun, nor is a smaller M+ playerbase, or a smaller Raiding or dungeon playerbase, Retail or Classic, there is no benefit or enjoyment from being clearly worse off than others. You don’t need to be a top player to care about disparity, everyone feels or can at least intimate the differences they’re subject to, and having disadvantages is not considered fun by almost anyone, there is no good reason to leave some to languish just because finding a solution is difficult.

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