Lordearon was an Alliance loss considering a huge chunk of the army got killed by Sylvanas blowing up the city. War of Thorns was the Alliance just getting it’s teeth kicked in and a huge chunk of the Night Elf population killed off.
When has the Horde ever had that happen at the hands of the Alliance? Never.
Then the Alliance gets a win at Dazar’alor, destroying the Zandalari navy (I don’t consider killing Rastakhan a win because that was the most asinine thing ever. It made ZERO sense to kill him or even assault the city since the goal was to destroy the navy which we did. Not to mention at the time the Zandalari weren’t even a part of the Horde so this win arguably doesn’t count, but we will.)
But literally right after that the Alliance backs off like morons instead of ending the war, and then lose our entire fleet because of Sylvanas’s deal with Azshara.
So really when did the Alliance do anything of significance to the Horde?
You sure didn’t lose a huge chunk of your army or population like the Alliance lost there + in Teldrassil.
Pretty significant for a total of 5 seconds before the Alliance loses their fleet, the entire reason for getting the Kultirans to join, because Sylvanas is a tactical genius and made a deal with Azshara? Wow that is so significant.
None, but where was that Alliance victory shown in-game? We were told via Blizzcon that we won, wow that feels so great just being told you won and not getting to see it. When was the last time the Alliance was shown a genuine win in-game against the Horde that wasn’t hollow? We have never had something that was a definite Alliance victory over Horde in game whereas they get stuff like War of Thorns.
That’s not what I’m asking, I’m essentially saying as I’ve always been saying that blizzard putting people on the path of tunnel visioning one certain character is bad and wrong, because you’re either left
A) Unsatisfied
B) Empty wondering whats next
or
C) Move on to what ever was related to them ( In this case it’s only a matter of time before Sylvanas is used as an argument for going after the Forsaken/ Horde)
I don’t appreciate the idea that because someone teamed up or sided with Sylvanas they should be thrown to the wolves by the Horde, or just left to fend for themselves when the alliance come.
Really paints an even worse light for the Horde, that when things get tough we’ll use you as a escape goat and leave you.
Did you ever think that maybe I don’t want an out? I don’t wanna throw my Race Leader under the bus because blizzard forced a stupid path on her and the Horde.
You’re essentially asking me to throw away a character I’ve had for 15 years to appease people who don’t even like her, and for what really? We all disliked BFA, We all Lost something in BFA, I’m saying as a Forsaken Player I’d rather not lose the one Major character that has been a staple for the Forsaken since it’s inception.
But those who did were complicit in her actions and thus should be held responsible… she committed genocide dude.
This is just crappy writing on Blizzard’s part, but it is the only way they can write these hamfisted stories unless they plan on removing the Horde as a faction which is basically impossible since it is a playable faction.
That’s on you though. It has been obvious even going back to Vanilla WoW that Sylvanas has never cared about the Horde and was only using them out of convenience. It was only a matter of time until she just said screw you I don’t need you guys.
The focus on the Whole Horde, because we all know everyone helped her up until she called everyone stupid.
Seems pretty stupid to say Bob was a Loyalist and was for the cause while I Mike was just looking for the right time to strike and betray her even though up until now we had both been helping her and her cause.
There have been various pieces of material that shows she could of gone either way, and one persons villain is another persons hero.
Legion/ BFA Cinematic for a recent piece that shows how heroic she is throwing herself into conflict when she didn’t need too, using her precious resources to save others etc.
People tend to not care much if their leader does bad things to others while you and your people receive nothing but benefits from it, Looking at Eyir, many don’t care all that much if it meant a huge buff to the Forsaken and them essentially becoming Death Rangers.
Others see it as bad because “You’re wasting a potential ally” When in truth it’s because “We don’t honestly care about Odyn and his Valk, but we don’t trust you and will lowkey stop you from gaining power if we can”
Yeah that is because Blizzard’s dogcrap writing. Like I said, realistically the Alliance should dismantle the Horde and force them to be separated to never have contact again because they clearly fall into genocidal tendencies at the drop of a hat.
This writing blows for Horde fans, but for whatever reason Blizzard goes there. Which is why I am having some suspension of disbelief in my scenario and saying that only those directly loyal to Sylvanas and were apart of the War of Thorns and Burning of Teldrassil should be held responsible. This way not the entire Horde gets punished.
No this was because Sylvanas planned on enslaving Eyir to have unlimited Val’kyr thus making her essentially immortal and as we all know that isn’t good because Sylvanas is and always has done really sketchy and arguably evil stuff so allowing her to be immortal is bad for everyone.
If I recall correctly, the current canon (until / if it gets retconned) is that Sylvanas really was doing it for the sake of keeping the forsaken going. It was mentioned in BtS, the population knows about it, and they didn’t approve of how she was trying to go about helping them.
Granted, she’s had internal monologue retconned before so it’s just a matter of time to see if this actually holds.
I’m saying the Entire Horde should be punished, or else it’s just a beat for beat retread of MoP, and again leaves the door open for future issues.
Oh Talanji is doing something against the Alliance? Well let’s just say these are her Loyalist and turn against her and you’ll let us go free right?
If WoW was realistic we would have joined forces long before Legion honestly.
Immortality doesn’t mean you can’t be killed or locked away permanently, and as a Horde player nah it would of been good if all the other Forsaken could get a buff like Nathanos did, while at the same time giving other Horde forces a massive breather.
Also again, you and others don’t and never did care about Eyir and Odyn you just care that Sylvanas may get stronger from doing what she was trying to do and want to stop it, even if the pro’s outweighed the cons in my eyes.
That’s BTS for you, Golden writing the Forsaken back into the “We hate our life and existence, how dare Sylvanas want to keep this nation going.”
I get to hear about how I’m less than or a worse because I happen to be a “brown” person, I don’t need to be told that I’m horrible because I happen to be a horde fan as well. I got into wow and the horde because of the Tauren. There is almost never native american representations in entertainment, especially in video games back in 04. I am not a bad person for wanting to play as the side that happens to loosely pull from the cultures of my rl ancestors.
You are right, those incidents of a player getting attacked were aweful and ridiculous and in no way should be tolerated, but that is not indicative of the hundreds of thousands of horde fans. That is if there are that many left. Bfa was disastrous to the horde.
I and many other horde players have said this ever since bfa prepatch, whether you believe or acknowledge it is irrelevant, because It is true. It sucks that blizzard screwed over night elves so bad this xpac. Blizz made a massive mistake and I still feel they need to make some sort of public apology (if they haven’t already). Neither myself or any other horde player or fan should have to apologize, or owe you one for WoT and the burning. I had no say in what blizzard put in the game. As someone who’s heritage comes from a people who suffered a real modern genoside I would have never let that get in game if I had any say in the decision.
As for all those Toxic posters rubbing it in. You need to thicken that skin or yours. Its the internet, people will troll. Its stupid of them, they shouldn’t do it, they are garbage. It doesn’t matter if its wow, a sports ball team, or politcs, they get off on getting under peoples skin from the safety of their keyboard. Guess what? its going to happen. They are trying to get a rise out of other people and you are falling right into it. They thrive off this salt, stop giving it to them.
For that, the Horde would have to be wiped out, all Horde lands taken by the Alliance and all horde souls tortured in the maw. Also the Hprde would have to be ignored afterwards.
Tyrande killing Sylvanas and Nathanos and freeing all of her people from the maw would have been fine.
Also getting Ashenvale back and a new home. All of those things were denied and the Night Elf revenge plot cancelled entirely.
We’re even told that genocide isn’t evil. Imagine if the Alliance wiped out every single Horde man, woman and child and were glorified as heroes for that too, just like Sylvanas.
That’s what would make things even, but I have yet to see a single person ask for that. We just want some justice.
Maybe. But there is this peculiar moment that initially to get Sylvanas back it took 1 val’kyr. 2nd time it required 3 of them. So, unless it’s a mistake of the dev team, they can no longer do this part of the pact. Probably Sylvanas learned about it in the same event after which she learned about the ritual that was used to boost Nathanos. The ritual, which val’kyr kept as a secret from Sylvanas, just like a couple other things.
I can’t say about others, but I personally do not care about Sylvanas. Not about what’s going to happen with her, not about what she wants, etc. The only Sylvanas related part I would want to see is the story from the perspective of the dark val’kyrs.
A minor note about how I see them
What they were looking for:
We hunger for our freedom, as you once hungered for yours.
What they got:
Sylvanas glanced at the implacable visage of the ghostly battle maiden. “It is an arduous endeavor, one they are reluctant to undertake. Without the Lich King’s energies feeding them, I believe it requires a portion of their own essence to succeed.” She turned toward him. "But it is my desire, so it will be done."
The Val’kyr knelt in one corner. The creature, who had seemed so immense and implacable, now appeared small and defenseless.
Amusement laced her voice, but he sensed delight in it as well. Was she pleased that the mighty Val’kyr had been bent to her will, or was she simply relishing the acquisition of a new toy?
So, yeah. I just have some sympathy to them specifically and would want to see them free from the pact, maybe have their moment of hope. But who knows what are the plans of the devs.
No responce to my earlier post? Am I horrible for playing horde because it acknowledges my rl heritage? Or does this go against your claim that horde players are just inherently bad people and thats why they play horde?
I take no responsibility for the actions of others. I never at any point glorified those events. I have voiced, for years now, how horrible blizzards decision to go that route was. You are ridiculous for blaming the entire horde playerbase.
At this point you are just spouting hate speech. Claiming an entire group is “savage” and “inherently violent” as you have insinuated with your “evidence” is exactly what oppressive hateful bigots do regularly. And your doing it over a videogame. How privileged your life must be that THIS is what you have to get up in arms about. All the real terrible things going on and its teldrasil you have to try and avenge. Grow up.
A game development group wrote a bad story that completely missed its mark, life goes on. Literally no one was hurt. There are real genocides going on right now, how about you turn w/e this rage is to something constructive and do something for those victims.
That’s a real loosly defined number that you have no actual evidence of.
now?