High Elf POSITIVITY Thread 😎

[Sibbja-sargeras]

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

But at a council structure the leader may have some additional powers, but is not usually authorized to seize complete power

We don’t have any way of knowing what the power dynamic is, within the Council of Six, but seeing as not a single member spoke about it in the aftermath (excepting Jaina, herself) suggests they were more than willing to permit their elected leader… lead.

(It’s also worth noting, the Kirin Tor turning a blind eye to perceived slights is, and has always been, the reason why Rommath distrusts them. There is precedent.)

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

especially imprisoning and attacking another member of the council, that’s more in the area of a coup, or other abuse of power.

It’d hardly be considered an abuse of power to arrest someone directly linked with a terrorist organization. As far as a coup, well, you’re going to have a doozy of a time explaining that one.

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

And the President cannot pass laws or set a budget, or arrest the Speaker.

The POTUS can’t, but it seems that whoever leads the Council of Six can do all of those things.

@Aesimel-kirin-tor

I thought the six were a democracy?

It’s technically most similar to an oligarchy, with one above the rest (to what extent, we don’t know).

The biggest piece of irony is that when the rest of the Council were leveling their arguments for why Jaina should be their leader, Aethas Sunreaver gave an eloquent speech about her proneness to being fair and just.

@Renotarshil-malganis

There you go again, asking for proof of something that has been public knowledge since Mists of Pandaria’s Purge of Dalaran.

Then it shouldn’t be too hard for you to prove.

@Renotarshil-malganis

If I was shifting the focus away, I would be talking about something completely different but the same subject matter has remained which has been the Purge of Dalaran and your knowledge (or lack of) regarding the SC.

This response, in itself, is a shifting of the goalposts – it’s a flagrant refusal to corroborate your own assertions. For shame.

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

True, but as Fyor was arguing that the SC were acting lawfully based on the traditional power structure of Dalaran, I’m raising the point that it’s not even legal in Dalaran, so even that level of justification for bad actions isn’t available to them.

You’ve got some way to corroborate this, I presume?

@Snowsong-fizzcrank

Except she provides the player with an item that will prevent the dragonhawks from flying without harming them, but despite that suggests murdering them in cold blood for absolutely no reason anyway. That’s not someone just “following” orders, that’s someone killing, for the sake of killing.

I’ve not once argued that Vereesa doesn’t behave despicably, throughout the Purge of Dalaran, but rather that the Silver Covenant is merely operating as an extension of the Kirin Tor – and as the Kirin Tor are the law, in Dalaran, there wasn’t any law broken.

This is made especially clear when not a single member of the Silver Covenant was ever reprimanded, incarcerated, or otherwise indicated to have done any wrong.

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

Think it’s more “What do you mean you won’t leave as ordered? Are you resisting arrest?”

You could always comply?

[Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood (Tarrok)]

@Sibbja-sargeras

You could always comply?

I’d much rather some people didn’t jump straight to ethnic cleansing when someone undoes a certain someone’s continued feigned neutrality and blows up a hostile military base with the weapon the so called neutral group gave to one side of a war.

[Sibbja-sargeras]

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

I’d much rather some people didn’t jump straight to ethnic cleansing when someone undoes a certain someone’s continued feigned neutrality and blows up a hostile military base with the weapon the so called neutral group gave to one side of a war.

That’s all well and good, but actions have consequences.

If you tell a police officer where he can shove the ticket, maybe he writes another – maybe he rips you out of the cap, looses a couple of your teeth on the pavement, and then writes another.

The Sunreavers tried to call a bluff, but didn’t realize it wasn’t a bluff.

[Midare-area-52 (Midare)]

You know… when you said this earlier:

@Sibbja-sargeras

You’ve concluded this how? I’ve maintained, for years, that the High Elves would be made infinitely better if they leaned into their bitterness – I’d rather see High Elves out here being petty, more Purge of Dalaran, than being unicorn-riding pacifists.

I knew that sooner or later you would prove me right by trying to justify things to make them seem “not as bad”…

@Sibbja-sargeras

I’ve not once argued that Vereesa doesn’t behave despicably, throughout the Purge of Dalaran, but rather that the Silver Covenant is merely operating as an extension of the Kirin Tor – and as the Kirin Tor are the law, in Dalaran, there wasn’t any law broken.

And here you are, justifiying murder because “muh law”.

But sure, I have absolutely no reason to say that you love to bend over backwards and jump through hoops to try to maintain this illusionary moral superiority of the High Elves. Anything negative has a perfectly “logical” explanation in your head.

But go ahead and keep telling yourself you want them to lean into their bitterness, because even if they did, you’d still find ways to call that righteous.

[Sibbja-sargeras]

@Midare-area-52

I knew that sooner or later you would prove me right by trying to justify things to make them seem “not as bad”…

They’re plenty bad, but the point isn’t about morality – it’s about legality.

I’m sorry you can’t differentiate between the two?

[Midare-area-52 (Midare)]

And as usual, you keep moving the goalpost you yourself set up.

It was impressive the first two times, now, it’s just a regular monday.

[Sibbja-sargeras]

@Midare-area-52

And as usual, you keep moving the goalpost you yourself set up.

Which goalposts have moved, pray tell?

[Renotarshil-malganis (Renotarshil)]

@Sibbja-sargeras

Then it shouldn’t be too hard for you to prove.

I don’t have to prove the obvious. Once again this is just like demanding proof the earth isn’t round. It’s silly Flat Earther logic for something obvious and well known around the world. Choosing to ignore reality (which you’ve done on many occasions) doesn’t change the obvious.

@Sibbja-sargeras

This response, in itself, is a shifting of the goalposts

No it is not. We are still talking about the same subject matter. Keep up, kiddo.

[Midare-area-52 (Midare)]

@Sibbja-sargeras

Which goalposts have moved, pray tell?

I’m not about to point out the glaring inconsistencies in your drivel, I’m having a rough night and if I go off, I’d leave you sobbing.

[Renotarshil-malganis (Renotarshil)]

@Sibbja-sargeras

If you tell a police officer where he can shove the ticket, maybe he writes another – maybe he rips you out of the cap, looses a couple of your teeth on the pavement, and then writes another.

Imagine thinking this is justified in 2020.

[Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood (Tarrok)]

@Sibbja-sargeras

actions have consequences.

Yes.

When you break neutrality to give a powerful weapon to historically the most xenophobic and aggressive member of the alliance, the other side is not going to be happy. So don’t whine about how someone else ‘broke’ the neutrality rule when you flaunt it all the time.

If you want your fortified port to be considered peaceful and neutral, don’t use it to stage an actual invasion of the neighbors you want to treat you well.

If you’re going to use the slightest pretext to commit atrocities gleefully, don’t whine when people say they are atrocities.

@Sibbja-sargeras

The Sunreavers

aside from a possible handful, as many of the blood elves involved were not sunreavers, didn’t do squat. That didn’t stop the group formed for the sole purpose to oppose them being in Dalaran from going all murdery on them though.

[Grabbag-barthilas]

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

I’d much rather some people didn’t jump straight to ethnic cleansing when someone undoes a certain someone’s continued feigned neutrality

Jaina was literally breaking neutrality the whole time, the whole thing was an excuse.

[Midare-area-52 (Midare)]

@Grabbag-barthilas

Jaina was literally breaking neutrality the whole time, the whole thing was an excuse.

Dalaran broke neutrality the instant they sent aid to Theramore.

[Grabbag-barthilas]

Jaina started an ethnic cleansing to punish the Sunreavers for “being involved” in a theft of Darnassus via Dalaran. The Horde ran the theft through Dalaran because it was the only way to bypass the magical defences Jaina had added to Darnassus, breaking neutrality.

Her own reasoning makes no sense.

[Sibbja-sargeras]

@Renotarshil-malganis

I don’t have to prove the obvious.

So, it’s just headcanon then.

@Midare-area-52

I’m not about to point out the glaring inconsistencies in your drivel, I’m having a rough night and if I go off, I’d leave you sobbing.

You seem to have these fairly regularly, might consider sorting your life out before weaseling your way into discussions with valueless commentary.

@Renotarshil-malganis

Imagine thinking this is justified in 2020.

I didn’t once say it was justified, but it is certainly one of many ways the interaction could go. Pick your battles.

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

When you break neutrality to give a powerful weapon to historically the most xenophobic and aggressive member of the alliance, the other side is not going to be happy. So don’t whine about how someone else ‘broke’ the neutrality rule when you flaunt it all the time.

This is you inching towards an “in all fairness” comparison of events, which is irrelevant – sometimes actions have consequences, and in this particular instance, the consequences were severe.

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

That didn’t stop the group formed for the sole purpose to oppose them being in Dalaran from going all murdery on them though.

It’s stated, in-game, that the Sunreavers took up their weapons first and resolved to occupy their portion of the city regardless of any lawful order – those handful of shopkeepers and bankers are merely collateral damage, in a conflict that was started and stoked by the Sunreavers.

@Grabbag-barthilas

Jaina was literally breaking neutrality the whole time, the whole thing was an excuse.

@Midare-area-52

Dalaran broke neutrality the instant they sent aid to Theramore.

More than likely, that doesn’t make anything the Silver Covenant did illegal.

[Elyssaria-kargath]

@Avarie-farstriders

I am suffering from indecisiveness

Me too! I lvled my pally to 60… stopped to lvl Ely and then just stuck with it and even wasted time getting soul ash and what not… only to turn around to start liking my hunter. I realized after having horrendous dps in my guilds raid as fury warr and checking out the forums… that fury just sucks. Lol

[Midare-area-52 (Midare)]

@Sibbja-sargeras

You seem to have these fairly regularly, might consider sorting your life out before weaseling your way into discussions with valueless commentary.

Funny how this could apply to you too.

Maybe don’t forget your meds next time you post.

[Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood (Tarrok)]

@Sibbja-sargeras

This is you inching towards an “in all fairness” comparison of events, which is irrelevant – sometimes actions have consequences, and in this particular instance, the consequences were severe.

I’m not the one cheerleading fictional characters slaughtering innocent people because their cunning plans backfired.

[Renotarshil-malganis (Renotarshil)]

@Sibbja-sargeras

So, it’s just headcanon then.

The events of the Purge of Dalaran are not headcanon.

@Sibbja-sargeras

valueless commentary.

You’d know all about valueless commentary… and lack of lore knowledge.

@Sibbja-sargeras

but it is certainly one of many ways the interaction could go.

Given your behavior and preferences, we all know how you want it to go.

[Sibbja-sargeras]

@Midare-area-52

Funny how this could apply to you too.

I’ve not spent numerous days coming up with justification after justification for why I can’t corroborate anything I’ve suggested.

“Oh, it’s hot.”
“Oh, I’m tired.”
“Oh, rough day.”

@Tarrok-thorium-brotherhood

I’m not the one cheerleading fictional characters slaughtering innocent people because their cunning plans backfired.

Is this sentence supposed to have meaning?

@Renotarshil-malganis

The events of the Purge of Dalaran are not headcanon.

The SC existing solely to maim or murder Blood Elves, however, is.