Typical to form on here, abilities not working as original classic…
Hemorrhage is supposed to : be an instant strike that increases physical damage dealt to the target by up to 3 (5 and 7 for rank 2 and 3 respectively). It lasts 30 charges or 15 sec, and awards 1 combo point. It has no cool-down.
Instead, it only increases physical HITS against the target, this is 100% not working as original where Rupture and Garrote are physical damage based attacks which TICK/DEAL PHYSICAL DAMAGE meaning they should be removing a Hemorrhage counter and applying the bonus to each tick of damage from Garrote and Rupture.
additional problems for Hemo…:
From my personal testing it looks like if Hemorrhage is applied to a target, Reapplying/hitting a new Hemorrhage does not remove a stack from the previous application before applying a fresh 30 counter
(Verified by Hemo spam with only 1 weap on and Hemo hitting for lower than what is possible for min dmg + hemo mod) while hemo is active on the target. (would be easier to visibly see with R3 hemo if anyone out there wants to try it)
Additional info, the calculation for Hemorrhage attack was:
((AP/14)*Weapon speed)+ Weapon Damage and on a crit is is multiplied by 2.3 if you have the lethality talent to increase critical strike damage by 30%
This looks an awful lot like a copy paste job from current BFA or whatever garbo version they created the classic servers/calcs from.
From my testing @ over 400+ ticks for damage Ticks from Garrote/Rupture/poisons (dot and instant) I saw only 1 crit on an instant poison(likely a parse error) which leads me to believe all 4 of these damage systems may not be able to crit at all atm.
TL:DR (Do not try to use a Hemo build til this is fixed or you will be severely disappointed in yourself and findings)
I don’t remember hemo ever increasing bleed damage until later expansions where it specifically increased bleed damage, nor do I remember garrote or rupture dots ever critting. Are you sure you’re not mistaken here?
Very certain, I had an entire build based around these mechanics back in classic when I played rogue.
I’m pretty confident there were no dot crits until, like, WotLK at a minimum, maybe even Casualclysm. That was sorta the point. Trading guaranteed damage over time from Rupture for spiky and unpredictable (lol cold blood) damage from Eviscerate.
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Evis is not unpredictable with cold blood, 100% crit rate is 100%… Rupture cannot crit in total, only a tick had a chance to crit making it overall ALWAYS a lower maximum damage potential vs Evis esp with coldblood usage.
Even if you want to consider a miss of evis coldblood which could happen, you can also miss your rupture hit just as well and rupture takes TIME to do it’s damage as opposed to evis hence why it had the chance to crit on it’s ticks
Yeah okay you’re making the mistake of believing you’re being persecuted when you’re being contradicted. Take about 20-30% off there buddy.
I was joking that spiky and unpredictable use of Eviscerate doesn’t exist because you can guarantee it’ll crit with cold blood.
For my money, crits on ticks started when spell damage got conglomerated in WotLK, or possibly later still, so that they could homogenise stat weightings on gear and classes like Aff. Warlocks or Priests could use the same gear as a Mage or Dest. Warlock. Prior to then, dots were what they were.
I 100% did not play a rogue ever after Nax came out the first time so your confidence on this is completely unfounded and incorrect.
(Patch_3.3.3) (2010-03-23):** The damage-over-time component of this ability can now produce critical strikes.
- Rupture patch notes. Now I’M triggered by your attitude. Can’t believe I just spent all this time getting trolled.
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DOTS didn’t crit till WotLK, even then most didn’t crit without talents.
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Okay let’s say you’re accurate in the suspicion that they hadn’t broken the ability for Rupture to crit @ some point after 2 further expansions of patches while all other dmging attacks crit “magically” somehow; you’re still skipping Garrote while also you are all still skipping over 1/2 of my post, which is that Hemo is not modifiying itself or Garrote or Rupture ! Also no 1 has even tried to touch on poisons not critting atm as well.
This was what I recalled, too, based on my experience with my warlock.
do any dots crit in vanilla? I thought that wasn’t until later expansions.
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Congrats on ppl yet again making references to not this class on how it functioned as opposed to the one I’m talking about. Again, if you really want to go down this path and say dots never crit, then you are sorely mistaken. Let’s do what you all love to do, reference other classes! Ice mage revolves around the hopes and dreams to get crits on their aoe dot spell all day every day.
At the end of the thread, you all still want to run down the side path which may not be a bug, whilst ignoring the main point here; THERE IS CERTAINLY A BUG IN HEMO.
Hemo in relation to itself, garrote, and rupture is 100% broken, and even if dot’s don’t crit they are still modifiable. I’m also still not convinced from all your attempts to call me a heretic about dots that there isn’t a bug in poisons too as since instant poison isn’t a dot, I believe it should be and used to crit.
I’m asking for this information to be investigated hence the bug report, i’m not asking for your census on what you believed to be true after 15 years of changes, it’s likely we have all made a mistake trying to recall things Esp when you’re trying to target a specific point in time and be accurate to that and not your current or more recent experiences on your level 1000 chars.
Maybe you should edit the original post and take out the dots critting?
Just wanna point out, blizzard is a channeled spell, not a DoT
Yeah dude sounds like you’re massively misremembering.
“Am I out of touch? No. It is the children who are wrong.”
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You are misremembering how Hemo worked in Vanilla. Hemo never increased the damage of Garrote or Rupture. It was always on physical attacks even though the talent says “physical damage”. The only talent that directly increased Rupture damage was Serrated Blades and the only talent that directly increased Garrote damage was Opportunity.
Now as for Hemo not applying damage increases to itself being bugged, you may be right, I haven’t had time to test it, but the bleed portion of your argument is null as that’s never how it worked. It’d be better to see your combat logs though showing that Hemo isn’t doing increased damage as stacks are applied and it’s just a visual bug that it’s not going from 30 to 29 before going back to 30.
I’m so glad you people are so adamant about being correct that you want to modify someone elses statements post facto about Dots never being able to crit when clearly Mage’s Blizzard is able to CRIT. (THERE’S NO 1 DENYING IT, IT’S A FACT.)
My point stands clearly, don’t say 1 thing when in fact the general consensus is WRONG and easily provable to be wrong even if it’s a channeled spell you Dimwits. If you want to troll; take it out of the bug reports forum, i’m not here to argue about what you believe accurate in your memories either, I’m Asking blizzard to do their job and look into a bug report.
As for my logs I did not keep them; this bug request would be seriously easy to repeat by blizzard with the information I provided using a logger, R3 hemo, and a single weapon in hand. (5 mins tops for HEMO NOT APPLYING TO SUBSEQUENT HEMO HITS.)
Trying to nitpick this bug report about this and that or that wont work, IS WORTHLESS HERE. It’s Blizzards job to determine what is functioning correctly or not Based upon 1.12 SCRIPTS AND LOGS FOR DAMAGE FORMULAS AND EXECUTION OF SAID FORMULAS INTERNALLY (Now vs then), not your memories.
MY Statements Still Stand;
I BELIEVE THERE ARE BUG’S HERE RELATED TO::
HEMO NOT APPLYING TO SUBSEQUENT HEMO STRIKES WHILE HEMO IS ACTIVE
HEMO MODIFIERS NOT APPLYING TO GARROTE OR RUPTURE
RUPTURE AND GARROTE FAILING TO HAVE A CHANCE TO CRIT ON TICK DAMAGE
POISONS FAILING TO CRIT (INSTANT OR DOT FORM)
It must be hard to be so blatantly wrong that you are the only person on your own side. At this point you’re just trolling. Trying to claim Blizzard is a DoT is absolutely ridiculous. Channeled spells are not DoTs. DoTs cannot crit.
Your points
1.HEMO NOT APPLYING TO SUBSEQUENT HEMO STRIKES WHILE HEMO IS ACTIVE
- this is potentially legit, but not going back and testing again to provide logs is hindering what you’re trying to prove in your bug report.
- HEMO MODIFIERS NOT APPLYING TO GARROTE OR RUPTURE
- They never did in Vanilla. Not once. Not ever.
3.RUPTURE AND GARROTE FAILING TO HAVE A CHANCE TO CRIT ON TICK DAMAGE
- Same as above, these DoT ticks do not crit.
- POISONS FAILING TO CRIT (INSTANT OR DOT FORM)
- Instant poison does crit. Deadly poison will never crit.
While it may be Blizzard’s job to look into bug reports, it’s on you as the reporter to bring accurate reports and not " what you believe accurate in your memories either".
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you act to be the superficial go to source for everyone’s answers while blizzard does not see you that way, hence why you’re not a blue poster or contributing meaningful information.
Rather you would care to act like you are the god of all things rogue from classic and but in reality you are a completely unverified and un-vetted source spouting information which no one here is able to verify accurately other than the blizzard team themselves by comparing and testing formulas and calcs now to how it acted back then.
I did not build a rogue specifically in vanilla based around rupture garrote and hemo without crit potential. I played the super rare build over a year, it was enjoyable, though you may try to reference information that you see from some update in wotlk, you have severely overlooked the fact that several years of changes which went unreported on your 3rd party sites. Abilities that could crit lost it, some gained it, some spells gained dot’s some may have lost them. COOKIE YOU DO NOT KNOW ALL THIS MISSING INFO.
Additionally, after reviewing your reply history to multiple threads, you look like a fella that likes to act a know it all. So, congratulations on providing a total garbage attitude towards this community. In turn you give more reasons for people to leave than stay. Maybe someday you will realize that your know it all attitude towards a game and it’s community pushes people to leave and damages the games reputation. People learn to avoid others like you, in games and in real life, Wow developers know this and tailored each expansion to slowly remove the toxic behavior and attitude from the game with each expansion and ultimately lost almost it’s entire playerbase to these attempts at corrective action.
Summary, Cookie you are helping to kill wow just as much as BFA killed itself.
So thanks but no thanks to your attitude and unverified and un-vetted information, id rather leave it as simple as this for the blizzard team, there are possibly multiple bug’s related to hemo and ability interactions with hemo along with certain rogue abilities relationship to critical strike chance.