wow has only gotten more casual every expansion.
no you didn’t need to do that 12 ap world quest every day in bfa you just couldn’t help yourself
Define casual player 1st
This new dungeon isn’t broken up. If I were to PUG it would it not be a 2 hour or longer (depending on gear and skill) commitment to complete? Otherwise what are the odds of getting that same group back together to finishing it in a staggered experience over multiple sessions?
Gunna blow your mind right here chief
You can, make friends with people, and group with them again at later times
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Yes, its a megadungeon.
And it will be broken up shortly in the future.
You have the option of doing it with friends/guildies. But if you dont, then yeah. You wont get the same group back together, but that is a consequence of the actions you take for wanting to participate in a SMALL SLIVER of WoW content.
If you dont have 2 hours (which it wont need 2 hours after people learn the dungeon), and you dont have friends/guildies/a community because you dont want to join one…then you deal with the consequences.
Not every single bit of content needs to be watered down for the solo/non social player. Who will ironically complain that people arent social in their groups at a later time.
You can definitely play how much or as little as you like.
i would say they have abandoned the rpg element more than anything, they want you to spend most of your time chasing a dumb timer in instance play.
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What is the alternative that existed before m+?
“Not playing at all”?
Specifically, what RPG element that was abandoned did they previously want you to spend most of your time doing?
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Here, I can TLDR the entire comment chain you’re participating in, rather than take things out of context and make your own arguments.
Thanks for the input.
A sliver of content deemed “casual-unfriendly” because casual players apparently “dont have friends”…
is once again not WoW abandoning casual players.
Indeed, I don’t disagree with you. In fact I had a well thought out response to the topic that you may or may not agree with.
Read it or don’t, your call.
But it felt like you were taking my replies to a different conversation out of context, so I wanted to clear it up.
The casual playerbase of wow is just the epitome of “will find a cause or complaint no matter what Blizzard does”.
If the megadungeon didn’t have a quest tied to it and was just dungeon content, it would be a complaint about there being no story or added quest content in the patch.
They add a quest to it that has story, but now it’s that you can’t manage to at some point in the entire content patch, sit down and run the dungeon.
When things are added to LFD tool, they are “ruining community”. When it isn’t added to it, it’s “too hard to find a group”.
Only if something is added that offers maximum reward for minimal effort are you happy. It’s the wow version of the participation trophy kids.
I’m here for it, it’s amusing as hell.
edit: plenty of casual players, I’m sure, aren’t like this. The vocal minority of Karens, however, are wild.
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See, I think WoW is a great game for a diverse audience because it tries so hard to give a diverse audience something to do.
Pet battles, varying tiers of raiding and group content, world content, pvp, etc.
You could argue WoW attempts to do the jack of all trades, master of none. I think other games may do specific areas of content better. But I think WoW’s strength has been attempting to give a diverse audience something to do.
Instance content gets some of the least work done to it. The “M+ player”, for example, has 1/2 of his content being recycled older dungeons.
Whereas we constantly get new world areas to explore, and a new raid tier, there has actually been 0 new m+ content since release. M+ has not had a new dungeon for M+ released yet.
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It does try. Dragonflight legit feels like they are trying and I do not envy their difficulty here, because they have to find a sweetspot that I don’t know exists. They have people like me who were leveling altoholics and story chasers without a robust leveling system to really fall back on anymore, so I’m waiting for something to take its place.
But I’m here, subscribed, because I like what they’re doing. I enjoy the game (when friggen story isn’t locked behind challenging organized group content!) enough. I just don’t really have many reasons to log in. No real upkeep, nothing really driving goals unless that goal is to get into an entirely unrelated aspect of the game than what I enjoy.
I’m the other side of M+ casuals and raid casuals who don’t want to leave their instances. I don’t want to go into their organized group systems to get my story. I’ll hit LFD and LFR if I must, but that’s not really my focus. I just want to quest, have a nice RPG experience, and complete some story chains as a world-playing casual.
I don’t want them to stop investing in the content you enjoy, I just (like many others), want to not feel like I have to participate in something I don’t particularly enjoy. That’s mostly my contribution in regard to this megadungeon and raid stories. I see no reason not to release the LFD version at the same time as the mythic version if they want to lock the story continuation in there.
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I don’t think that WoW has “abandoned” casual players, but I do think that the game’s barrier-to-entry/re-entry has become too convoluted.
As a great example, a good friend who I’ve played WoW with on-and-off since BC or so wanted to get back into the game. He used a free boost to level his character back up most of the way, and then we had envisioned us blowing through some outdoor content and/or leveling in dungeons to get his character up the rest of the way as quickly as possible. That’s basically how we would have done it in the older days.
Instead, he got stuck in the scripted intro quest-chain that just took forever (many hours). He was phased, so I had no ability to help him or even have our characters be together in-game during this quest chain. Party Sync didn’t work. So any time he had a question about where he was supposed to go in order to complete part of a quest or whatever, there was basically nothing I could do to help him. It absolutely destroyed his enthusiasm and motivation to get back into the game. He ended up giving up before he ever completed the quest chain.
I understand that this is the same quest chain that we all went through at the beginning of the expansion, but there is a difference between doing it at the beginning of the expansion when everyone else is also doing it, and being stuck doing it by yourself when all you really want is to be able to jump in the game and play with your friend(s).
WoW has made some nice common-sense changes lately, such as allowing Horde and Alliance characters to do some content together, even be in guilds together. Maybe it’s now also time to acknowledge that 99.9% of the game occurs at max level. Get rid of unnecessary barriers that new or returning players have to go through before they can play with existing players. Give players the option to start at max level with a full set of green gear (that can be upgraded to blue gear), so that they can play with friends right away, and let them do the RP quests if/whenever they want to, or even not at all.
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The larger issue here (to me) is that party sync didn’t work.
If that is fixed to work as it should, seems like the rest of the complaint goes away.
That’s a whole lot of people. I can enjoy one thing and see someone I agree with other things on openly hate it. Like AP. I was the weirdo that really enjoyed AP. I liked Island Expeditions, I liked Horrific Visions, etc…
I didn’t complain about any of those because, man, I was playing them. But other people hated them. And I’m sure those people and I had threads that we both either hated the same thing or we were silent about a complaint because we actually enjoyed it.
This is the way of large groups of people, my dude.
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nah these complaints are not from the casual player base, these complaints are from the single players that refuse to engage current and/or grouped content.
I am a casual player as is most of the people I play with, we have no problems playing this game and the content is fully catered to casual play and has been for a while now.
It’s apparent looking in most threads, what we have here on the forums is just doomers complaining they can’t get carried by those that actually play the game, nothing more.
They use terms like gatekept and elitist to describe the rest of us… that simply used group tool and pug’s it all with the millions of others.
In another thread, The argument was they can’t find a group, then finally after 100 posts they revealed they are only looking for groups for old S1stuff at odd hours, or S2 release stuff now 9 weeks old that the majority have played out by now, have all the rewards and it offers us nothing, then they argue because of this, it should all be nerfed so they can solo it.
All these disease players want is to ruin the game into a single player console game, which isn’t WoW’s concept or design. The single player portion is there, but it’s a portion, the actual meat and core of the game is group play.
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I use to love running dungeons, but once M+ came out I pretty much only raid. I think content is pretty good for the super casual solo player because they added a lot of nice world content, but for us people who just like the social game experience it has gotten pretty bad.
There is more to it than me and almost all of my friends avoiding M+ because the timer makes it prone to toxicity. Just by M+ existing messes up our guild runs because why wait all week for the raid to pop when they can just farm stuff on the side that is better than the raid normal and hard mode gear?
That and the power curve is insane in this game. +10 ilvl and you might as well just go on follow mode because of the performance delta. The sad part is I have no idea how to fix it either. I want there to be content for the sweats and us social players.
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You realize that raids have timers too…right?