Hamstring Reduces the Proc Rate of Nightfall in 2020

They don’t have the GCD issue, but they have around half the proc rate and you don’t get that many instants to make up the difference.

You have to be careful with your GCDs with frost oil as well.

If it’s so obvious there is a flag in the database for this, why did you not see it the first time, why did you come to the false conclusion about how it worked and is there a chance that you’ve missed something when referring to the reference client when fixing any previous bugs or changes.


Ever have those moments where you think “it can’t be that simple can it, no there must be something more” When it was in fact, just that simple.

Things happen, I appreciate them owning up to their mistakes and giving us more I sight.


They do not.

Too bad my Paladin can’t use either, and my Druid rather uselessly is stuck in caster form if I want to be effective.

Get thee to Scarlet Monastery!!

I was under the impression frost oil 100% works in cat form. Cat has a fast attack speed too, so we’d be relatively useful just ignoring our action bar on viscidus.


That would be news to me since it is a temporary enchant applied to a weapon we don’t actually use, kinda like how Weightstones don’t us any good and other weapon based procs like Hand of Ragnaros don’t work in forms either.

Did someone test this recently and find a quirk with Frost Oil specifically?

Think you gotta catch up on your druid theory bud.

Infact the counterweight is considered a BIS enchant for unyielding maul or Draconic Maul for example (for bear tanking).

The crit stones also work.

1 Like

Yeah I make our druids elemental sharpening stones every week.

Temporary enchants that are based on weapon hit are not the same thing as passive stat bonuses.

Counterweight is 3% melee haste, so it applies to our paws.
Elemental Sharpening Stone is 2% melee critical strike, so it also applies to our paws.

However, things like WEIGHTstones, not the counterweight, that strictly add +X amount of weapon damage, do not do anything for us. Same with WEAPON based procs, like Hand of Ragnaros, Perdition’s Blade, etc.

So unless Frost Oil, despite being an on-weapon-hit proc, has some weird quirk of Vanilla, it should never proc in forms. That’s why I asked about it.

You changed other things based on what you thought was bad design or that should be changed, yet refuse to change this. You changed Black Lotus spawns, you changed Ectoplasmic Distiller, you added layers, you added instance caps, you changed BG instance portals, you changed honorless target interaction with mind control, you changed some guards attack ranges, etc, etc.

Why not change this bad design as well?


I can explain this actually, because the players observing the issue were confused too initially.

Physical gcd attacks can themselves proc the weapons, even if them triggering the gcd locks out the proc for autoattacks happening in the same window. Due to some procs having a projectile travel time, plus batching, it can often look like these procs are coming from autoattacks even though they actually aren’t.

So someone spamming hamstring will still see procs, they will just only come from the hamstrings and not from autos between hamstrings.

The gcd flag is obvious in the spell data (it shows up on wowhead under the spell info even), but it wouldn’t be clear initially why spamming physical attacks=some procs and spamming magical attacks=no procs. Their error is understandable.

1 Like

And thanks for taking another look at the Reference Client, it’s a great feeling to have closure on the topic. I hope none of the TBC weapons have the same settings!


So is there no longer any benefit to seal twisting with the knowledge now that GCD does affect NF?

None of this discussion about what the best weapon is for the ooze boss is relevant. You should be auto-attacking til you have 200 hits. You can do this with a level 5 dagger and Frost Oil; the damage you do literally doesn’t matter during this phase.

there was never a noticeable benefit to seal twisting for added dps or nightfall uptime, but now we know it is actively detrimental.

If you are using nightfall, just use SoC (or SoR if you lack it) and only use GCDs exactly 1.0s into your swing timer (after your seal would hit).

Yes it was. You want to get the most frost hits possible. With some weapons using instant attacks gets you more procs, with others you would be reducing the proc count (especially with dual wielding). It’s kind of important to know which you are using, which setup gets the most procs, and what you should do to get that result.

1 Like

Why, so that you can freeze the boss 5 seconds earlier?

Basically. If you are going to send melee in at all during that phase you might as well do it right and minimize the damage they are taking with an efficient freeze.


So we were right all along, or in other words…

I told you…

^^^so nice of you to unlist the 2nd report above^^^


Doesn’t SoR generate more procs on average than SoC for maximizing Nightfall uptime?

1 Like

Since judgenent of command can trigger it, but judgement of righteousness can not, they end up very close.

SoC just does a heck of a lot more personal DPS, and that added nightfall uptime pretty much can’t make up that difference save extreme raid comps.

1 Like