Guild Banks Pt. 14

[Fesz-cenarius]

Which do you believe is higher priority to Blizzard?

No Change or overhead/operations costs.

If the metrics collected over the years by Blizzard illustrates a desire to add guild banks based on overhead. Does no change stand a chance?

It’s quite obvious that if adding a guild bank system didn’t deliver relief on the backend then no change will hold. Adding for player convenience alone isn’t enough.

Adding for Blizzard convenience very well could be.

Blizzard may add guild banks and they choose not to do so.

There is also the fact that they are reinstating the one hour delay to mail (including mail to alts, as Ion indicated in that Q and A) so that players actually need to meet to transfer items without waiting an hour. The fact that guild banks would allow that need to meet up to instantly transfer items to be bypassed will likely be one of the factors they consider in their decision of whether or not to add the non vanilla QOL convenience of guild banks to classic, IMO.

We will have to wait to see what they decide. Until that decision is made, I will continue to voice my preference for a truer classic experience that is as close to vanilla as orcishly possible.

[Lyfordeth-magtheridon]

yep, it is a little more difficult but you can do it. Options for everyone I can see more RP also, as people generally have roles to play.

[Fesz-cenarius]

You would not be able to do the raids, or possibly even some of the dungeons by yourself. You will not be able to out level them. I remember doing the elite quests where all the mobs where elites and required a group. I do think I solo’d some of those.

Yeah pugging raids in vanilla is harder since there’s no LFR. But other than that, leveling can be done entirely solo, BG’s have a queue system and dungeons were routinely pugged.

So outside of raiding you could lone wolf it just about as much in vanilla as you can in retail.

Players could do much of vanilla solo, but reputation played a far greater role in a player’s ability to find pugs willing to accept them than it does in retail. I expect reputation to be just as important in Classic.

I would suspect that the player who is social, groups often, helps other players, etc. will have a better reputation than that “lone wolf”. I may be wrong, but I suspect that the social player will find it far easier to pug than the “lone wolf”.

[Ziryus-doomhammer (Ziryus)]

You would not be able to do the raids, or possibly even some of the dungeons by yourself. You will not be able to out level them. I remember doing the elite quests where all the mobs where elites and required a group. I do think I solo’d some of those.

Yeah pugging raids in vanilla is harder since there’s no LFR. But other than that, leveling can be done entirely solo, BG’s have a queue system and dungeons were routinely pugged.

So outside of raiding you could lone wolf it just about as much in vanilla as you can in retail.

Players could do much of vanilla solo, but reputation played a far greater role in a player’s ability to find pugs willing to accept them than it does in retail. I expect reputation to be just as important in Classic.

I would suspect that the player who is social, groups often, helps other players, etc. will have a better reputation than that “lone wolf”. I may be wrong, but I suspect that the social player will find it far easier to pug than the “lone wolf”.

Maybe on low pop servers, on high pop servers there were too many people for everyone to know everyone and you would have to be a pretty massive troll before your rep mattered.

[Redheadchild-kul-tiras (Redheadchild)]

just because your blinded by nostalgia doesn’t mean there are no good changes.

the mail system had a bug that when right clicking items to send, it would occasionally try to use the item and if it was a consumable, well sucks to be you, its gone, you used it, while trying to mail it.

fact is vanilla wasn’t perfect, nor will classic be perfect, but I do expect it to be better than what we had in 2004 in terms of security, bugs, exploits, exc.

its not a time capsule and they will make changes that make sense, maybe not to you, or even me, but from a company and game developer stand point.

[Fesz-cenarius]

You would not be able to do the raids, or possibly even some of the dungeons by yourself. You will not be able to out level them. I remember doing the elite quests where all the mobs where elites and required a group. I do think I solo’d some of those.

Yeah pugging raids in vanilla is harder since there’s no LFR. But other than that, leveling can be done entirely solo, BG’s have a queue system and dungeons were routinely pugged.

So outside of raiding you could lone wolf it just about as much in vanilla as you can in retail.

Players could do much of vanilla solo, but reputation played a far greater role in a player’s ability to find pugs willing to accept them than it does in retail. I expect reputation to be just as important in Classic.

I would suspect that the player who is social, groups often, helps other players, etc. will have a better reputation than that “lone wolf”. I may be wrong, but I suspect that the social player will find it far easier to pug than the “lone wolf”.

Maybe on low pop servers, on high pop servers there were too many people for everyone to know everyone and you would have to be a pretty massive troll before your rep mattered.

That may have been your experience, but that experience was not universal.

In addition, a player would not need to have been “blacklisted” to have trouble finding spots in pugs, even on a high pop server.

Think about it. Let’s say that you are forming a pug. There are 10 rogues looking to fill the last spot. You have never grouped with any of those rogues, but 9 rogues have names you recognize and the tenth rogue has a name that neither you nor any of the members of your group have ever heard. Of the 9 rogues who’s names you recognize, 8 of them are known to be social players who group often and help other players. The last rogue is known to be a “lone wolf” that rarely, if ever, accepts group invitations in the open world and with whom very few people have pugged. Those that have pugged with that rogue generally do not have anything bad to say about him, but they also do not sing his praises.

Who do you choose to fill that last spot? Do you take one of the 8 rogues that are known to be social, helpful players? Do you take the “lone wolf” that rarely, if ever, accepts group invitations? Do you take the total unknown?

I, personally, would take one of the 8 rogues that are known to be social, helpful players.

[Fesz-cenarius]

just because your blinded by nostalgia doesn’t mean there are no good changes.

the mail system had a bug that when right clicking items to send, it would occasionally try to use the item and if it was a consumable, well sucks to be you, its gone, you used it, while trying to mail it.

fact is vanilla wasn’t perfect, nor will classic be perfect, but I do expect it to be better than what we had in 2004 in terms of security, bugs, exploits, exc.

its not a time capsule and they will make changes that make sense, maybe not to you, or even me, but from a company and game developer stand point.

I would expect bugs and actual exploits to be fixed in classic. The problem is that although you want to claim that guild banks alts were an exploit, you have yet to show any exploit. We’ve already had this discussion several times before.

As for security, Blizzard will be using their newer security systems. If I am correct, those systems are outside of the game, though.

[Redheadchild-kul-tiras (Redheadchild)]

It was an exploitability system that lead to many players being scammed.

[Fesz-cenarius]

It was an exploitability system that lead to many players being scammed.

Again with the claim of exploit or “exploitable system”, possibly in an attempt to bully Blizzard into adding this one of your pet non vanilla QOL convenience changes to Classic.

As you are well aware, every player has always had the option to store any items on their own characters.

No one has ever been “forced” to send any items to another player.

Any player that sends anything to another player CHOOSES to do so VOLUNTARILY.

No player is redirecting the mail in order to receive items that were actually sent to different player.

Anything sent to another player belongs to that recipient, just as anything placed in a guild bank belongs to the GM since the guild belongs to the GM.

[Padrepwn-kiljaeden (Padrepwn)]

Again with the claim of exploit or “exploitable system”, possibly in an attempt to bully Blizzard into adding this one of your pet non vanilla QOL convenience changes to Classic.

Or it could just be exploitable and the fix is a side of qol? LOL

[Williams-akama (Williams)]

You and I agree on several things, but I cannot back you up on this crusade brother. I agree that guild banks are a nice feature, but they can be robbed; this is not uncommon and even the logs are going to stop bank robberies.

Sure it’s ammunition to “Shame” the perp on the forums, but now days “Shaming” people will unfortunately get you permanently banned according to the extremely broad rules “aka anything we want to ban you for”

So there is that, and there is also the point that many have made before me that’s as clear as day; this just was not a feature at any point in the original game.

That right there makes it something I cannot get behind and rally for.

[Fesz-cenarius]

Again with the claim of exploit or “exploitable system”, possibly in an attempt to bully Blizzard into adding this one of your pet non vanilla QOL convenience changes to Classic.

Or it could just be exploitable and the fix is a side of qol? LOL

Show us all this exploit.

No one has yet shown any exploit with guild bank alts. Could that be because there is NO exploit?

We get it. Some people do not want Classic. What they really want is Classic +, vanilla lite, EZ mode vanilla or possibly even BFA in a vanilla setting. They want their retail, non vanilla QOL conveniences.

[Studmuffyn-veknilash (Studmuffyn)]

We get it. Some people do not want Classic. What they really want is Classic +, vanilla lite, EZ mode vanilla or possibly even BFA in a vanilla setting. They want their retail, non vanilla QOL conveniences.

How do you define ez mode Vanilla? Meaning what in your opinion have people asked for that you think would make it ezmode?

[Fesz-cenarius]

We get it. Some people do not want Classic. What they really want is Classic +, vanilla lite, EZ mode vanilla or possibly even BFA in a vanilla setting. They want their retail, non vanilla QOL conveniences.

How do you define ez mode Vanilla? Meaning what in your opinion have people asked for that you think would make it ezmode?

Begone troll.

I thought maybe you had changed and could actually see reason, but I was wrong.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fol me twice, shame on me.

[Studmuffyn-veknilash (Studmuffyn)]

We get it. Some people do not want Classic. What they really want is Classic +, vanilla lite, EZ mode vanilla or possibly even BFA in a vanilla setting. They want their retail, non vanilla QOL conveniences.

How do you define ez mode Vanilla? Meaning what in your opinion have people asked for that you think would make it ezmode?

Begone troll.

Seriously? what exactly have I done that is trolling? I am asking a question intended to start a discussion, how is that trolling?

I thought maybe you had changed and could actually see reason, but I was wrong.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fol me twice, shame on me.

No idea what your issue with me is, it seems whenever I say something that you disagree with all of sudden I become a ‘troll’, I am and always are just trying to have a discussion, and that also includes not agreeing with you.

Was honestly hoping you would answer as I really like talking and discussing topics with you.

[Redheadchild-kul-tiras (Redheadchild)]

simple

the exploit is being able to rob people blind, AND THEY DINT EVEN KNOW IT

with guild banks you can at least know when there’s a thief, guild banks alts though, there is no visibility, no reliable log, no way to know. there’s a point of trusting people, and just being a fool. a fool gives his money to someone that says he will hold it for them, and keeps no documentation of when it was given, how much was given, what it was even supposed to go toward when the money was given, exc.

guild banks fix a LOT of the issues that guild bank alts have, one of them being the exploitability of transparency to scam others and they wont even know it.

[Fesz-cenarius]

simple

the exploit is being able to rob people blind, AND THEY DINT EVEN KNOW IT

with guild banks you can at least know when there’s a thief, guild banks alts though, there is no visibility, no reliable log, no way to know. there’s a point of trusting people, and just being a fool. a fool gives his money to someone that says he will hold it for them, and keeps no documentation of when it was given, how much was given, what it was even supposed to go toward when the money was given, exc.

guild banks fix a LOT of the issues that guild bank alts have, one of them being the exploitability of transparency to scam others and they wont even know it.

Was anyone forced to end anything to any other player? NO.

Did anyone who sent anything to another player CHOOSE to do so VOLUNTARILY? YES.

Did anyone hack the in game mail system to redirect mail to themselves so that they received items that were actually sent to different player? NO.

Did every player have the option to store any and all items they found on their own characters? YES.

No exploit here folks.

Keep misrepresenting it as an exploit in the hopes of bullying Blizzard into implementing this one of your pet non vanilla QOL convenience changes, though.

We’ll have to wait and see how that works out for you.

[Studmuffyn-veknilash (Studmuffyn)]

No exploit here folks.

He means that the alt system could be exploited and that GBs addressed that particular ‘exploit’, course you can’t really fix dishonest people , as they adjust to any new system and seem to always find a way to do what they want.

[Padrepwn-kiljaeden (Padrepwn)]

Ratsy must be in the sauce already. LOL

[Padrepwn-kiljaeden (Padrepwn)]

He knows exactly what we mean. Its been laid out in 14 threads. LOL