I don’t know which topic is more boring
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I support guild banks. It’s a smart addition to classic WoW that provides, inter alia, convenience.
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But anything they withdraw is logged by a system that is not maintained by players.
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I challenge you to point out where I have ever said otherwise. There are 13 other threads on the old forums where we have discussed this to death. I may have defended and contributed to the security arguments but I have also shot holes in them myself but I have never said I didn’t think they were qol or a convenience
You are right it is convenience. I prefer leveling /crafting and socializing guilds and anything that has the ability to keep players out in the world I am all for.
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Any least you are honest about your motivations, unlike some. You have my respect for your honesty.
Just because someone has different views than you, doesn’t mean they are not being honest about their views.
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Reread what you quoted, “try” is a key word I put there for a reason.
The point is that even if you “try”, it is very unlikely that any two people will be able to provide 24/7 coverage for that guild bank.
To have 24/7 coverage so that no one has to wait, you would likely need at least three people and probably quite a few more. Isn’t that kind of the opposite of restricting access?
Using guild bank alts with the guild resources divided among those alts can be just as effective, although not as convenient.
Problem is it won’t be as effective because of limited resources, the enchanting mats example was already explained.
And yet, the guild in which I was a member had no problem dividing those resources among at least three, and often more, guild bank alts while still being able to fill those “orders”. Were there times when the supply of a given resource was too low to “fill an order”? Yes, but in the vast majority of those situations that order would not have been able to be “filled” even if all of the requested resource was in one location. The total number of that resource that the guild had was below what was requested.
The real problem, for some, is that guild bank alts are not as convenient as guild banks. That is all there is to it, for some.
Which means nothing as it isn’t considered “theft” and thus actionable since they were given the access to take the stuff in the first place. All it did was tell you who took the stuff. The stuff is still gone and thus was less secure…
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then out of game logs also mean nothing as well. which is what I was comparing them too, you can fake one but not the other, they both come down to the same thing, trust.
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Yes with the in game logs which can’t be faked, you can see the theft clearly and take away that person’s access, yet the out of game logs can be made to lie.
Got 15 black lotus in the guild bank?
Well just change the log one month back to make it reflect 12 and you just made 50g…
Guild banks in game logs don’t allow that. That is why it’s safer, not for the initial theft, but from repeat theft, which is only preventable by finding out who the their is, which is also much more reliable to do so under a logging system that can’t be edited to show what the person wants it to show.
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Except you cannot do that when multiple people are keeping duplicate logs.
Sure, you can change that entry in the log you keep, but not in the duplicate logs kept by others It will also probably be difficult , at best, to change that entry on the spreadsheet on the guild website without someone noticing what was changed and who changed it.
Again, if a guild sets up their system of guild bank alts to maximize their effectiveness, the only thing really lost is the convenience that guild banks provide.
Does it require some effort and co-ordination? Yes. Is that effort and co-ordination worth it? Yes.
Are guild bank alts as convenient as guild banks? No, but they were part of vanilla, while guild banks NEVER were.
I think you meant something else.
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I meant exactly what I said, regardless of you trying to twist those words and/or put word into my mouth.
Just pointing out a flaw in your logic.
I suppose it is theoretically possible for every person in charge of a guild bank alt and one of the duplicate logs to be a “thief” and in cahoots with every other person in charge of a guild bank alt and one of those duplicate logs. That is, after all, what it would take to change the same entry on every one of those duplicate logs, as well as the spreadsheet on the guild website, in order for them to cover their thefts.
Those duplicate logs also serve another, less tangible, purpose, though.
How does Johnny approach those other guild bank alt holders to form that conspiracy without exposing himself as not being trustworthy?
Solution: Blizzard’s logs
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Solution: Do not add the non vanilla QOL convenience of guild banks. Leave it up to each individual guild, as it was in vanilla.
But you keep pushing for all those non vanilla changes you want, if it makes you feel better. Let us all know how that works out for you.