Guild Bank Missing Items Update

[Dracarian-medivh]

@Warzug-mankrik

A simple “yes, more is on the way” or a simple “no, there will be no further items mailed out” would suffice from a Blue - barely even 1 sentence

I agree. I feel some sort of update would certainly ease a great many people in here. At least some good news, or some closure.

[Dracarian-medivh]

This is a very optimistic outlook, and I agree. Perhaps their focus is on solving the problem. Still, some sort of nod like “We’re actively working on it” would go a long way for most.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Dracarian-medivh

I was hoping for actual conversation and interaction.

I highly doubt he wants that.
Seems he just wants to pop in and white knight for some odd reason.

@Dracarian-medivh

Still, some sort of nod like “We’re actively working on it” would go a long way for most.

I try to be positive. You gain nothing from negativity.

From what I’ve seen from CM, they report what they can, when they can.
If there is nothing to share, they usually don’t say anything. From US forums anyway.
CMs in EU post frequently “no new info to share”.

If the US forums weren’t so volatile any time a blue posts, CMs would probably post more stuff like that here.

[Teancumora-proudmoore]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

You replied without reading.

I have read the thread, and I agree with most of your conclusions. Which is why I spoke up in the first place. Most people who are intentionally abrasive won’t be swayed by any sort of conversation. You seemed like someone who might be able to benefit from having their faux pas pointed out.

When Agaris stated “This is not helpful. Please stop posting this.” I took it as someone trying to point out that you stating that what they find valuable is ‘essentially worthless’ is abrasive and painful. Which is why they politely asked you to stop. Instead of acknowledging this, you counter attacked, claiming their own post was less helpful than the one that they found offensive. You don’t have the right to tell someone they are not hurt or should not be hurt by your actions.

Granted, I chose ‘counterattacked’ intentionally, as being kindly asked to stop can still be seen as offensive and it is very human to get defensive at any critical response, as you did to my post.

Now you know, if you didn’t before. And if you did know before I spoke up, then my words were wasted, and I apologize.

[Dracarian-medivh]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

If the US forums weren’t so volatile any time a blue posts, CMs would probably post more stuff like that here.

You are not wrong.

[Gulltherizul-magtheridon]

I played for 19 years and all my items are deleted.

Am I a minority? Does Blizzard need to make space for “priority” accounts (youtubers, streamers, ect)?

I lost hundreds of slots = tens of thousands of mats / items.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Teancumora-proudmoore

You seemed like someone who might be able to benefit from having their faux pas pointed out.

I literally said YOU assign the value. I didn’t call other peoples possessions junk.
I even provided a screenshot of my bags to show my junk that are treasures to me.

You are being dishonest at best.

@Teancumora-proudmoore

When Agaris stated “This is not helpful. Please stop posting this.” I took it as someone trying to point out that you stating that what they find valuable is ‘essentially worthless’ is abrasive and painful. Which is why they politely asked you to stop.

They didn’t include any kind of context, so why are you assuming their intentions?

You assumed their intent and chose to attack me.

@Teancumora-proudmoore

You don’t have the right to tell someone they are not hurt or should not be hurt by your actions.

And they have the right to tell me to stop posting. Hypocritical much?

@Teancumora-proudmoore

Granted, I chose ‘counterattacked’ intentionally, as being kindly asked to stop can still be seen as offensive and it is very human to get defensive at any critical response, as you did to my post.

Now you know, if you didn’t before. And if you did know before I spoke up, then my words were wasted, and I apologize.

The difference being they didn’t include any kind of context and essentially told me to stop posting.
Where as I was talking about a topic and said its all subjective in what and how you keep things.

I’ll accept you apology once you edit/delete your initial post to me. Then I shall do the same.

[Vralok-turalyon (Vralok)]

Oh yes, I was agreeing with you. I was going by the logic of the trolls that are saying the items are “worthless”, and just taking that to its logical conclusion.

[Dracarian-medivh]

@Linxy

We apologize for that and for the long wait here. We really appreciate your patience as we’ve worked through this difficult issue.

Good Evening Linxy,

I know it has only been a week, and as someone who has lived in the tech world and data center space for awhile, I understand the nuances and issues surrounding most coding. I was wondering if this is still being tasked, or if the task is complete and there is no more news or any new updates to be had. At this point, I would imagine a “we’re done and that’s all” is going to settle in better than no news. If there is any chance of an update, or even closure, we’d appreciate it. Thanks.

[Teancumora-proudmoore]

@Dracarian-medivh

So maybe instead of multiple people in this topic calling me a troll because they disagree with my opinion, we could sit down and discuss it. I’m being nice, I’d just like the same courtesy.

Aye, they are just as wrong (if not moreso) than you. But they are hurting more than you are due to your ability to distance yourself more from the unfortunate damage, and I doubt my calling the people throwing the ‘troll’ title around are in any condition to understand their mistake and improve, whereas I think you are more than capable of it. On the odd chance that they can see a rational, reasoned discussion that brings up their pain points without causing more, perhaps they can be brought around.

As I said, I don’t think you are a troll. You’ve had measured responses throughout. But you did have some abrasive posts that you may not have realized were abrasive, and I thought it worth the time to point them out.

In all honestly, the fact that you want to sit down and talk rationally is the only reason to make a post and tag you in it. If you were a troll, it wouldn’t be worth the time.

[Teancumora-proudmoore]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

You assumed their intent and chose to attack me.

If you read my post as an attack, then it failed miserably in its purpose. For that I do apologize. No harm was intended, merely some help pointing out why others may be reacting (or overreacting) to your posts.

Do with that as you will.

[Dracarian-medivh]

@Teancumora-proudmoore

As I said, I don’t think you are a troll. You’ve had measured responses throughout. But you did have some abrasive posts that you may not have realized were abrasive, and I thought it worth the time to point them out.

In all honestly, the fact that you want to sit down and talk rationally is the only reason to make a post and tag you in it. If you were a troll, it wouldn’t be worth the time.

I agree completely. In-fighting, back biting, and name calling are just not in my bag of must haves. I would rather sit and speak rationally. As for my “abrasive posts”, we’ll find most, if not all of them, came on the heels of emotional escalation which seems to drive a fair few people to more bold and unneeded commentary. I’ve tried logic and reason, and even tried to help compartmentalize how to handle these pixelated memories in a game. “Collectors” seem to run off emotion, and not logic, so while your suggestion of giving them time to see reason and come around for civil discord seems like a solid plan, I am not sure they even want to. God help us all if Blizz either says, “We are done restoring items” or “we consider this matter resolved” and locks the thread. The uproar alone would send me into a posting hiatus for 6 months.

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Teancumora-proudmoore

If you read my post as an attack, then it failed miserably in its purpose.

@Teancumora-proudmoore

“You are assigning value to essentially worthless items.” There are no ‘essentially worthless’ items, as worth is not a noumenal element that exists in any essential state. Ultimately, all value judgements are fundamentally subjective. And while you can make an appeal to the masses, most modern rational people would consider it problematic to impose their personal values on another, as you did here.

@Quivermethis-rexxar

@Phreska-feathermoon

Other people are constantly harassing people with full banks, probably people who only play a fraction of the game.

Yea no. I am definitely a hoarder lol.

And no one has a say in how you choose to use your space. It’s YOUR space after all. But it’s also okay to admit you ARE a hoarder
Nothing wrong with it.

I’ll show you what just 2 of my bags look like. This stuff never leaves my person. That should give you an idea what my bank looks like lol.
It’s just stuff. But it’s stuff I took a lot of time to get. Like in my backpack. Top left. That is Zin’Rohk from archeology. I spent YEARS farming that thing. Months in cata because it was a bis weapon for awhile, then a very long time in legion.
Or bottom left of the same bag. That is my jaina’s locket from doing shadowmourne legendary quest. Also have shadowmourne. My blade of hanna. Quel’delar (personal favorite from 14-15 years ago).

Point being. This stuff is probably worthless and a waste of space to anyone else. But to me, it’s my time and my collectables I enjoy keeping on me.

Here is the full post you partially quoted.
Hope that clears everything up.

@Teancumora-proudmoore

merely some help pointing out why others may be reacting (or overreacting) to your posts.

They aren’t overreacting to the above, which you were replying to.

Some are merely upset over the term “hoarding” or “hoarder” being applied to in-game items and storage.
But regardless, trying to shut someone up because you disagree with a word or term is ridiculous at best.

[Gulltherizul-magtheridon]

I want Blizzard head of Customer Support to post their comments on these questions:

I want Blizzard head of Development to post their comments:

1. Do your programmers know how to program?
2. Are you lying about #1?
3. Why are millions of items gone?
4. Did you fire quality programmers to save money?
5. Are stock results more important than player experiences?
6. When everyone quits, what will profits be then?

[Sarabande-aggramar (Sarabande)]

@Lindsey-bloodhoof

As more time goes on, the more I’m coming to terms with the fact my stuff is gone for good. But on the other hand, the more time goes on the angrier I am at Blizzard’s ineptitude, and the more I think we should continue to express our displeasure at this whole response.

Let’s say you’re having an important celebration at a restaurant. You buy a fancy custom made cake for the occasion.

Scenario 1: As the server walks out with the cake, someone opens a door too quickly and hits the servers arms and the cake falls onto the floor.

Scenario 2: The server walks out of the kitchen backwards with the cake balanced in one hand, while talking on the phone with the other, trips over a chair and the cake falls onto the floor.

Both scenarios end with our cake ruined, but one scenario was an honest mistake and the other scenario was a careless mistake that could easily have been avoided.

While I know none of us are privy to exactly what happened it certainly seems to me like this whole fiasco was a “scenario 2.”

Then there’s the aftermath.

Scenario 1: The server and managers apologize profusely, offer to buy you a different dessert as well as giving a substantial discount on the bill.

Scenario 2: All the staff disappear for an hour, then someone comes out and scrapes a tiny bit of smashed cake off the floor onto a plate and places it in front of you.

Again, in both scenarios we lose our cake, but in scenario 1 at least the staff try to make amends.

We deserve better than this.

I like the analogy. Because yes, bad things happen even when you try your very best. But it seems that M$-Blizzard was NOT trying their best. I think a lot of the PEOPLE were. But the company as a whole probably could have done a lot more to try to keep this from happening, from making sure that all departments were well-staffed, that experienced, knowledgeable people regarding the specific systems that they use, were on hand, that they did more than adequate testing, especially when introducing a system like Cross-server guilding, and making sure that the product is actually ready to ship before getting it into paying player’s hands.

The constant cost-cutting layoffs, merging of “redundant” departments (even if the systems used were vastly different), putting out a “roadmap” and sticking to it, even if what we get is buggy as hell and not ready to ship - it was all done to make some people extra money. They’re not going broke. They’re not little mom & pop business that had to let go of a cashier because they can barely pay the rent on their business. It was all done deliberately and in a calculated manner. It was their choice to not say anything for OVER A MONTH, which made people angrier. Sure, they’d be facing an angry mob anyway, but shoot, send someone who’s not under the pay-grade to take that. Also, if they had at least tried to work with us (sorry, what they call “restoration” was just more insult as the ONLY stuff I got back were things I already had) even if it took MONTHS and were honest about what they were doing to do and how long it could take. people would probably be satisfied.

[Dasserlond-ravencrest (Dasserlond)]

GIVE US OUR STUFF BACK BLIZZARD!
We all know you CAN!
The logs are there!
We will not forget!
We will not forgive!

[Teancumora-proudmoore]

To be fair, there are studies out now that seem to point to a conclusion that all decisions are run off emotion, and what we consider ‘logical decision-making’ is mostly the ability to rationalize the emotional decisions we make. I’m not sure I fully buy into the conclusions, but it has helped me work with others I’d otherwise consider irrational, and perhaps given me a small bump to processing time between stimulus and response. One of the reasons I prefer written communication to spoken is the time lag, letting me catch my own actions that I deem too emotion-sourced before committing to posting them.

In the circumstances of this thread, we have a large number of individuals united by a common pain, especially newer/less active posters. That’s what pain does, it triggers actions that otherwise wouldn’t be considered.

If we take the source of the pain the sudden loss of large amounts of time as represented by the stacks of stuff in various vaults, any posts that seem to devalue the lost items will trigger defense responses. It’s these that likely lead people to lump the originator in with more overtly trollish company.

Honestly, I don’t feel like the trolls have been out in any real numbers on this topic. Other than a very few notable exceptions that the mods seem to have quickly taken care of, most of the conversation has been civil. Perhaps the lack of obvious and persistent trolls adds to the number of false positives.

[Dracarian-medivh]

@Teancumora-proudmoore

Honestly, I don’t feel like the trolls have been out in any real numbers on this topic. Other than a very few notable exceptions that the mods seem to have quickly taken care of, most of the conversation has been civil. Perhaps the lack of obvious and persistent trolls adds to the number of false positives.

That’s a very astute assessment. Other threads of which I have visited almost feel as though every other post comes from a known offender. This thread has a different feel where instead of seeing legitimate trolls, certain individuals are instead bestowing the title and fabricating a new reality that does not exist. Sadly, blinded by emotion, others see this person as a champion, when in fact, in a small way, they are simply filling a troll’s shoes by acting out in certain ways. I’m glad we’re talking, and not just falling into that loop.

[Breel-tichondrius]

@Quivermethis-rexxar

@Agrias-bloodsail-buccaneers

This is not helpful. Please stop posting this

I mean… it’s more helpful than what you just posted. If people want to talk about hoarding, then why would I stop posting about it?

Maybe because hoarding is a disorder and has nothing to do with putting stuff in a guild bank in a video game?

[Quivermethis-rexxar]

@Breel-tichondrius

Maybe because hoarding is a disorder and has nothing to do with putting stuff in a guild bank in a video game

I mean it’s a part of the what/why you put things in your bank and storage.
And as I’ve said several times, it’s just pixels, who cares what you store and the why you store it. Why is it an issue calling a spade a spade?

But tanget topic aside, this guy said it better so I’ll just quote him.

@Hanuman-thorium-brotherhood

Hoarding has a negative connotation, which some folks take issue with.

The real point is that in this video game, items, achieves, reps, currencies… they are all data in some SQL database. If they can severely goof guild banks, it can happen again. Losing items sucks, but the real shock here is the response, or lack thereof, by what I used to regard as a top company. If it happens again - when it happens again - we know what their response is going to be, and apparently unless you’re popular streamer it isn’t good