Bilgewater Harbor is a Ghetto? Don´t make me laugh!
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The worgen lost TWO homes and the alliance could easily help them retake gilneas if they weren’t so obsessed with a dead kingdom known as lordaeron 
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They were put into a ghetto, then conscripted to improve Orgrimmar’s harbor. Does the horde get credit for letting the Goblins improve the harbor?
Please do not pretend that the Alliance is against reclaiming Gilneas. Varian said it, even the table missions say it…but blizz steadfastly refused to follow up these promises with facts.
What nonsense are you talking about anyway. Bilgerwater Harbor is not a ghetto and never was.
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I’m going to assume they don’t care until they actually bother to take it. 10+ years of empty promises mean nothing
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but…the alliance spoke very often about reclaiming it, the alliance nsc act as they would want to reclaim it. The problem is not ingame…it is outside and 30 cm before the screen…on the dev side.
Goblins terraform an entire zone into a horde symbol with a harbor in the center and a giant canon.
And thats apparently a ghetto. lol.
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The only person who said that the alliance should retake their old holdings, ironically was Turaylon. Varian hated Greymane and had to be convinced by everyone else to let them back into the alliance.
I, like many people don’t consider empty promises and hollow words to be worth anything. We’re talking about the same alliance who couldn’t be bothered to help the night elves retake darkshore because they thought arathi was more important.
I don’t care what the alliance says when they refuse to act on it. Regardless of the meta reason
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varian said that he want to retake gilneas…after siege of orgrimmar raid. The devs never followed their promise, so its ultimatively the devs fault.
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Empty promises are empty promises regardless of the meta reason. Funny how when I bring up details of the worgen loosing two homes, suddenly you have a problem with it and start blaming the devs, when before you were acting like it was a loss for the alliance.
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They didnt recieve bilgewater harbor when they joined the horde. They were put in a ghetto on the upper part of Org.
You could argue that Blizzard wrote them a more rewarding story, and I would agree. Its a better story than the gnomes and the Worgen. But part of what makes their story good is that they werent given a city. They took control of an important logistic and infrastructure asset in spite of Garrosh.
Theres tons of problems with trying to do the same thing for the Worgen. What the worgen bring to the Alliance wasnt really considered in any depth. The Goblins bring technology and mercantilism to the Horde. They are ruthless and cunning, needing no real charity to prosper. The worgen should be also, but despite being awesome werewolf monsters, they are objectified by Alliance good will.
Now, during BfA, Genn was shown to be the diplomatic asset he is as an elder statesman. Im actually a little sympathetic to the complaints because I could happily have watched a movie quality cinematic where Genn is urging the Kul Tirans to join the Alliance at some big maritimey table. But this is what Genn brings. Not the Worgen. The Worgen are just refugees. They need an expansion of growth before they even get Gilneas back. I personally dont want my Worgen to continue to be the Alliance charity case.
I would probably make it this expansion. Have both factions working to root out latent black dragonflight influence in Alterac. Have the worgens particularly adept at infiltrating the Alterac humans because of two forms. Have Shaw get killed and lose SI:7. Then replace it with the Gilneans. Have the Gilneans lay claim to Alterac first. Thry should do so through brilliant subterfuge and brutal assassinations. They should use the horde efforts to accomplish their goals, making the horde look stupid. But they should take Alterac before they are worthy of reclaiming Gilneas. Thats poetic if you know anything about Gilnean history.
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The goblins joined the Horde in cataclysm.
Bilgewater made available in cataclysm from day 1.
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I think he is confusing something, the goblins were NEVER in a ghetto.
My argument here is not that the Worgen have no reason, but that the problem here is some stupid idiotic attitude of the devs, the promises expressed by NSC are followed by zero deeds.
I didn’t disagree with you that it is a problem, but that the problem is even addressed ingame, but the devs don’t follow through.
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I think he is talking about the goblin portion of orgrimmar that used to be in the velley of wisdom before it got replaed by the troll stuff and the allied races fort.
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Stormwind has had a ton of detail since launch. How many little scenes played out in that city. Stuff like conversations in the taverns and what not. SW feels much more like a city than a game capital.
Plus, how many of the Alliance cities rely on elevators to get to major portions of them. Now that, that is the real bias.
Well, I’m assuming you’re referring to the Theramore as one suburb of org does not equal hundreds of extra quests and multiple extra leveling zones. Bilgewater doesn’t cover a lot of the points of a Theramore. Namely, it’s not a transport point to the other continent that’s close to two alliance capitals. Bilgewater is much more of an equivalent of a town like Thelsamar
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Yes. I am. That was what the Goblins got. What they gave to the Horde was Bilgewater Harbor. Built with a Goblin “city-in-a-box”. While they did establish that in Cataclysm, that wasnt their home. That was Garrosh’s harbor and how horde players get to Twilight Highlands. As a Goblin player (and the rightful tradeprince of the Bilgewater Cartel) you do not get to interact with Bilgewater for approx 40 levels after arriving in Org. Your quartermaster is in the Goblin ghetto. Its the goblin version of the Howling Oak.
After Cataclysm, the Goblins kind of start building up Bilgewater Harbor into a city of vice and excess to make it more like their old home in Kezan. The orc guards and authorities are none too happy about this… because its not officially a soveriegn territory of the Bilgewater cartel.
sure but the Worgen got a tree inside a much bigger tree.
The goblins got an entire new leveling zone and big goblin town and a ghetto as you call it in their faction capital. However you want to do this equation the Horde still came out on top in terms of content.
Worgen got a tree and Stormwind got a destroyed park.
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As it stands, the goblins still got more content than the worgen did. We got a tree in darnassus and barely any worgen specific content outside of a darkshire and the worgen pirates in booty bay. I say the horde came out on top
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I already acknowledged that. No matter how you slice it, the Worgen were just not a very well thought out nor established race. There is no way, that (at the time) you could have made the Worgen experience as rich and deep, with the same resources, as the Goblin experience. I mean… you could have centered the Worgen starting experience around a revolution establishing a Gilnean parliament, and Genn could have been killed, but Godfrey gets assigned Chairman of Gilneas then does a bunch of heinous crap, making Gilneans look bad… but the Gilneans are still just the Kingdom that hid behind a wall, sparing themselves from the horrors of the scourge, the events of vanilla, BC and Wrath. Maybe if the Gilneans hadnt been selfish isolationists, the Alliance might not have lost Southshore. They were made Worgen, and brought into the Alliance because it was metal. They got a super sick transformation animation, and they got to run on all fours needing no mount, and skin without a knife. Because thats metal. Thats how much thought went into the worgen, and thats a shame. They deserve some attention, but you cant just plop Gilneas back in their lap, because homelessness isnt the problem. The Gilnean heritage armor quest was a travesty. What even are we supposed to be?
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