Fury Warriors Scale, Sort of, Until

WoW Classic Mists of Pandaria Classic Discussion
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Blizzard pulls the rug out from under them.

Fury started Ulduar behind retribution paladins and feral druids. Fury quickly passed rets, and passed ferals a few weeks later. Then, a couple more weeks of gearing was needed to pass rets again after their buff. Now, ferals were buffed so much it will be impossible to compete with them for the rest of the expansion.

The thing that makes dps fun is competition. We had it in vanilla because half the raid was warriors. Even in TBC we had some runs with 2 or more fury warriors to have competition. But even without more than 1 warrior in TBC, we were able to compete against other top classes like hunters, mages, warlocks.

Fury warriors no longer have any competition with ferals getting a huge buff. We’ll scale again, but not as much as people think. 1) Not everyone will get Shadowmourne and 2) even with a LEGENDARY that is specifically designed to make you overpowered, furies are not going to be a clear #1 dps.

Taking a step back from it all, the ret and feral change are good improvements for them. The ret change didn’t adjust the meta, but it is looking like the feral change could bring an extra druid to raids.

Pandora’s box is opened. So, there are 2 options (I prefer the latter).

1 - Keep the feral change, but nerf it 10% to bring them back to where they were.
2 - Remove the penalty from Titan’s Grip to bring warriors up to the feral dps numbers. Make a Blue Post to detail any further changes Blizzard wants to make, such as removing munching from ignite and deep wounds. AND THEN STOP. Let the game play out without any more surprises.

Some people may say removing the Titan’s Grip penalty is too much and that we’ve had two good expansions already. 1) Why do past expansions matter? 1a) Mages and Warlocks are about to have the same amount of time at the top of the meters as warriors. 2) The penalty was introduced only after players had Shadowmourne. 3) Not every warrior will suddenly be top dps. Good warriors who have a good raid could have a chance to be top 5, and bad warriors still won’t be seen in the top 10. 4) The meta won’t change too much, if at all, because the raid utility of all specializations are needed to clear the content efficiently in WotLK.

I want competition between warriors and other dps classes to return. Stop treating us like we’re the anchor dps class. Put us in the middle of the dps curve with the rest of them.

As an additional plus to a final wave of class buffs, Ulduar will be easier to clear and content nerfs won’t be needed when TOGC is launched.

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Thank you for your imaginary changes.

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There’s no stopping. Once fury gets its buff, there will be another class asking for handouts.

Blizzard had the easiest job ever of just keeping the servers running and removing bugs. But they screwed up the brain-dead job they had for full salary and now they need to adopt full-scale balancing weekly.

I’m not surprised the lead dev left given his team were actively making their jobs more difficult.

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I think that’s it - we’re not underpowered and we don’t need a buff but Blizzard, please, stop screwing with our meta!

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While I agree that the buff to feral was too large to just fix their rotation, I pretty much disagree with your assessment that there’s no competition on the meters.

This is probably the most narrow the best and worst DPS specs have been since the classic series began. Yes, there are classes at the top and bottom of the meters (and some of the overall data is skewed because Ulduar has a few gimmicky fights), but if you are outperforming your other raiders in the group, you are probably reasonably high up on the meters.

Yeah, warriors are definitely more gear dependent, and their class doesn’t carry them to the top of the meters this expansion, but that doesn’t mean that they can’t ever perform well.

The higher performing warriors have a few fights where they are within reasonable ranges of the top DPS logs. To me that shows that warriors absolutely have the capability of occasionally finding themselves at the top of their raid’s meters.

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Well too bad, ret got a buff and didn’t have to wait till ICC so I don’t accept we have to.

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When you do you will claim your spot # 1 on the last boss of the expansion. You get the major flex.

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Drate still waiting on your reply on the feral druid thread. Feel free to reply to it.

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You weren’t in meme spec territory of DPS in Ulduar. All fury has to wait for is to move up through the pack, not to become part of it in the first place.

You are being impatient because simply competing with the rest of the pack isn’t good enough for you. You want to be at the undisputed top.

Rets were waiting for the last phase to become competitive in the first place.

That’s the difference that you repeatedly ignore.

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You had utility and were going to ‘scale’ in ICC. End of discussion.

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And the same applied to warriors, and fury was and is still in a better position than ret.

That should be the end of the discussion.

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Apparently it does, but ret paladins didn’t have to wait. So I have no interest in waiting. End of discussion.

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Yep, because you are suffering greatly from a weird envy of the worst PvE DPS spec in the game

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You should have had to wait like everyone else. You knew what was going to happen in WoTLK and should have been told to be patient.

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Rets still have to wait until ICC for us to be better than the worst of the DPS specs. The buff didn’t change that.

Rets were buffed from worst to worst

Warriors: guess that means you have to buff us to the best now!

It’s just terrible logic, and rets STILL have to wait until ICC to move out of the bottom. Warriors will start climbing further out of it in ToGC, so they even have to wait less than Ret.

The ret buff didn’t change that we are waiting for ICC, it just made groups shun us less in the meantime.

Fury isn’t getting shunned, nor will it.

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You received a buff when you were already going to scale. That’s the argument you’re giving to fury warriors to quit asking for buffs. Our highest PvE spec is bottom-tier but we need to wait because we’ll supposedly scale.

You have no justification for us waiting, just butt out because you’ve already wrecked WoTLK fidelity to classic norms.

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Ret doesn’t scale well. We are basically waiting for a broken set bonus and trinket in ICC to catch up with the classes that do scale well.

Fury smoothly moves up the meters with gear throughout the tiers. There’s nothing in ICC specifically that it needs to compete. It’s competitive now. High end performing fury warriors are doing quite well in Ulduar already.

The best rets pre-buff were far behind the high performers of every other PvE DPS spec.

Rets fell behind as every class got gear in Naxx, were in a very bad position in Ulduar, ToGC wasn’t going to make it better, and then ICC would make us ok-ish.

They aren’t the same situation as warriors, that just naturally get better as gear gets in your hands. You don’t need to wait until ICC to get out of bottom tier DPS ranges. Fully geared fury warriors in Ulduar are already moving out of those ranges. ToGC will catch up the ones that couldn’t full clear hard modes. ICC will move you even further up.

Rets were bad in Naxx, worse in Ulduar, still bad in ToGC (if not for buff), ok in ICC.

Fury was bad in Naxx, ok in Ulduar (thanks to ilvl buffs), decent in ToGC, and good in ICC.

But you are over here demanding that you be made top tier now because rets got made ok in Ulduar and ToGC when Fury had already dug itself out of the hole.

And you ignore that Fury already got a buff in Ulduar, because they got WAY more out of those ilvl changes than Ret (and most other specs) did.

Fury was bad,

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People are saying fury warrior doesn’t scale well either according to sims. Given your premise is wrong I’m not going to read the rest.

You didn’t have to wait, I don’t see why I should have to.

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Fury warriors best enviroment to shine will always be fights with multiple targets, you can’t account single target sims. The second you add one consistent add you can feel the difference.

When looking at a true fury warrior’s capability they will always be above the pac when it comes to multiple add fights in ICC specifically, your rage will be almost endless.

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Yeah except ferals are doing that better than warriors now. Plus they have innervate and battle rez.

You have no excuse, it’s ridiculous.