6 years is around what? BFA? Yeah sounds about right. As I said, been here since Legion and its the same song and dance.
Anyway, I’ve been talking to another FDK friend of mine and by his account around season 2 the DPS difference gets more equalized because 2hand stacked enough crit/haste to have enough KM procs.
As for changes in the spec, I think it could be interesting to have more ways to force a proc to happen should you want to spec into it, for example, a talent that gives you an extra attack that deals frost damage, has an X seconds cd and gives you a KM stack. Depending on how you build around it, could make the spec less reliant on auto attacks.
Wow, talk about a bunch of bullies and actual liars.
Im not. Tofu, the person YOU BROUGHT INTO THE CONVERSATION, saying he was no slouch saying he was beating people of the same ilvl as 2h, just isnt the case. He might be beating the other Frost DK in his guild, but hes nowhere near beating out people that know how to play the spec. Hes half of these peoples damage around the same ilvl. So someone who is doing HALF of others damage shows that he doesnt really know what hes talking about. I dont know how else you can look at it. His information isnt accurate. Like what do you want, me to just agree with false information?
Quote it. Quote me saying this. I havent. In fact I have said you cant play 2h if you want its just worse.
See, 11 days ago saying that you can play something if you want its just worse. So where is this narrative coming from that you are trying to push about me actually trying to defame me. Activist tactics, accuse the enemy of the thing you are doing right?
No, You guys were saying blatantly false things like Frost became DW over the course of expansions.
I said
And the response to that was
Which is why I went to Wrath and Cata numbers to show that it wasnt over several expansions.
Also, people like to throw around “viable” and I dont think they really know what it means. It just means it is able to be done. Was frost a viable tank spec? Yes, so was Unholy, but that doesnt mean they were THE tank spec or the best option. 2h was viable in wrath, you COULD do it and kill stuff, but it was so far behind that you were trolling if you did. Its not like the enrage timers were so close that you needed to squeeze every ounce of dps out. Do you know the DPS requirement for Sarth 0 drakes to not hit the enrage timer? It was only about 2.5k raid wide dps. The thing could have been 3 manned because it was soloed by an Unholy DK doing about 2.7k dps.
No its not. Again I have proof of it because I quoted myself saying play what you want if its worse.
You guys sound like activists that dont listen to people and instead lie about them and claim I am doing what you are actually doing.
So which is it? BFA or Legion? because I didnt really start posting on here until SL beta when the lies about the spec came out strong.
You havent been there that long lol, and I havent either.
Based on what exactly? This isnt DF anymore, and those same stats help out DW as well in the same way as well as other talents now. You cant ignore the other talents and say the entire spec focuses on KM procs now.
There is already an abundance, most likely more than there should be. Getting extra KM procs just wastes potential damage because you cant use them. KM already stacks to 2 because there is an over abundance with only 1 ability that consumes it now unlike before where there was 2.
Cold Blooded Rage was one of those ways to do it however it was really undertuned at like 15% to get KM on FS crit. A way to force Frost Strike/Glacial Advance to proc KM would be a way to make FDK less RNG-dependent but to balance it, I’d suspect you would have to choose between AA KM and KM when you use active RP abilities (not BoS).
It gets fixed with tuning that Blizzard isn’t doing. They can literally just make changes via the two-handed passive. Allow two runeforges on a two-hander so they can have Razor Ice or Stoneskin based on spec? Increase auto-attack speed of two-hander to help with auto-attack based critical procs? Flat % damage increase for certain abilities?
Also, blood DPS was pretty popular killing LK. The end of the expansion, when people could get hige amounts of armor pen, was really good for blood.
I’d have to say the thing pulling people towards frost being the tank spec was mostly the presence being defensive. Really, though, I’m almost certain UH had more defensive abilities under it’s blanket, though I don’t recall the trees well enough to remember the distribution of defensive talents.
When what do you do with the Obliterate damage increase in MotFW?
Then what about the increased KM proc chance? Also if you make the attack speed equal then what do you do about DW misses? 2h doesnt miss while DW does, so if you make the attack speed 1-1 then things arent normalized and things still get skewed.
No one sees the issue that if 2h needs this much stuff to be equal to DW then maybe its all just a waste of time to get to the point that is already there with DW?
So? And its not like the Shattering build isnt that far off from it. Its literally at the point where you can either go Shattering or BoS and the outcome be equal based on just things that go on in the fight. So its not actually solely tuned around BoS.
It wasnt though, and that showed with Wrath Classic even with Shadowmourne it didnt even compare to Unholy with SM or Frost for that matter. That armor pen was also good for Frost because the highest damage dealer for Frost was Obliterate (this is DW by the way).
Thats all it came down to. A presence. The main reason why people tanked as Frost was for snap threat with howling blast. Defensively all it really had was armor.
They are on WoWhead right now.
Blood had 10 survivability talents that a tank would get. A few overlap from early in the tree so we can say like 7 talents exclusive to blood. 5 in total for Frost, but really just 4 exclusive to Frost. And 4 for unholy with 3 being exclusive. This is just damage reduction stuff. Im not counting mixed ones that are dps increases. Just purely from a reduces the damage you.
Blood was clearly designed for tanking, Frost and Unholy were directed towards DPS. Unholy had just as much healing as Blood did with Death Strike while Frosts self recovery was lacking.
You could tank with arms if you really wanted. Nothing actually preventing it. You had access to defensive stance and tanking gear and there were probably just as many defensive talents in there as Frost or unholy.
ICC also wasnt good to DK’s especially Frost with the dodge hit you took in there.
Spot on. They keeps trying to discredit me by referring to a single log in which I was 593 ilvl(well below average), on a fight I was doing in a pug for the first time learning the fight, with no thought to parsing by maximising pad on adds or timing CDs to maximise parse, no raid buffs/consumable optimisation, slow/sloppy pug kill.
Not to mention I’m not a raider, I just did one raid to see the content. Raids are very different to m+ in terms of builds and how effectively those builds perform. BoS is very strong atm(which is DW exclusive), as it usually is in raid and early xpac, and the set bonus heavily favours that build.
All of my tww experience has been in keys(not my single pug raid). In which I’m doing pretty well at as a side hustle to my actual main content, PvP. Logs will also skew to what ever is meta. DW is currently the meta build, so people who are parsers(usually the top players) will typically play what ever is ahead even if it were .1%. So you don’t have any parses with the top end players using 2h. Not a great way to make a comparison. Sims will give you a fairer comparison.
Just keep enjoying the game as 2h if you like to wield a big weapon. I sim 3.2% higher with equivalent DW weps as obliteration, so it’s really not a big deal.
And comparing it to others within that ilvl. No defamation there. You do know you can see logs of those in the same ilvl range, especially the ilvl range you said you were beating at a lower ilvl.
Even if we take the other fights it doesnt fair any better.
So? How you play the class doesnt change depending on the content that you go in. The class functions the same way and its not like it was a mythic and you didnt even see all the content like you said you went in there to do.
What you do in M+ you can do in a raid. Might not be the absolute best, but you arent going to be doing 50% less damage of those of similar ilvl. 50% less and I wasnt even using a BoS build by the way so you cant say its because of BoS being uber powerful (which again goes against your claim that 2h can overtake DW if you are a good player which didnt happen here since you were 50% behind) I was using an Obliteration Shattering Blade build.
This is what you call making excuses for poor performance. You wanted to spend years saying I didnt know what I was talking about and now that people look into your performance its nothing but excuses.
If you are 50% behind in raids then you wont fair much better in M+.
You specifically said that you were beating out DW players of a higher ilvl, yet the information shows that of a similar ilvl your performance is less than mediocre. You shouldnt have been getting carried as you were. Again dont talk about me if you arent willing to be looked into.
Yet do 50% less in actual performance. This isnt defamation, that means I am knowingly lying but that isnt what the information shows and you are even putting up excuses as to why the information is what it is. So you acknowledge that the information is correct, while also trying to say im looking at something else when I actually wasnt. Again I was looking at a DW Shatter build and comparing it because I knew you would be blaming BoS on your troubles.
Wasn’t 2h the go to in MoP? I remember pvping and getting monster obliterates on people. Haven’t played dk much since then and even now I’m playing UH. Transmog option would be pretty cool.
No. 2h was on par with DW in the first tier of WoD. Thats when the Obliterates were 2 shotting low armor classes because it double dipped MotFW in a sense. It was a % increase on top of another % increase. 50% Obliterate increase and 35% melee damage increase which Obliterate was melee damage.
MoP started this Obliterate trend, then added the melee damage increase later and WoD just buffed it up to a much higher level. This is what people remember and it was damage turned to 15 and even then Frost was bad. These passives didnt allow the spec to be tuned to be competitive with other specs overall.
Basically it was a noob killer in pvp and thats about all it amounted to. If you really wanted success you just went Unholy, and it kind of shows that even absolute garbage specs like what Frost was, was still technically “viable” despite doing like half the overall damage output of other specs.
iirc dual wield was better for most of mop outside of throne of thunder tier where everyone was playing festerblight unholy due to trinkets from the tier being absolutely nuts for disease snapshotting. frost as a whole that tier was awful
Allow two rune forges on two handers, normalize attack speed between the two, and normalize proc chance talents/spells to be main hand only for DW. Bam all the problems go away.
So sick of seeing a million bad solutions to a simple problem, that include additional dev work and tuning for two separate weapon types/mechanics.
So does this mean 2.6 second speed for a 2h, or 1.3 second to account for the offhand?
I also just cannot understand of doing this when it already exists and transmog could make all of this just entirely pointless while being a benefit to not just death knights but other classes as well of just opening transmog up.
This would mean you would have to make it so DW strikes would have 2 outcomes in your solution of either being a full crit, or no crit. None of it being half crits and that just adds more dev work.
The best solution for the entire game is just opening up the transmog system. The input of work would go to opening up transmog. Given its not like turning a bow into a 2h sword or something. No reason why a warlock or mage shouldnt be able to just transmog a mh/oh into a staff. Enhance could get their 2h look, Fury could transmog their weapons into 1h weapons and I would even say that 2h specs can just transmog into a 1h weapon to get the 1 1h look if people want it. Its the absolute best solution for absolutely everyone to just open up transmog.
Ya the guy is basically the a shining example an armchair quarterback that does nothing but defame and talk down to people for no reason. You decided to give some advice to someone who asked for it and the guy attacks you. People say they like playing 2h Frost and he attacks them for it. I need to figure out how to put him on ignore if can even do that anymore that way I don’t have to see him needlessly insult people out of his own pride.
You… YOU… brought them up. Said he wasnt a slouch and that he was beating people with 2h when he was a lower ilvl than those playing DW. Thats not the case though when you actually look at the data. He and you are making it sound that if you are a great player (he isnt) that you can beat out DW players of a higher ilvl making it sound like 2h is better. Thats not the case and hes playing with bad players and hes not doing well either.
YOU BROUGHT HIM UP!
See. Talk about a failed attempt at gaslighting. So if you look at this person THAT YOU BROUGHT UP. Hes doing 50% less damage of those in his ilvl range. He isnt competitive with other classes, hes competitive with other bad players doing below average. The average is almost 900k in all of the normal raid and hes not even close to that. So how can you say someone isnt a slouch when hes doing below average.
Never attacked someone period, and I never said anything about someone liking 2h and that they shouldnt.
Why? Because I am showing you to be a liar and you are tired of seeing it? And you cant do a google search of how to put someone on ignore on the wow forums?
Here I will tell you, but you have to not talk about me if you want to put me on ignore or you just look like a weak person that wants to dish it out and not take it.
Click on the profile picture
click on view activity
on the right side it says normal and under that it says view profile, click on normal, set to ignored and set the forever timeframe.
But I dont want to see you say a single word about me like Tofurious does.
The truth also isnt an insult, its the truth. Thats the perfect defense to defamation which is knowingly lying about someone, thats what you guys are doing.
I’m not sure if they can allow two permanent enchants on a single weapon. The enchant system has been in place from 1.0, and rune forges use that system and take that slot. Changing it to allow two enchants on a single weapon may not be possible without a full ground up rewrite of the entire system and everything that touches on it, and that would be a massive undertaking and not guarantee that it wouldn’t just break everything no matter what. A set passive granted by a talent (such as Might suggested by Locutus up there) is probably the only realistic way to add a “second” runeforge.
I smashed out a couple of pug keys this morning to show you some first-hand evidence that 2h still goes all right in keys even when pugged, cheap flask, no pots, and not optimizing group comp for your maximum output. Ideally, you want a warrior and a DH in every group if you really want to shine.
https:// imgur. com/a/VlY5WjR
(remove spaces)
All of those guys had 5 ilvls on me too. And when you compare other fDKs on the same level key I am in top 80% even with my lower ilvl being 6-10ilvls lower than the top logs.
Classic isn’t 2009. I saw the popularity of blood dps. It wasn’t the best, but people weren’t as concerned when the boss was going down consistently, and players aren’t the same as they were back then. Whether it was the best or not, i was regularly rolling against a minimum of 3 other blood dps in every raid. People were about min/max extremes in classic. The game was not as min/max-centric for most of the people back then. You can’t compare classic to the original run, the players are very different.