Frenzied Regen needs a fix!

Classes Druid
1

I’m playing balance druid. Having to shift into bear form than using frenzied regen is 2 gcd. It’s too much for a minor defensive cooldown. Our CC combos are also 2 gcd. Like Vortex + Typhoon. Which is kinda annoying sometimes.

I think either Frenzied Regen should auto shift us into Bear Form or make “Fluid Form” talent do that instead. Like that is literally the most important shift “Fluid Form” can have.

Edit: Also you need to spend 1 more global to get back into Moonkin Form. In some cases, not shifting into moonkin form after a frenzied regen would be a dps gain as well (at the last 5-10 seconds of the pack) which is ridiculous. So cost of 1 frenzied regen is actually 3 GCD, not 2.

Edit2: Even after Frenzied Regen, we have to sit and wait in Bear Form for 4 seconds doing nothing. It actually Costs like 5 GCD. More I think of, more I see how flawed this is.

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If I had it my way, Moonkin Form would be cosmetic like Treant Form (less GCD mumbo-jumbo and can see transmogs), and make cosmetic shapeshifts be off the GCD completely to make them less annoying for the people that enjoy Moonchicken and Treant Form.

Then, add a new spell or very strong passive to help with Balance Druid’s extremely weak survivability, that does NOT require going into Bear Form. Bear Form should be a last resort, not the only way to protect ourselves after Barkskin is on CD. Something akin to Focused Will on Priest. Or some kind of absorb that’s better than Matted Fur.

The 10% stamina while in Bear Form talent is useless to other specs than Guardian realistically. Why couldn’t that have been 10% stamina baseline??? We have basically no flat damage reduction, and on top of that, Regrowth barely heals for anything.

It’s rough out here.

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The 10 percent increase in health is only useful so frenzied rejuvenation heals more and thats it.

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It’s a % based heal so just because it heals more, it is healing the same % of your healthpool which means it isnt doing anything.

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Firstly I agree it should auto shift, Frenzied Regeneration should work essentially like Stampeding Roar and Incapacitating Roar. This should be baseline.

Fluid Form should be removed and baked in the class, firstly we most definitely shouldn’t have to waste a talent point essentially to get a Class to function properly, talenting into Fluid Form for QoL feels bad.

Some Resto Builds don’t use Fluid Form aswell, This is why Frenzied Regeneration shouldn’t be tied into it and should simply be baseline on how it used across all specs.

When I press a defensive I need it now, not 2 GCDs later. It’s so frustrating.

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Is there any other defensive ability in the game that requires 2 GCD to use?

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I do like this idea as well as all form specific abilities automatically changing druid forms. It would feel better on the hands for sure.

What I’m not so sure about is it may encourage blizzard to remove manual shifting altogether in the long run which may be pretty cool but may also not be.

I’d have to play such a change before making my mind up.

Nice idea though.

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Personally I think Fluid Form should shift you into whatever form is necessary to cast whatever spell you’re using. It should cover everything

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Manual Shifting will always be a thing, the Form button is going anywhere.

But as a Defensive for the love of anything, please let it work instantly when I need it. No defensive requires 2 GCDs besides Frenzied Regeneration, it’s ridiculous it’s lasted this long how it is.

Mechanics and gameplay is progressively getting quicker and quicker through every expansion, every second and key press matters, Particularly when it comes to defensives.

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I propose Owlkin Regeneration, expend astral power to regen. Enhanced with barkskin active.

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Basically, what Dark Regen used to be for Destro. This is an incredible idea!!

I’d add Celestial Bulwark - either expend AP to generate a shield, or a passive alternative to Nature’s Vigil that leeches absorption based on damage.
Either one of those, or improve healing received in Bear Form, at least via Celestial Guardian again.

Literally anything :smiley:

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I’m close to stacking Vers, these delves are kicking my beak in.

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Can we stick this post to top, BUMP!

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I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again in this thread.

Scrap Frenzied Regeneration from Balance and Resto, give an additional charge of Renewal.

Works instantly, it’s reliable, only 1 GCD, doesn’t stop the flow of gameplay and essentially does the exact same heal but instant. I’d kill 2 have to charges of Renewal over this convoluted mess of a defensive called Frenzied Regeneration.

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I was thinking about this more, and instead of 2 Renewals, I’d almost rather have 2 Barkskin charges if they don’t just end up giving us a new defensive completely. (Even though I find Barkskin’s animation GOD AWFUL.)

Evokers have 2 Obsidian Scales charges, and that seems to work well for them.

I wouldn’t mind healing “being my defense” if our off healing wasn’t as low as it is. I really wish we had Affinities back again so I could go Resto Affinity. I miss it a lot.

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I’d accept this if only Barkskin had decent supporting talents in the class tree.

Matted Fur is beyond ridiculous, im ilvl 601, and the shield it gives is under 200k. 200k isn’t going to make me live through squat, and that’s a whole Talent Point investment.

I think we are the only class that has 4 talents to improve our class Defensive yet even if we select all 4 it’s still underwhelming.

Honestly the reasoning why we have poor defensive and survivability is probably they are tuned around Frenzied Regeneration, it’s seriously just needs to go.

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Unlike many of the comments here, I’m actually fine with Frenzied Regen as a concept, and quite like shifting into Bear Form for defense and recovery (esp. Pre-Bear’ing something). With that being said, it’s a tricky thing to learn, because staying in it for too long is quite detrimental.
I say the problem is the fact it just DOES NOT heal… At least in PvP, it seems either completely bugged or just undertuned… And since %-based self-healing is MOST of the Druid defensive kit (outside of Resto ig), Dampening completely guts us as well (since we have no stops or immunities).

Now, for the amount of GCDs we take to do ANYTHING .vs. other specs right now… that just shows the age and wear of the Druid mechanics (Balance in particular – hint @ Eclipse mechanic ramp-up and lock-in, needing 2-4 GCDs on EACH TARGET to even START TRYING to burst… only to be shut down or waste the CDs lol)

For the amount of GCDs to be worth it if the mechanic remains, the numbers need to justify that better. Ideally, though, I completely agree with this thread. We need something new. I gave my idea of a shield above. It could be a passive alternative to Nature’s Vigil so we can ‘leech’ absorption off damage… a Balance talent, or a PvP talent… (Feral is for some reason apparently doing better defensively? Though, it’s still on the squishy end of melee…)

Boomkin just really suffers right now defensively. And I’m adamant that we need to be significantly better on that front, EVEN at the expense of some mobility, utility or CC. It’s why I chose Boomkin over Mage. Our strengths should justify the playstyle archetype. Unfortunately, though, it seems that class design ‘theory’ (classic rules of thumb e.g. armor scaling per type, less mobility = more survivability etc.) is just lost largely as of late, esp. since DF.

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I also like pre-bearing into something as a concept(as a LAST resort). However, I just won’t if i’m not 100% sure i’ll die otherwise. Most of the fights, if I don’t threatened to die, I won’t even pop into bear form for the whole fight. Only for Stampeding Roar.

TLDR; Frenzied Regen is a last resort button. If I can stay in boomkin form and continue dpsing, I will.

Edit: I replied to the wrong comment, I don’t know how to change the target reply.

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We, and I cannot express this enough, DO NOT need loss of mobility in this day and age where every melee class has a means of staying on top of you. Frenzy needs to be given a number and not be a % healing spell. That is outdated for heals. If it was a shield, then this is understandable being a % based number. Blizzard need to give it a substantial number for it to work, allowing for it to crit if lucky.

Barkskin needs to be looked at. Yes it allows for heals to be increased, but 20% baseline damage reduction and a talent boosting it to 30% walled behind a 2 point talent that balance and resto DO NOT NEED (instincts of the claw) is ridiculous. The small shield it gives with another talent point is paper thin compared to damage received.

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These are great points and ideas. The reason I said “give us more survivability at the expense of other things”, is because it appears that nowadays they just don’t give out significant buffs to hybrid specs that can do it all…

I still think there’s been a major design fail… I’d say that started in Warlords, where mobility started trickling back in unequally… in fact, favouring melee specs. BfA was a good respite where things could clearly complement or counter each other IMO, but towards its second half with so much Haste and Corruption shenanigans amping up… Well, we were quickly back then to a rushed, un-pruned mess in DF, with things not scaling properly. In PvP, for example, Balance Druid relies on Precognition (Vicious Cognitive Bloodstone), and I think that speaks volumes.

So, the reason I say “nerf mobility” is because I think we’d have no choice but to trade-in one thing for another… and I, for one, would prefer if Druids were tankier in the PvP meta specifically (and I guess it would also be nicer in PvE, not having to spam Regrowth a dozen times, or shift into Bear only to barely… heal for anything worthwhile). There definitely ARE easy fixes we could get for now, though, like reverting the DF hybrid mana for healing value change (Stronger but more expensive Regrowth for non-Resto), and fix or buff Frenzied Regen somehow. Renewal is still pretty great, but also gets nuked by every MS effect and dampening… Ultimately, I hope the time will come when some of our abilities are core mechanics will just be revised more thoroughly and thoughtfully.

I think a number-based FR would be great, though, and I’ve always wanted some form of more substantial shielding, leeching or anything along those lines for Druid. I miss Savage Defense in its early iterations… In fact, I suggested perhaps that could replace FR as an absorb, as a talent option. Let’s keep on discussing, submitting suggestions and raising ideas… I guess :smiley: and hold out hope that better tuning can help us capitalize on our strengths until (hopefully!) a re-design EARLY ON in the testing cycles of Midnight 12.0… (because basically nothing changed during this one, until it was way too late for anything meaningful, and there are still issues with the talent trees… Even though, in the case of Boomy, I’m quite happy with 11.0.5, and just think Eclipse needs to be addressed next, besides our recovery).