Disliking one semi-permanent choice doesn’t mean you have to dislike all of them. We chose our classes to start our adventure in. The game doesn’t exist until you select your class. Covenants are temporary borrowed power like every other expansions feature. They’ll be here for another year and that’s it. Ideally, I’d like to be able to enjoy them as much as I can on the character that I chose to start my journey on 10 years ago.
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Do you think that the difference between Aldor and Scryer was anywhere close to the difference between covenant options?
Put all the numbers aside. Don’t worry about min/maxing or damage for a second. Strictly from a gameplay perspective, how on earth did that impact the gameplay anywhere near as much as a covenant does?
Builds change entire rotations. And I’ll just, at this rate, never bother to try out other rotations because the game doesn’t do a good job incentivizing me to care to swap ever and instead I’ll just pick the best all around covenant and stick with it because it’s not worth the risk of swapping off of it (and conduit energy limits the amount of experimenting I can do for. .some reason)
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Doesn’t which is what makes Covenants so much better (and TBC showing how it’s old and horrible even more)
Allowing conduits from multiple will make cookie cutter specs even more pronounced and there will be one that is actually better than other to the point that people pretend covenants are as will involve using all the ‘best’ conduits.
What is preventing you from enjoying them?? If you leave to level another one, your old one stays where it is. Your conduits carry over. You can switch multiple times a week if you want. Nothing but being able to change between all four in rested areas will satisfy you. It isn’t happening. Get over it.
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There are specific recipes and gear for Aldor and Scryer, so I’d argue it was more so. And guess what?? You could level one to Exalted, and then go do the other. It wasn’t painless, but certainly possible. Covenant switches are a joke compared to that grind.
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It’s the same mentality of anti-flyers, they want it dictated to everyone else because they cant control themselves.
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But you can’t swap back, which means there is no reason for me to risk swapping around if I don’t like it. The thing you call “meaningful choice” is really just de-incentivizing /played time. And in an mmorpg, that’s bad
The better thing for you to do would be to get over that this is my feedback. I’m not asking you to remain in the thread if it bothers you that much that people want to play more than one build if they have the capacity for it.
Changing builds is not a bad thing. Stop acting like it is. It’s never been detrimental to the game to be able to functionally play more builds. It encourages creativity.
I’m not sure if you’ve paid attention to that builds people use in raids and dungeons, but it literally cannot get any worse than it is now. This is the most cookie cutter the game has been in a long, long time.
If you’re going to try and compare Aldor and Scryer to covenants, you aren’t discussing this with good intentions and it’s not worth bothering. We have had many more similar and recent systems in place that do what Covenants do that did not have the restrictions (and were more successful) to compare to; you going all the way back to the BC system that had very, VERY little impact on your gameplay (if any at all) is intellectually dishonest.
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My only real complaint with Covenants is how the tree works. Let me pick where it put potency, finesse and whatever the tank one is.
Give us a max of 3 of a type, and let us slot it in wherever we want.
Also we should have the ability to have multiple setups. saved just like t-mogs.
PvP tank
PvP dps
PvP heals
M+ tank
M+ dps
M+ heals
Raid tank
Raid dps
Raid heals
Torghast setups
World PvP set-ups
Questing set-ups
Leveling set-ups
Instead we’re just stuck with what we have pretty much. Changing it is a pita, takes those stupid gems that are forever to recharge, and generally annoying.
Let us make savable templates for the Covenant conduit trees and I would be so damn happy.
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I can’t remember the last time I switched specs, let alone covenants.
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If you are coming from a min/max perspective, suggesting there is no difference between Aldor and Scryer is the intellectually dishonest argument. There is quite clearly BiS gear and recipes at release for specific classes based on what you choose. Back at a time when gear was static compared to now.
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I’ve said multiple times that min/maxing is far from the only incentive to wanting to try different builds. I already am my BIS covenant, if it were just min/maxing why would I want to swap?
I also very specifically mentioned rotations and gameplay, which Aldor and Scryer did not change anything at all as they were just passive benefits. Covenants introduce entirely different rotations and playstyles depending on your choice.
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I don’t think they should be locked anymore, but I also think that the system as a whole is a waste if it’s never going to be a truly-optional thing. Better to just dissolve covenants and bake the “essentials” from each into their respective classes so at least there’s not yet another thing to have to juggle (I hated having to keep a library of Azerite gear in BfA to swap out situationally and don’t want more of that).
Then switch to your non-BiS Covenant and try it for the love of God. If you like it, great. If not, you have to wait (the horror!!!) 48 hours and do 20 minutes of quests to go back.
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I’m not sure you’re reading my responses clearly. Maybe take a little break and re-read.
It also takes 2 lockouts to swap back, not 48 hours.
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The more we lock people into covenants, the more sub numbers will go up! it’s so simple!
You know what a “locked” choice is?? Choosing Sylvanas or Saurfang at the end of the War Campaign or the Phalynx/Larian quest in Bastion that will eventually reward a mount. Covenants are most decidedly not.
It does make sense, otherwise players could just switch their race or faction freely as well. Choices do have meaning, even if it’s just some action game to you.
People opting to avoid content completely rather than just doing it with a slightly inferior conduit, or waiting a day to recharge conduit energy, is their choice. It seems like a silly one, but it is still their choice, ultimately.
See, it actually has people playing more than they would if it was unlocked.
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I actually have 16 characters slated to be max level before the end of SL for just this reason. 4 of each armor type, one of each of those in a different covenant.
I had to double up on Mage, Shaman, Hunter and DK to pull it off.
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Thanks, I needed a good chuckle today.
I’ve been following this thread for a little while and it just amazes me what folks decide to debate. I personally would like to have two different covenants for my shaman since one of her specs does extremely well on one covenant, but when I switch specs, it sucks. But then having the ability to use the secondary covenant in order to work with that other spec would really be great and fix the “suck” part.
I would much rather have covenants tied to a spec rather than just the player. That would give us more than one covenant to work with of course, which would increase the dailies and such. However, if one covenant works best with one spec of the shaman, but not the other spec, why can’t we have a different covenant for that other spec?
…sigh…just wishful thinking here. I don’t plan on debating it, as it is a personal concern and I just work with what the game provides.
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I honestly don’t care if they’re locked or not, I would stick with Kyrian from an RP/story perspective. I would hope to at least champion the others, too, but choice is nice. Maybe the number four was chosen a la Horsemen of the Apocalypse 