Flying: Why must we wait until 8.2?

Community General Discussion
923

Just as idiotic as labeling all that want flight back as babies, the ones that want flight can be broken down into 2 camps: those that want flight from the get go and those that want flight once they do the achievement for it.

This is an example of the first set, unwilling to even play the game on one character to do things that come over the course of actually playing WoW and not world of queuecraft. Anyone that hates pathfinder because it is a “list of chores” is a whiny entitled brat that drag the rest of us down.

I fall into the second group, I have no issues getting pathfinder as it is things I’d be doing anyway, my only gripe is once I complete it, I should be able to fly. If it has to wait till the first patch, fine, not happy about it but there could be reasons for that. However, new land in patch content should also have a pathfinder of its own if Blizzard really wants to do multiple parts of pathfinder.

To put it into terms ones like the idiot I first quoted can understand: there are those of us that play the game, do the work, etc. so by all means we have “unlocked the cheat code” to better enhance our future play throughs. No different then games that unlock things like invincibility or god mode once you have beaten a certain difficulty or even just the game in general.

1 Like
924

I’m in a third group, where I’m content to do Pathfinder but I’m not very excited about flying because I don’t think it’s a fun system and I want to see it improved. Would you welcome changes to flying that made it more meaningful to your character, or would you prefer that it remains strictly a convenience?

Honestly I’m just happy to finally have some transparency from the pro-Flying side of the argument.

925

I am a paying customer and if the game does not contain features I like, I don’t buy.

Period. I will spend my money elsewhere until and unless WoW rises to its former standard of greatness again. Not holding my breath.

I don’t know where you get off comparing player transportation to god mode but you are waaaay off base. Flight doesn’t help you accomplish anything in the game except travel.

And I don’t know about you but I spent a lot of time and effort farming my flying mounts and paying for flight for each of my characters. I also bought some mounts for real money. The fact that I can’t use any of these mounts to fly in current content until it is irrelevant has prompted me to decide not to buy any expansions where I can’t fly the moment I reach max level. I also don’t spend money in the store anymore. It’s a matter of consumer choice. That’s mine.

5 Likes
926

I think it’s the frustrations of what they tack on to Pathfinder each time, that cause people to get upset and just would rather have it at max level for gold. I mean… I still did Loremaster achievements, and tried to play and explore the game when I had flying already. Its just that it was my choice and when its a choice, its fun. When it’s forced, it kinda sucks the fun out of it. I would be more then fine with Pathfinder if it made sense and stuck only to finishing the story and fully exploring the world. Then they start tacking on things in Pathfinder that have nothing to do with any of that. It starts losing its whole point, and its no longer about really playing the game to play the game. It becoming just how many more hoops can we tack on to this. The more they have to do, the longer they are forced to play without flight, and the more monthly subs we are keeping.

Part 1 is more then fair. Part 2 and anything after it, is ridicules.

3 Likes
927

Again, flying mounts don’t magically appear under a player and decide to whisk them away from combat. PvPers themselves always make the decision whether to engage or not. Otherwise, Warmode would be a raging success. But it isn’t, and flight isn’t even implemented.

3 Likes
928

You have a very reasonable chance of success when rezzing at a distance from your body to mount up before people realize you’ve gotten up. I never made the claim that it was effortless, I just claimed it was a factor and you haven’t disproven it.

929

I have often wanted threats in the air, ala anti-air cannons like in BC Orgril’la or the huge birds in Skettis in BC. But one step at a time, I’ll settle for convenience till the devs get their heads out of their rear ends and make content made for flight.

I have not seen flight be removed, just a different way of getting it, your argument is less “if the game does not contain features I like, I don’t buy” and more “if the game does not have things the way I like them, I don’t buy”.

If you are going by what you thought made it great, you might have a long wait. You are right that you are a paying customer, but guess what? so am I, who is to say what you want is what is right for the game, and by that same token, who is to say what I want is right for the game?

Hey smart one, that part was directed at one that said flight was a “cheat code”, what is one of the common cheat codes in games? God mode. I was trying to get something through a thick skull using language they used.

As did I, in fact I was happy when they announced doing pathfinder would unlock flight on all characters on an account. One of my past arguments has been to let those that want to pay gold for flight, do so, but keep pathfinder for those of us with a lot of alts or a lack of gold on all toons.

Well, lets look at BFA pathfinder:
Level to 120
Explore all areas
Loremaster for your factions zones
War campaign complete (could be considered completing that part of the story)
Revered with all factions you can hit revered with, should be practically done with Loremaster
X amount of unique dailies…ok, this is the one weak part in it, only reason I can see it is to help with the rep part.

agreed

My idea for part 2+ would be, using legion as the example, unlocking flight for the broken shore but part 1 unlocked it for all of the broken isle leveling zones.

930

We don’t have flight yet and players won’t even turn on Warmode so much that Blizzard is implementing even more bonuses to entice players back. That’s not flight’s fault — even PvPers don’t want to engage in world PvP.

Again, the presence of flying mounts are only a scapegoat because they’re the most visible means of disengaging. But PvPers have always disengaged and run away. First it was Mithril Spurs and Carrot on a Stick, later Riding Crops. Now, it’s a flying mount. The fact of the matter is the player ultimately makes the decision to engage or disengage, whether they run, ride, or fly away or simply log out. No one is guaranteed an HK which seems to be what world PvPers want. You could ban flying mounts entirely tomorrow and world PvP would still be dead. Matter of fact, that’s exactly where we are with Warmode without a flying mount in sight.

4 Likes
931

We’re just going to keep talking passed one another at this point.

932

I don’t feel I have to justify my reasons for not liking the current state of the game. It seems as if you feel I should. Am I misinterpreting?

3 Likes
933

To state the obvious facts, people NEVER had to fly even if the Devs gave everyone flying. Yet, everyone flew. If everyone who cried and sniffled about lack of immersion simply didn’t fly and if you were the majority many claim to be, then there wouldn’t be an issue. That is what makes it a YOU problem.

The lack of flying has NOTHING to do with immersion.

2 Likes
934

There’s a big difference between limits set by the game and then the limits you set for yourself.

935

I agree! I came back after a couple of years on break because I spent a lot of time getting my flying and I spent some real cash money to get a couple of the flying mounts and then they took flying away. I don’t recall pathfinder when they first took flying so now I am thankful now that they at least gave us a path to get flying back. But I’m disheartened to hear that I may not get my flying back even if I finish the achievements that I’ve been spending hours and hours on. This is new news to me!

And people who are anti-flying - Don’t fly, like ever - no one says you have to do it. Quit complaining that there is flying when you have every right not to fly.

Heck, if the Devs really cared about immersion, they could find ways to bring people together without taking away flying. This has nothing to do with immersion.

6 Likes
936

You’re missing the entire reason why players don’t like flying.

Let me put it to you like this: There’s that Iron Man challenge where you wear no armor, use only gray-quality weapons, and if you die you have to delete the character and restart. You can do this if you want to, but you’re being very impractical for an arbitrary challenge.

I don’t want my ground mount to be an arbitrary challenge. I want the decision-making aspects of how I navigate the world to be a core part of the gameplay, not an inconvenience I take on just for immersion.

Flying is a system that offers no engagement. It gives you player agency, but it gives you way too much of it, and you’re not doing anything with it. The argument against flying isn’t about immersion, and the argument for flying is all about convenience and making things easy.

937

I haven’t read through all the posts so take this with a grain of salt.

I am unsure where this comes in so I don’t see how this has to do with anything considering the iron man challenge itself is your personal choice.

Also, the whole point of flying is for convenience because it allows you to navigate through areas much easier and quicker. Also with the whole pvp aspects well, with warmode now being a thing it should not really matter. Pvp is already currently messed up because of warmode so I wouldn’t bring that into the argument yet considering they haven’t totally fixed it.

1 Like
938

No worries, welcome to the discussion. Enjoy your stay, and I hope you’ve got all your inoculations in order so you don’t catch anything you didn’t already come in with.

You’re right, it’s entirely personal. The point that I’m making is that there is a difference between constraints set by the game and the constraints set by a player onto themselves. When the game does it, that’s what you signed up for. When you do it, you’re often doing it by inconveniencing yourself in some way. I want my mounts to remain a part of my gameplay, not an inconvenience.

I can’t and don’t argue with that. The only thing I’d like to see is a better system of flying that isn’t just convenience and time saving because by any objective measure those aren’t rewards in the way other game systems offer, like character customization, character progression, diversity in talent build, etc.

939

Using your ground mount instead of a flying mount is not an arbitrary challenge. There’s nothing impractical about it. If you wish to be more engaging with the environment, you can. Your ground mount is very much a core part of gameplay even if other people are using flying.

My argument to have my flying back has everything to do with the time I spent to earn flying. They give us something awesome and then they take it away. I enjoyed flying so much, I spent real cash money to buy the awesome flying mounts. I’d keep buying the awesome flying mounts if I could use them in the zones I’m questing in. I get if my character isn’t 120, that my leveling characters should have to spend a bit more time and it should be more difficult.

You’re missing the entire reason why plays DO like flying…

Yes, there’s no argument that it’s nice to fly to the top of the mountain instead of going around in circles until I can find the one path to get to the top. I do not like wasting my time traveling, I want to use the little time I have to game more wisely. Sometimes having convenience is nice. I’d like to save the hard stuff for when it really matters instead of spending 30 or more minutes trying to get where I want to go because the landscape is difficult to navigate.

4 Likes
940

Of course it’s impractical. There’s no limitation, no setback, no consequence to flying whatsoever. As soon as I’m in a group, whether it’s with randoms in the LFG tool to do WQs or with my friends to do Mythics, I go from using my ground mount as gameplay to being an inconvenience because I move much more slowly. I’m going to grant that flying is totally convenient, but you gotta meet me halfway and acknowledge that when players have access to ground AND flying mounts, the ground mount immediately goes from core gameplay to impractical.

Conveniences are nice, but no one wants to be impractical for no good reason.

941

Well, I am 100% in favor of giving no-fliers a server of their own on which you can’t fly anywhere. I would offer free transfers on to that server. But paid transfers off.

There are so many empty servers, I don’t see why one hasn’t been set aside just for this purpose. If there is a widespread audience for such a world, I’m sure it would make everyone happy.

5 Likes
942

Better yet, how about a “Mode” you can toggle on and off like War Mode? When it’s on, you can’t fly, but different things happen also. When you turn it off, you can focus on being time-efficient and using conveniences.