Fix the old content

[Kaurmine-area-52]

@Ðirestorm-goldrinn

Well, if Molten core was not a walking simulator I bet you would.

I certainly would not And I farm content on several classes for mog. How many of these groups could I find a week? When could I find them? I can clear MC anytime I want to right now, how would you convince the playerbase that a system where you have to clear 16 year old content with a full raid is worthwhile?

[Malbolgia-shadowsong]

@Ðirestorm-goldrinn

So there are lots of players complaining about not being able to solo old content any more. But to me this is not a level squish issue.

The fact that old raids and dungeons remain playable after the expansion is over while keeping their rewards creates a scenario where players are encouraged to spend insane amount of time running dozens of alts over and over and over again though mobs that don’t do damage, just to have an under 1% chance of dropping something that they are never going to use just for completion sake.

This is not good game design. If a game didn’t had this and added this intentionally it would be seen as the most stupid game design decision ever made. It is only accepted in wow because instead of adding this feature, it is just the result of old content degenerating with the release of newer ones.

All raids (and some dungeons) should scale with the player to max level. There is never a justification for anyone to be able to 1 shot the Lich King while dying to 4 random birds on the current expansion. The rewards should keep their original drop chance and still require an entire raid of players to clear it.

If you have invincible today it is not a proof for how skilled you are, it became a sign that you are very very bored and has nothing else to do besides mindlessly walking towards the boss while mobs chase you doing 1 damage each.

TLDR: Old raids should be hard, and reward players for defeating the challenge instead of very small chance of a reward for playing a walking simulator.

This would be like saying if you could go back to elementary school, they should scale up the tests to college level.

[Varsnax-emerald-dream]

We will fix old content as soon as we are finished fixing all the new systems within systems in Systemlands.

[Amani-rexxar]

@Raiimir-stormrage

@Amani-rexxar

Because we spent a rediculous amount to time decking out our 60 characters, for 60 raids, only for them to turn our characters into 25, and the raids to 30, thus meaning we need to go and create copy paste duplicates of all of our gear at a higher item level

One would think if you love 60 raids so much after 16 years, you’d be happy to do it again.

The difference in ilvl can’t be really that high anyway, gear doesn’t exactly go up many ilvls between level 25 and 30.

The better question is, why are you doing this in retail with Classic being a thing ?

The ilvl goes up enough to matter, as when you level you need more stats to retain the same % value. So you would need to replace the entire set to optimize, including low chance drop items, like my MH and OH, and also causing some of our hard to acquire gear, like my hunter crypstalker gear, needing replaced.

As I said, this is a concern with the twinking scene, more then the general populace, it’s ok if you don’t get it.

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Amani-rexxar

The ilvl goes up enough to matter

Dude, if we’re talking about Molten Core, even in Classic people didn’t even need a full raid of level 60s to do it. I think on retail you could 5 man it with Heirloom gear prior to this patch.

@Amani-rexxar

it’s ok if you don’t get it.

I don’t get why you’d do it in Retail rather than Classic if your goal is Vanilla content no. It’s easy enough in Classic, in retail its downright trivial.

[Amani-rexxar]

yeah we generally 5 man MC, meaning we do need to be stronger then normal, thus the min maxing.

And again, it’s the twinking scene, that’s why it’s not on classic, twinking in retail, is not meant to duplicate the classic experience, it’s to create characters to handle different expansions end game in different ways, as well as some using it for its pvp scene.

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Amani-rexxar

And again, it’s the twinking scene, that’s why it’s not on classic

So all you want to do is exp freeze and gank. Gotcha. I love when Blizzard messes with you guys.

@Amani-rexxar

as well as some using it for its pvp scene.

You must be enjoying those twink PvP queues since exp locked twinks get their own pool.

[Malbolgia-shadowsong]

You’d do MC in retail rather than classic to get the legendaries all for yourself. Also bloods sell for a lot along if for whatever reason you don’t have the pets that drop from there.

There are multiple reasons to do MC solo even though it’s trivial. Hell I like doing it by myself every few months cause it’s fun to do it by yourself every few months.

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Malbolgia-shadowsong

You’d do MC in retail rather than classic to get the legendaries all for yourself.

You can do that at cap. I would know, since I have both the Thunderfury and Sulfuras achievements. Guy is talking about doing it at level.

@Malbolgia-shadowsong

There are multiple reasons to do MC solo

Not what Amani was talking about, read again.

[Amani-rexxar]

There’s a reason many people who twink have duplicate toons just at different levels.

I had a 60, 70, 80, and my main 120 warlock, the lower 3 designed for their respective endgame expansions.

That’s what we do as twinkers. Now all of a sudden, the changes have basically made my 60 obsolete. This is a bad change, and can easily be fixed by reducing the level requirement of the vanilla raids to what it should be.

This change would have 0 negative impact, and only positive impact.

Why is this such a hard thing to understand?

[Malbolgia-shadowsong]

@Raiimir-stormrage

@Malbolgia-shadowsong

You’d do MC in retail rather than classic to get the legendaries all for yourself.

You can do that at cap. I would know, since I have both the Thunderfury and Sulfuras achievements. Guy is talking about doing it at level.

@Malbolgia-shadowsong

There are multiple reasons to do MC solo

Not what Amani was talking about, read again.

Topic was started by some guy who wanted to upscale the old raids to your level, is this not what the topic is about?

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Amani-rexxar

This is a bad change,

No, the overall leveling experience is much more healthy now. It’s a good change.

Messing with twinks is just the cherry on top.

[Amani-rexxar]

@Raiimir-stormrage

@Amani-rexxar

And again, it’s the twinking scene, that’s why it’s not on classic

So all you want to do is exp freeze and gank. Gotcha. I love when Blizzard messes with you guys.

@Amani-rexxar

as well as some using it for its pvp scene.

You must be enjoying those twink PvP queues since exp locked twinks get their own pool.

i rarely do twink pvp, note why I couldn’t care less about the xp lock bgs, and am instead talking about the botched raid requirements.

But nice strawman.

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Malbolgia-shadowsong

Topic was started by some guy

And I was replying to Amani, not Direstorm. If you’re going to interject, at least read the context.

[Kaurmine-area-52]

@Amani-rexxar

This change would have 0 negative impact, and only positive impact.

Why is this such a hard thing to understand?

It doesn’t affect me but I don’t want you to have stuff

[Ðirestorm-goldrinn]

@Lilhopper-moon-guard

same here! if i could’nt solo old raids, i’d never know what they were like at all. bad example: i love the klaxxi’s story in MoP, and i wanted to see it all the way through. if i could’nt solo old raids, i’d never know what happened to them (poor bug bois… such a tradgedy).

So you need to solo raids in order to know them? Why?

@Pebrock-kelthuzad

You do realize people can have fun with things that you don’t enjoy right?

How is removing the content from old raids and reducing the rewards makes anything more fun?

@Titanspite-stormrage

i like my pace, and taking the time. also not having to share drops

What use is not having shared drop then the drop rate gets reduced 100 fold?

@Rsweet-thunderfury

Activision is just bleeding this company dry. They do not care about the long run of the game, or the legacy this game will hold.

Ok, but how is removing old content and replacing them with walking simulators helping them with it? Keeping old raids relevant seems like the perfect recipe to having a lot of content for players to do, and it wouldn’t even take dev time.

@Silverleigh-drakthul

Yes, it is.

It keeps people playing and sub money coming in.

How is turning old raids into walking simulators keeping people playing? Why is everyone advocating for content to be removed and reward chances being lowered? Giving people a reason to get a group and go into old raids for a good reward is a much bigger incentive for people to keep subbed.

@Kaurmine-area-52

How many of these groups could I find a week? When could I find them? I can clear MC anytime I want to right now.

Sure there are no MC groups right now, there is no reason at all for there to be one. But if groups were needed to go in, why would players not form them?

@Kaurmine-area-52

how would you convince the playerbase that a system where you have to clear 16 year old content with a full raid is worthwhile?

Because there are good rewards inside them?

@Malbolgia-shadowsong

This would be like saying if you could go back to elementary school, they should scale up the tests to college level.

No, it would be like saying that if you go play Diablo 2 now, it has mechanics and bosses do damage. Imagine turning Diablo 2 into a walking simulator with really low drop rates just because Diablo 3 got released.

[Totesmlotes-thrall]

It sure is Sunday. What a terrible opinion.

[Amani-rexxar]

@Raiimir-stormrage

@Amani-rexxar

This is a bad change,

No, the overall leveling experience is much more healthy now. It’s a good change.

Messing with twinks is just the cherry on top.

Nobody is saying to alter the leveling experience, reverting the raids to 25, would have no impact on it.

And again, you are deliberately showing you would rather see a portion of the playerbase get shafted, just for laughs.

Pathetic

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Amani-rexxar

Nobody is saying to alter the leveling experience, reverting the raids to 25, would have no impact on it.

You leveling up to 30 in 30 minutes wouldn’t either.

Your toon isn’t even using a single piece of Vanilla raid gear.

They aren’t going to change it, you’ll need to adapt. Think of it this way : now your level 30 toon is good for Vanilla/TBC/WotLK on a single toon!

[Ðirestorm-goldrinn]

What a terrible reply