I’ve been pretty successful and had no wipes so far pulling the 3 pack and 2 pack closest to the cave. I’m able to cycle through defensives and group AoE stuns.
I can see that.
The problem with it is once the tank starts moving it becomes much harder for the dps to stay in “melee” of every single wolf at the same time, especially if you have any casters.
The wolves target ranged players, not players at range, but it can still get messy if a melee DPS pulls aggro and gets bit up for sure
Pretty sure its players at range, not ranged players. I’ve been able to bunch in with my tank and get every leap going on our rdruid as a shadow priest. I just can’t stand still to cast anything once the tank has to kite.
I triple checked this with players more qualified then me before stating it but hey you never know! Ive been wrong before 
Fair, may have just gotten real lucky then.
Shame, I thought I’d finally found a way to stand still and cast as a ranged dps in dragonflight…
1 Like
They were achievements built into the game back in Legion. There is nothing being exploited in regards to either dungeon. HoV Kings requires your group to be able to do 2-4 at once and on Fortified weeks and can be pretty terrifying. Getting the NPC correct first time actually punishes the group with longer dialogue so how are you considering either of these an exploit?
Just skip the wolves, they are the pain in the neck to kill.
How can you tell whether or not it’s an exploit if you’ve never played in Legion? It’s a really obscure “hack” to get around RP.
It’s an obvious exploit because the Kings aren’t accessible after you activate the first one. However, by using beer you force them to reset their own script, thus you are able to able activate them regardless of the game script. Anything that forces NPCs to work in a way that wasn’t intended is called an exploit.
Blizzard has self-reset as a script protection for bosses, and world NPCs, but no for other NPCs in an instance. Old-world dungeons weren’t scripted well, thus, there come exploits. Some of them are hot-fixed, and others are ignored because the dungeons are used only once for good, they don’t want to spend many resources on one-time dungeons.
The kings strat worked great, I finally, finally timed +12. I spent all week running HOV +10 to +12 pug groups for only to miss the timer every single time, today the strat worked like a charm. It was the tank that used this strat and know it’s a cheez, but as I said, it timed the key.
If these are “exploits” then why did they get left in? Why would they leave the beers in when they did all of this tuning prior to the dungeon even coming out in beta? Sure, maybe they overlooked it but people have been doing this since BETA. If this was not intended, Blizzard could have easily just removed the beers by now, problem solved. It’s not exactly a secret that we have been using this strategy.
Same thing with Court, i’m sure Blizzard could hotfix to make either the short or long RP occur every time in keystone dungeons, but again, they have not. I wouldn’t exactly call it an “exploit” to intentionally mess up a feature of the dungeon and not get the long rp, that is the dungeon working as intended. You pick the wrong person or leave a statue on first boss, short rp. Not an exploit.
An exploit would be, i don’t know, groups snapping last boss of AZ to the 3rd boss platform, or season 4 dragging iron docks 3rd boss up to last boss platform and negating all of their mechanics. THAT, is an exploit.
The timer is completly off yeah… people doing it on 15’s won’t feel it, but everyone trying to do this on 20+ keys can feel it. I did a +20 HoV today with 3 deaths, all of them followed by immediate bres so we could keep fighting, no healing casts went off, everyone with 77k + overall dps and we didn’t manage to time it. 38 mins is just not enough. If you’re not doing lower keys or you’re not a player as good as someone from Echo or Limit, the timer is completly off.
2 Likes
Keep the timer as is… just reduce the trash count.
No one wants to be in a dungeon for 40+ minutes or whatever. HoV just has a ton of walking, and RP. Most of the dungeon is not doing dungeon things.
Let us skip more of that forest nonsense, and the dining hall.
Well put I never considered how excessive the trash required is for the dungeon
Because sometimes they never get around to fixing things. Reasons might be that there are higher priority bugs or issues to be handled, or that they try to fix something, cause further issues, then shelve it until they can come back to it later, or it just never really gets reported/noticed. Sometimes they decide not to fix something because it would cause players to regress in a way that they feel can’t easily be changed.
We’ve had plenty of examples of this sort of thing, like wall-jumps that weren’t intended remaining in the game for an entire expansion or longer, before later being fixed.
Even if that is true, and they simply have not had time, they would have at least brought in either the ban hammer or disqualifying people from the 0.1% title. They have not announced either such thing. They HAVE been very consistent with that, just look at last season (again) where people were accepting a classic quest for a buff to be able to push one maybe 2 key levels higher, they were all removed from eligibility for the title.
I still don’t think you can call this an exploit. There is an achievement for throwing a beer at all 4 kings, which means its intended to work this way.
1 Like
I doubt I can convince you otherwise, but there is plenty of precedent where they have been wildly inconsistent about applying bans, or anything like that. Most things that are even clear bugs, or exploits of unintended interactions are merely hotfixed.
You can even draw parallels to the Jade Serpent 3rd boss stair interaction. Clearly stairs weren’t supposed to mess with the z-axis and trivialise a mechanic, so it was simply hotfixed. To my knowledge, no groups that did that were banned. Even if they were to go around doing that, it gets incredibly messy - it’s much harder to throw out a banhammer when it’s potentially a bunch of random people at the mercy of one tank telling them to do something when they didn’t even know it was a thing, than it is to take action against a handful of coordinated groups deliberating doing a thing repeatedly.
The achievement exists to provide some flavour interaction in Mythic. That’s what most Glory achievements are, they’re side/optional content for funsies and a mount. It was just about doing a “fun” thing where 4 people in the party had to coordinate something. It’s not even the first of its kind - it’s basically just a different flavour of https://www.wowhead.com/achievement=5799/only-the-penitent.
The idea that it was intended to translate from there to a combat/timer benefit for Mythic+ is absolutely wild. I actually don’t even remember if this bug worked the same way back when Legion keystones existed.
If I had to speculate, that’s probably the core issue. The achievement still exists, and is required for the Glory meta-achievement. The M+ dungeon uses the same base template as the Mythic version of the dungeon, which is legacy content. It’s entirely plausible that they’ve developed a box where (for now) they can’t change one without affecting the other.
I think we’ll have to agree to disagree haha. I agree with the idea that it was VERY likely not installed with the intent of using it to fight all of the kings together instead of one by one. However, I still wouldn’t consider it an exploit; you are using a feature of the dungeon to your advantage to have a higher probability of timing your key.
Thank you for being civil in our disagreement, I’ve seen a lot of people get unnecessarily aggressive because one person says something they don’t agree with.
1 Like
You’ve essentially described what an exploit is. If you find elements of a game that are bugged/glitched, or interacting in a manner that was not intended by the designers, and then use that to give yourself any substantial advantage, you’re participating in exploiting.
NP 