Feedback: Stop designing anything for Esports. Full stop

It had nothing to do with a tournament because those are held on tournament realms which are frequently on different balance patches from the live game anyway.

They felt severely nerfing destro/survival at that point would immediately cause the highest keys possible to time to be keys pre-nerf, and trying to time the same or higher level keys later in the season after the nerf would have likely been impossible.

Which I think is a fair point. Yes, the nerfs should have come sooner (like on the PTR), but they didn’t.

I agree, although I think pvp kinda is an eSport, or at least isn’t hurt by that approach to balance and tuning.

exactly they use to do huge nerfs week one when people were super op yes its because esports as well as tuning is nowadays they make stuff super annoying just to slow down world first raiders as well as keys which it takes forever til the nerfs get to the point were the majority of players can even get past the first few bosses in mythic.

I think it’s hilarious when the devs make changes for them and it changes nothing about how they play but makes the game worse for pros and everyone else. Honestly, I’m beginning to think it’s just a design principle at this point.

I agree none of the content in Wow should be a competition its that toxic mentality that has segregated players from each other and created these divides. anyone even less experienced should be able to experience all the content in Wow regardless of gear level or skill.

The toxic raiding community has gate-kept mythic+ for gear progression for raiding and the purpose of mythic+ was to provide a challenge for casuals who had limited time to raid to have access to raid-quality gear. Blizzard knows this and has actively added more ways for elitists to condone access to these features in the game and deny others, for example, raider IO’s entire purpose is to filter out anyone, not as experienced or “geared” and should be banned from use in the game.

It blizzards game, if they continue the game will have fewer and fewer players who are here to have fun and mainly people competing for an Ilvl but again they can stop all of that if they wanted to and those “toxic” players would go find other games more competitive and Wow would start growing again possibly.


Thousands of guilds are past the first 2 mythic bosses right now and they haven’t been touched. In general they err on the side of too hard and nerf, because if they release something too easy and buff the playerbase loses their mind. Like SBG and CoS should be buffed for anyone that cares about dungeon balance, but players would revolt instead of saying “yes that’s a logical balance change”

They’ve been doing weekly hotfix adjustments pretty much every week except for the holiday break.

Your comments don’t align with reality for most of the game. Any difficulty at all gets blanket thrown at “esports” instead of WoW.

Back in Vanilla when like 50 guilds in the world did Naxx (significantly more exclusive than any modern raid) were you here talking about it’s because they design the game for esports and the 1% and that’s why they didn’t nerf fury warriors? I just want to make sure we are consistent is all.

The blue hotfix thread, started on 12/19 has been updated on the following dates:



Why? Who are you to define what is supposed to be an Esport or not? If people want to watch people compete over it, than it is their choice.

What part of the game do you think is being designed for Esports? You keep saying that it shouldn’t and all evidence points to it not being, so what is the point of this thread? Be more specific.

This is exactly what I hate. First time I ran some of these DF dungeons on normal, the tank is taking the Mythic+ route through instead of just gathering up enemies to AoE down. I was able to follow them alright, but we had one person who got too close to something and aggroed a pack. We killed it with no problem, then they got vote kicked by the rest of the party.

I used to love tanking; I know all of the WotLK and Cata dungeons like the back of my hand from how many times I tanked those on heroic. Now I don’t know the routes, I don’t know the skips, and I don’t want to get flamed and kicked because I accidentally pulled a pack that we’re supposed to run past with an invisibility pot.

I want to go back to a mix of Pandaria and Wrath. Replace M+ with challenge modes. No outgearing it, no cheesing it. All the rewards are cosmetic or valor. And then BRING BACK BADGE GEAR FROM WRATH. I never raided in Wrath because I started too late, but by the time Cata released, I was decked out in 232s from Emblems of Frost. Let us use heroic dungeons as a way to get gear (slower than raiders), and let the people who want to push themselves have the scaled challenge modes with a timer and cosmetic rewards.


no. and git gud

Pretty sure the people who make the game get to say what it is supposed to be.

The interesting part is people skip much more trash on normal/heroic/mythic than in mythic+ because of the forced trash % requirement.

So I’m not sure how the blame gets put on mythic+ routes when mythic+ dungeons skip less things.

Ah, something that has actually happened.

Problem is, for the vast majority of players “The Meta” is only relevant in the sense that you’re more likely to get an invite from some rando in the LFG window if you’re playing a FOTM class/spec. For everything else, it doesn’t matter how much damage rogues, or warlocks, or survival hunters (lol) are doing in the hands of the top X% players.

agreed 100%

Correct. A huge portion of the playerbase pugs, and its very hard to do so as a spec that is perceived as bad.

Also, no matter what level of skill or content people play at, they don’t want to feel like they are holding themselves or their team back because they chose the wrong class/spec.

Pretty sure the people who pay their rent get to influence the game.

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why i dont like is making huge changes that gut some specs and drop them 2 tiers mid season. i think changes like this should be rerserved for patch days with a new season and they should actually test more in ptr or actually follow feedback

I agree. Esports has done a number on this game. Esports and RPG are like oil and water, they don’t mix and when you try one makes the other worse. You can have a good Esport or you can have a good RPG, but you can’t have both, and Esports suck so…


I think the game would be less balanced if there wasn’t esports

The entire concept of e"sports" is pretty cringe on top of everything else lol.

Well they shouldn’t, because they’re not.

What even are the “meta” DPS specs this season. Outside of like…outlaw?..I don’t think I’ve seen any class that’s any sort of outlier.