The biggest problem with steed is it doesn’t remove or suppress snares, stuns, or slows, so you need to spend time and additional defensives to use it in PVP. Example, you want to move quickly, you steed, you get slowed, you freedom, you get stunned, you BoP(or bubble), it gets removed early and you’re dead. Even if trinket was available, don’t worry, you’ll use it because you’re gonna catch another stun. Just kind of getting sick of using 3 abilities to try to walk quickly and then getting feared. So now I’m walking quickly in the wrong direction. Id prefer all cc to grant diminishing returns. I’m already stunning immune to stun targets, but Im not immune to cc myself anywhere near as often as I’d like. What I’d like is to participate in the game instead of spending a bunch of my RPG time living out my characters life as a sheep, penguin, or frog. Let me walk Blizzard! Please.
Let me be honest with you.
I have a hard time reconciling you saying “the biggest problem with steed” followed by a list of purely PVP problems.
Sounds like more of a PVP problem than Steed when you put it like this.
How does any of those things helps build on fantasy and orienting design?
I feel like those are just technical interaction of a game mode that is poorly balanced due to the game inherent limitations toward it.
PVP will be balance interdependently regardless of what they come up with on Hero Talents.
Hell, I wouldn’t be surprised if they made some of the nodes flat out disabled in PVP when everything is done.
Not wanting additional screen clutter and personal autonomy to place buffs on specific players is casual? Weird take.
Why I think Armaments needs to change:
-Tons of ground effects already that will make it harder to see the armaments
-If the armaments match the color or vibrancy of a dungeon floor/boss floor/arena floor it will be very difficult to see as some things already are.
-Potential situation where you throw the armament but fire spawns in that location, very frustrating.
-Potential situation where you intend to give your mage the armament but the hunter runs over it on accident. Also frustrating.
-Because it may be difficult to see sometimes due to ground clutter/other animations/etc, it could ruin the potentially cool animation this may have.
-Potential situation where you go to position the armament at someones location on your team and they get gripped/knocked/etc away. This is pvp specific but frustrating.
By changed I dont mean entirely, the buffing aspect is interesting but maybe it can be a Holy Guardian we summon that buffs a chosen player and yourself. Basically how armaments work now just with a different way of buffing the target with a potentially cooler looking animation that is easier to identify. I don’t mean guardian of ancient kings for the animation either, it can definitely look different but I personally think this would be the better way of going. Thats basically how the armaments seem to work anyway but just makes the process of buffing a player much less frustrating.
I actually really like the idea of armor imbues. I’m okay with buffing others, but don’t really like paladin (especially hpal) being thrown into a support role. It already leans that way enough with its utility and Blessing of seasons so I would definitely prefer this to be a way we can alter our own abilities rather than juggling giving buffs to other players constantly. It feels like we’re juggling a lot already with how many things we have. We already manage blessing of seasons+utility like freedom when its relevant on top of managing mana, healing and a builder spender resource.
I am in support of armor imbues fully. I also like the idea of each imbue doing something different if you put it on a different piece of gear. Maybe putting it on shield does something a bit more defensive, maybe weapon a bit more offensive, maybe gloves alters holy shock or something. I like the idea of it and I really love that it makes it more personal to the paladin.
Sounds like something someone that wants me to stay in crowd control would say. Yes, as it should be apparent to anyone that read it, my complaint with steed is a pvp problem. Retribution is the only spec I know of that doesn’t have a near instant or instant movement ability. Because slows and snares are exceptionally useful against us they are used against us at an exceptionally high rate. Having every spec have abilities that negates my only movement speed aiding ability feels bad. Forums are where you come to ask for change.
Hand of freedom breaks most of that doesn’t it? I’m NOT a PvPer so tbh I don’t know what it’s like. But for most things in PvE my hand of freedom does the trick.
all I know PvP it’s… stun stun stun stun stun lol
Had some more thinking on this
I still think its bad and needs to go away, but
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Make the shield its own distinct ability with an effect like barrier or aegis of aggramar
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Replace the weapon with a passive buff for party members that flares up when you activate wings
I was thinking the exact same thing. Two abilities on a charge system. It would be much more interesting that way. If we can also target specific people instead of just throwing it on the ground, and have it off the GCD, then it would be perfect.
Blessing of Freedom clears snares/roots/slows. Problem is it is REQUIRED to press it during steed to use steed due to snares/roots/slows, and then you get stunned because you moved. In reality if you MUST move fast your best bet would be Steed and Bubble. If you cant CC and interupt 2 Priests and 2 Warriors during your Bubble or BoP you dont get to keep it in battlegrounds. Bubble feels like a stun removal only because once you press it you have it removed unless your enemies are bad. Mass dispell is a 1min CD with a PVP talent. I’m hoping there is some form of Forbearance removal or additional CC protection offered with hero talents or elsewhere in Rets kit.
Steed can have a longer duration and 2 chaeges of use with 3 talent points spent, but is inferior to Warrior as an example. If you slow/snare/root Ret before during or after steed use they are stationary or very slow. So steed does not make you relocate as is your goal, without adding Freedom, trinket, BoP, or Divine Shield as needed. This is much different with warrior where if they have a slow, they can charge twice and intervene at normal speed for those abilities, and blade storm twice and be immune to all CC, and Heroic Leap. LoSing a Warrior is harder to do for a useful duration than Ret, and thats causing Ret some problems in PVP and might be a small portion of the problem with Ret being the lowest dps spec in raid.
Steed has nothing to do with that.
It’s all about the ST build having 0 cleave power.
I get it, you have functional problem with Steed.
However I don’t think it’ll ever be their aim to solve those problems with the Hero talents.
Make your party mount up and charge?
That could be a thing.
Transform it into “speed of light”?
Yup, it could be a thing.
None of those would help the PVP problems yet that’s the kind of things we should expect.
You want Prot Steed of glory on Ret, ask that but that’ll be a PVP talent.
What they want ideally with the Hero talent is make everyone go “oh wow that’s nice” and being unrootable/unslowable on Steed seems like the kind of things that would be very underwhelming for a metric ton of people who really don’t care about PVP.
Like, just the fear talent in there must be the most tone deaf idea I’ve seen across the talents.
When there’s a fear, you either interrupt it, los it or you have something to ignore it.
50% reduced fear duration is the kind of thing no one want to see in there but might have PVPer go " ahh I could use that".
Do you see what I mean?
If I understand correctly, Hero Talents should create the classic Warcraft themed atmosphere.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t know where the hell this Lightsmith concept came from…
That said, I think the game play looks “interesting”, but it doesn’t match what we see of paladins today: a sacred WARRIOR who uses light, and not someone capable of conjuring light items.
Lightforged
I disagree templar that should focus on steed. It should focus more on the martial aspect of the class, sometjing we are lacking in showing espaicially with ret since most of their skills is ranged.
Maybe show off the warrior part of holy warrior and allow us to use a sheild/2-hander and make a play with a fused srild of the righteous and divine storm, or maybe a lounge forward attack using a sheild bash follwed by a weapon stab.
Instead of dropping stuff on the ground, why not Lightforge someone’s weapons and \ or armor for them (without asking of course) and \ or an ability to lightforge enemies to force them to be allies.
The War Within is going to introduce the Arathi, and I believe when some of that story is revealed, we’ll start to get a better idea of why titles like Herald of the Sun actually make a lot of sense.
As for this Lightsmith build, I have to echo a lot of the sentiment here, sadly. The concept is cool in terms of the aesthetic and theme, I see the “green lantern” idea coming through, but the name “Lightsmith” is bad and the gameplay for this sounds horrendous.
I think “Lightsmith” may just not be the right choice for the Prot/Holy Hero Talent in the first place. I can’t really think of a way to make a Lightsmith concept feel cool and exciting. It gives me more of a blacksmithing subprofession vibe than a hero class.
I’d rename it to Seraph or Guardian of the Light. From there, simply fill the tree with abilities that fix Consecration as well as making Light of Dawn, Judgement, Avenging Wrath, etc, more fun to use. Keep it simple.
SoD better
these are again, really really bad.
I don’t really have a preference on what any individual tree focuses on, to be honest. I’m merely using Divine Steed as an example. I hope the Hero Talents don’t fixate too hard on creating exclusive talents and there’s no overlap.
IE: Lightsmith is the only Hero Talent with a Avenging Wrath modification.
Well, good thing it’s just my feedback directed at people who aren’t you. 
But seriously, is there a reason why you are just so so angry all the time?