That also happens to every other non pet caster spec eventually.
1 Like
It should be. Not from a balance perspective, but from a fantasy perspective.
Somebody is going to start playing WoW today who has never played WoW. If the leveling experience is janky and incongruent for that person, they won’t stick around. Without new players, the game will wither and die.
I am all about positive change for the better. At level 80, in a raid, or dungeon, or arena, the 11.1 changes are objectively a massive improvement, and I welcome them. In other contexts, the loss of the pet sucks. My concern is in making sure those other contexts don’t get ignored in favor of high end competitive play.
5 Likes
Hey, Blizz, rather than just letting this endless infighting continue, can you like, just ******* address the concern of the marksmen pet hunters whose pets you are killing? Can you just come out and say something? Please? The longer this drags on the more stressful it becomes and it’s causing a lot of anxiety.
Don’t kill my marksman pet - I will die on this hill.
17 Likes
Other non pet related feedback:
The damage threshold on freezing trap is comical. You can get entire rapidfires off on people in freezing traps sometimes (you’re more likely to not break it if you get lucky/unlucky enough to not crit). It seems to be functioning on individual or discrete damage events, which draws a lot of concern for the other specs with similar changes. Assassination rogue for example with gouge and blind now working similarly. You’d probably rather they not be able to put full rows of dots on something and then just watch them die from 40-0 in gouge or blind because the individual ticks aren’t big enough to break them.
Hunters are not casters. They are currently the only physical ranged DPS class in the game.
10 Likes
This is opposite to existing effects on live, correct? Frost Nova and Entangling Roots for example, those are cumulative damage thresholds?
Should probably be a damage threshold in a given period - X damage done in the last Y seconds. Maybe have it break quicker for multiple subsequent hits to make it harder to spam a bunch of DoTs?
1 Like
Did more testing today on 11.1 marksmanship(667 item level) as a ST build using Dark Ranger. Initial burst damage is great (very front loaded) with all cool downs available and Aim Shot cast times are exceptionally low almost always below 2 seconds(if you have a tonof haste). If rotation is done well Aimed Shot casts stay acceptably short for maybe 20 seconds… then the rotation slows down very soon after some abilities are on CD like Rapid Fire. I can’t seem to get enough Rapid Fire availability to have all Aim Shots be quick enough to feel good. So burst damage is good with CDs, but without them damage and rotation speed drops below what is typical on live so that could be fixed with design or tuning to increase Rapid Fire availability. During burst, average Aimed shot damage of 706k isn’t bad, had some crits near 2 million, Black Arrow fires less often of course but its damage was slightly higher than AS per cast, Explosive Shot was even more damage than Black Arrow per cast, Rapid Fire and Auto Attacks using Shadow Surge were both just above 10% total damage done respectively. What was interesting was if you add the Razer Fragment Black Arrow damage to the normal Black Arrow damage, overall in the opener Black Arrow is the largest single damage source with Aimed Shot just below it, add Bleak Arrow damage to the other Black Arrow damage for a total of 34% of your damage in the opener coming from casting Black Arrow.
What I did not like was dps was only 1.5million after 30 seconds. When I do the same 30seconds of burst on live with less item level as Retribution it is 2.5million dps…so either I am playing the new MM quite wrong, or I would surmise it is quite undertuned. Over 1 million of missing dps to be equal to a spec with worse gear is odd to say the least.
7 Likes
I think so, but don’t hold me to it.
Yeah. They’re doing this because there are so many uncontrollable micro-aoe abilities making the break on damage cc’s unusable or ineffective in certain circumstances. The way I understand it, the point isn’t supposed to be making them pseudo fears that you’re able to gamble on, but rather making it possible to have all of the hero tree micro aoe functions and also use your CC abilities.
An example off the top of my head is reap the storm from arms warrior. You trap/poly/whatever the healer, the healer’s dps moves closer to the trapped healer, your warrior just casts mortal strike on them, but can’t control the fact that MS occasionally procs reap the storm for a modest amount of damage to everything close to it. I think the goal is to make those CCs no longer break on that type of damage, but not to the point where you can use them like fear.
1 Like
I think it’s all a bit undertuned–in PTR i tried several runs on the training dummies with my current gear, then again with the new tier set and ilvl 678 – all was a marginal increase, and in some specs (BM mostly) my AoE got WORSE with the newer gear.
Even with non-optimal secondary stats, the increased Agi should have BARE MINIMUM made it a wash, but it wasnt even ‘that’ good.
1 Like
Could be details needs an update. I didn’t use wows combat log. It was odd to see the top 4 damage sources looking nice, considerably better than live, but then the overall damage isn’t impressive somehow. More testing will come. Most of two hours I was copying over the character, reading and picking talents, importing my keybinds and macros, THEN I finally got some dummy time. Ill try out some pvp at some point.
1 Like
I think that it’s under tuned but also buggy in certain ways that make the tuning hard to measure. For example, if you’re currently using hydra, your pure ST damage is 30-40% higher than it should be because hydra is proccing itself on your target. My concern is that despite it needing to be tuned higher for throughput/dps, you’re still bursty enough to oneshot stuff in pvp (without using the bugs).
2 Likes
Right, we talked about some bugs you found, I did not test to see if any talent interactions were actually doing what they say they do.
2 Likes
Wouldn’t worry about numbers yet.
2 Likes
Please make the beast summon for Survival with pack leader not random.
every 30 secs have Kill command summon a wyvern or Wildfire bomb summon a bear or Mongoose bite summon a boar.
2 Likes
So ran more tests. Got AS to hit as hard as 3.5million with a 944k average, total Black Arrow damage sources at 9% more overall damage offered compared to AS which is to say both are strong. Got Rapid Fire up to 11.7% of overall damage with individual ticks of damage averaged at 118k, Explosive Shot hit for 1.78million on average. Auto shot damage overall % droped to 9.3% so I got more damage out of something else somewhere. Not too bad. Dps did increase to 1.91 million at the end of the 30 second burst, 57.3million damage in 30 seconds.
2 Likes
Treasurewhiskers, my beloved jingly mouse.
You make me run faster and I will miss your adorable squeaks and the ability to make you have a cute little nap.
11 Likes
I didn’t try because I imagine it will make me even more upset, but has anyone tried a Tier 11 delve with no pet yet to see how that goes? (comparatively)
2 Likes
i really like it imo everything feels like big synergy love that senti visual…played just pve and one arena i felt like people played just pve today…(eu server) arena>rapid fire saved me lol it was super close match against hunter hehe i really like hawk visuals too that intimidation snap on head looked and felt really good “BAM”! 
3 Likes
I’ve done a tier 11 delve on live with no pet. It’s not easy if you don’t make use of our cc and defensive cds but it isn’t impossible.
5 Likes
Yea, i definitely dont want random… i think it should be a spell combo such as:
every 30 seconds–
Kill Command + Butchery(SV)/Multishot(BM) = Bear
Kill Command + Wildfire Bomb(SV)/Barbed Shot(BM) = Wyvern
Kill Command + Raptor Strike(SV)/Cobra Shot(BM) = Boar
Not this exact combination, but something of the sort