Before Update:
Ranged physical specs with pet: 2
Ranged physical specs that never need a pet: 0
After update:
Ranged physical specs with pet: 1
Ranged physical specs that never need a pet: 1
You guys need to learn to share
1 Like
Your point is ?
They gave MM an option to go either pet or petless.
Pet for open world content like quests, wqs and delves if desired or petless for instanced content and even open world if desired.
Nothing was taken away from those that want to go petless or should I say those that want to go with the random proc eagle pet because all utilities for MM will be tied to it and not actual pets.
Once again my question is "Are people realy upset abot people having the option as mm to use a pet if they choose to do so or are they upset that they can no longer find enjoyment in others not being happy about losing pets as mm ?
Blizz changed if from a win (those not for pets)/loss (those for pets) to a win/win where both sides get what they want.
3 Likes
Ok? I agree. Why are people still bringing it up. Yes, there are a few weirdos who want other people to be unhappy. For most people it’s a win/win like you said. Not really any reason to keep trying to dig out the weirdos.
1 Like
At this point, aside talking about bugs, the continued discussion of pet vs petless is worthless and asinine. It’s already resolved.
This thread went south to the point it’s better to use the Bug report feature in PTR than to bring bugs and suggestions here, due to all the back-and-forth on non-issues.
4 Likes
thats exactly what happened tbh, the amount of usable feedback stopped to a grinding halt when people got pets back. it was clear that the design of the spec wasnt in their mind in general when making there posts. especially those MG fellows.
rpers arnt a good feedback source because all there feedback is visual and from a irrelevant source. they have pets again for world quests and their “special” goldshire adventures so thats all that matters
the fact this pet vs petless debate is still going and mucking up the feedback thread further, proves that the solution didnt matter.
3 Likes
bug list again
mm hunter
- Pets benefit twice from Dwarf and Tauren Racials
- The following spells benefit from Unnatural Causes twice or more. Black Arrow DoT (x3), AMoC (x2)
- MM gains triple value from Trigger Finger instead of double
- If an Aimed Shot with a Deathblow Kill Shot/Black Arrow spell queued triggers Deathblow, you will retain Deathblow/Razor Frags for your next Kill Shot/Black Arrow
- Unbreakable Bond pets retain their pet family special abilities.
- Double Tap procs from Volley and Trueshot overwrite each other
- Rapid Fire with Double Tap only fires 17 shots instead of the expected 18
- AotH will not strike targets adjacent to the primary target if they are just out of range, despite the fact the similar effects, such as Trick Shots, will.
- AotH will strike the primary target if no secondary target is present
- Even with other targets available, AotH will sometimes strike the primary target
- In some circumstances with multiple targets, AotH just stops working.
- The 15% damage bonus from Quick Draw will apply to a mid-cast Aimed Shot when LnL procs
- The buff from Ohn'ahran Winds applies an alternate version of Spotter's Mark that restores 20 focus on consumption
- Casting Rapid Fire resets the swing timer on Auto-Shots, leading to large stretches of time between Auto-Shots
- Attack speed buffs such as Trigger Finger and % Haste buffs such as Bloodlust reduce the value of In the Rhythm (ITR) and the 11.1 2pc tier set buff
- The 300% damage from the 11.1 4pc tier bonus only applies to the main target
- When triggering Precision Detonation, it is possible for all, some, or none of your affected Explosive Shots to gain the 25% damage amp.
- If another hunter has an Explosive Shot on your target when you trigger the 11.1 4pc that hunter's Explosive Shot can steal the damage amp from your set bonus
- Sentinel can immediately apply to mobs without casting abilities
- Sentinel debuff persists between arena rounds
- Sentinel DoT is able to tick multiple times per second
- The buff for Withering Fire reads: "If you would gain Deathblow, instead fire a Black Arrow at your target at 50% effectiveness." This is not what Withering Fire does
- Withering Fire procs fire off an inconsistent number of Black Arrows depending on targets that are within range but out of LoS
- On three or more targets, secondary Black Arrows from Withering Fire procs will often hit the same target instead of selecting targets without the Black Arrow DoT
- Bleak Powder does not proc if Black Arrow kills its target
- Shadow Hound Beast Cleave does physical damage
- Embrace the Shadows does not heal the hunter from Dark Hound or Authority of the Depths damage dealt.
BM hunter
- Venomous Bite doesn't get added entirely on the Bloodshed tooltip.
- Proccing the season 2 two-piece causes GCD-desync
- Poisoned Barbs isn't buffed by anything
- Venomous Bite does not affect Animal Companion
- Wyvern's Cry does not increase player damage
- Alpha Predator doesn't properly scale multiplicitatively with Pack Mentality
- The Bear cannot spawn Fenryr/Hati
- Pack Mentality does not buff Animal Comapnion
- No Mercy causes unintended pet swaps when using Hunter's Prey.
- Slicked Shoes always gives cooldown reduction to Disengage
- Bear melees are not increased by Lead from the Front
- Pig will Hit the main target with the cleave effect.
surv hunter
- Unnatural Causes not increasing Bloodseeker bleed
- Tranquilizing Shot cannot hit the Xal'atath orb affix
- Slicked Shoes always gives cooldown reduction to Disengage
- Bear melees are not increased by Lead from the Front
- No Mercy Smack/Claw/Bite consumes a random amount of focus
- No Mercy causes unintended pet swaps when using Sic 'Em.
- Wyvern's Cry does not increase all damage
- When casting Bombardier Explosive Shot, Tip of the Spear does not always buff all 3 Explosive Shots.
- With Bombardier active, casting the Bombardier Explosive Shot has a very large range and can fire the extra Explosive Shots at mobs that are not in combat and pull them.
- Harpoon was partially fixed on most enemies. On large mobs/bosses that cannot move, such as the final boss of Rookery, it pulls you to the center of the mob and kills you.
- Kill Command's tooltip does not get increased from Spirit Bond.
- Outland Venom is not increasing the critical strike damage of: Kill Command, Flanking Strike (pet portion), auto attacks.
- Spirit Bond (mastery) is not increasing the damage of hunter auto attacks or pet auto attacks.
- The 30% increased crit chance/30% increased crit damage is only buffing pet basic attacks. It does not buff auto attacks or Kill Command.
- Frenzy Strikes is buffing the pet portion of Flanking Strike by 40% twice, increasing pet damage by 96% total.
- If you cast Fury of the Eagle with 2 stacks of Tip, it will benefit from Tip of the Spear twice. If Ruthless Marauder generates a 2nd stack of Tip mid channel, the remaining ticks will be buffed by Tip twice.
- Explosives Expert is buffing the initial hit of Wildfire Bomb twice.
- Mastery is being applied to the pet portion of Flanking Strike damage twice.
- The 2pc tier set buff (Winning Streak) does not buff the periodic damage of Wildfire Bomb. It only buffs the initial damage.
docs google com/spreadsheets/d/1SyyJ9FJ-kU5LMMTsaXIesOUE4dY8cDiTkAVc-s0qw9M/edit?gid=958747325#gid=958747325)
11 Likes
I’ve just been responding to those saying Blizz ruined things by giving the option for pets back to MM.
Do I think other stuff should be done based on other stuff people have said based on MM ? Of course I do and the biggest issue I have seen mentioned is around Trueshot and they have posted a change in that but let’s all be honest here and admit that they are only going to do minor adjustments based on PTR because not everyone jumps into the ptr because most want to wait until the patch goes live and once it does there will be more input.
Hopefully once that happens ,they’ll do a hot fix and take care of problems long before say 11.1.5 even happens .
4 Likes
Things like this being buried by useless brigading from very obvious bots has made this thread and the spec horrible for 11.1
The same suspects will be back on the forums in a month complaining nobody will invite them to anything when they spent the 2 month PTR trying to shut down any and all actual feedback. Like clockwork with MM.
2 Likes
Problem is those that don’t want pets keep bringing it back up .
Stop doing that and people won’t respond to it . Maybe that is why people are not commenting on other things .
Another thing is maybe enough of us have done plenty of ptrs in the past and know that those that do ptr are a minority of the player base and that no real change will come until 11.1 goes live and then they can get feedback from a larger group of people and then do a hot fix then.
They might have a fix already to go and might not agree with it being needed yet and want to wait until going live for feedback first.
5 Likes
THIS.
Seriously, a big part of the lack of posts from us is that… Blizzard has barely made any changes at all over the past few weeks. It’s pointless and a waste of energy to re-post the exact same posts over and over and over about bugs.
I don’t get why people grumble about this. These bugs were reported 2+ weeks ago. They’re still (a good amount of them) here. Why bother posting again when the bugs are already reported?
Edit: Yes, I acknowledge my role in this.
3 Likes
And like I said Blizz is known to not making real changes during PTR but after things go live and more people complain .
As far as Blizz is concerned they believe once things go live more people will like things then those that don’t like it in the PTR.
Usually they are wrong but we know how well they learn from their mistakes in the past due to them repeating the same ignore ptr for live feedback over the years.
3 Likes
It absolutely sucks, especially for people who dedicate their time to testing things on Alpha/Beta/PTR. But this has been the pattern since Legion Beta. I recall seeing several specific testers (I’m not naming them due to forum policy) giving up in disgust and frustration – to the point that after beta-testing WoD, Legion, and BFA, they refuse to participate in betas ever again. They didn’t do any PTRs in SL and DF, and they only finally started to dip their toe in PTR again in TWW.
This is an old pattern, and a frustrating one. So there’s really no need to snipe at each other and blame each other when… it’s Blizzard who has established this pattern going back years, and keeps trying the same dumb stunt over and over.
5 Likes
ptr is a time where the specs get changed design wise. there is only a limited amount of time in this phase before ptr turns into majority tuning and bug fixes. this is why these feedback threads need to be short and concise to help devs find pain points and change design when they can
its already to late for design iliteration, tuning means nothing cause as you said, they do that more on live. it doesnt matter.
its just upsetting how the entire important part of ptr aka the first few weeks, all design choice feedback was drowned out by the moans of pet people who didnt even mention anything about further mm design. it was bad to the point that there was no point to post feedback because it would be buried by 100+ replies of the same thing.
because alot of bugs were fixed and new bugs were made with each new ptr patch. tarlo shows this on all of his posts.
im not point at you btw, but its just telling how alot of people feedback ended when pets came back. thats fine, maybe some peoples feedback only extends to pets and heck having a pet back as mm is alright. but how can mm “mains” only interact skin deep with the pet that this was their only feedback and not stuff like
“biurd debuff has a chance to apply on multiple targets” its just silly how detached people are with the spec that the pet stuff was their only complaint for the new redesign of mm.
idk where this idea of “they change more things in live” is coming from, because they only do number tuning in live. the design portion is over, feedback was buried and people got discouraged by one group of individuals. its a ugly truth, but its the truth.
3 Likes
I saw his post! A good post. 
Most of my contention is with the people who keep “flaming” each other (again, I acknowledge that I jumped into the fray).
On my part, I know I suck at math. I suck at coding. So I limit my feedback to themes, motifs, that kinda of stuff. 
And pretty much this all the changes they are going to do.
Changes to things like Trueshot where it increases the percentage of something or a shorter cool down or a shorter aimed shot cast time all numbers tuning .
Pretty much in most cases PTR is just a way for them to get an idea of what numbers they need to tune for live and then wait until live to either confirm those numbers or see if they have to tune those numbers even more.
Most of the stuff they have added already is going to go live the only thing added we don’t need to mention and everything else like mentioned above during ptr and going to live will just be number tunings.
your reasonable, your chill af
you dont need coding or math to say how a hting makes you feel tho, peopl.e feel like trueshot is a weaker cd when tis not rn, but its still solid feedback cause it does lack that extra umph it used to have
the % yes is a number tuning, reducing its cd or aimshot cd isnt numbers tuning. they dont do things like that in live. they do that stuff in ptr.
1 Like
dont really see a point in giving more suggestions. they finally did a “rework” but somehow didn’t change much and left in the garbage 3 target trick shots that people have complained about for years. nothing really big or exciting. very little iteration.
5 Likes
While I don’t hate the new ‘rotation’ I definitely don’t like it.
It takes a spec that was relatively low APM (around 50) and cranked it up to around 60, and added a lot of visual clutter to keep track of.
The overall flow of the spec is changed just enough that it feels off to me; I’m no longer able to get into a flow when I play the spec, which is a fairly significant departure from where I am currently in Live.
Only time will tell if this was a good change or not, but my suspicion is that it’s going to end up being largely seen as “meh”.
4 Likes
I don’t see a point in giving up. Suggestions are just that, you suggest, see if other people agree, check criticism to improve on them, and hope they are considered by Blizzard. Few suggestions end up making a difference, but posting them at least gives them a chance.
There’s an update on PTR right now. I dunno if it will be important for class design and balancing, or if it’s just some fix for raid testing or something like that.