I know that wasn’t at me, but responding anyway. Yeah the games would be more competitive. How much is questionable though given the difference in queue patterns of top players between the two factions.
Honestly, at this point I would prefer they just move the cave back. I simply don’t think it will have the “now the games are 50/50ish” effect that a lot of the alliance players on these forums seem to think it will.
Yes it is, even if you’re right that for some magical unknown reason horde in AV happen to just be better the map imbalance just makes that worse.
So even if the sides are perfectly equal in skill the map imbalance means horde win most of the time making skill level irrelevant to the discussion.
I didn’t address that, nor do I care. There are simply things that will have an obvious, if unquantified, effect and any rational, honest person should be able to acknowledge them.
I am suggesting that as soon as the AV changes went in that eliminated premades that the best players on the alliance side did exactly what they said they would do and started doing premades in WSG because the H/Hr was better. I don’t think anyone is disputing that fact.
What I am hearing is that somehow it is “magical” that horde players still get a lot higher distribution of their better players in AV and that somehow doesn’t translate to a higher skill cap than what exists on the alliance side. News flash, it does. The skills aren’t the same.
I’ve played AV on both sides in classic and I can honestly say that this is simply delusional. You have a 95% win rate in AV and you’re actually trying to attribute it to skill. There is no statistical model that can support that position. There are a few thousand people playing AV at any given time and you actually believe that one side is 20 times better than the other in every single case? That’s pure delusion.
WSG and AB are both better hph than AV for horde as well.
The only delusion is that if an entire faction’s best players never queue up for a BG and the other faction gets a fairly high proportion of their best players to queue up for that same BG that somehow the faction queuing up scrubs/alts/rep grinders/afkers is going to overcome the faction queuing up all those, but also including 10+ people grinding honor that have been grinding honor for months in that exact same BG.
When your good players were in the BG, it was common for horde to get thrashed going into SHGY. Why? Because it is a fractured advance to that midpoint fight. Once that fractured advance was broken, Alliance would advance to IBGY as a group and crush that fractured defense. Why? Because 30 on 10 = crushing it. That’s literally how it went until all the best players stopped joining. You supposedly played Horde side. Tell me I am wrong there. Because if you played Horde side, you know I am correct. Anytime an Alliance group actually wanted to farm, that’s exactly what they did and they did it extremely effectively.
Then the premade change happened. All the top players left. Suddenly Alliance can’t win games. But somehow it is a MAP difference now? Get outta here. It is a skill difference and it is abundantly clear when you have seen how the midpoint fight at SHGY used to go vs how it goes now. The Alliance do not hold that spot with minimal casualties anymore. And when they do, they definitely don’t immediately advance on IBGY and crush that fractured defense. Why? Because your best players aren’t there to carry.
Seriously. I hope they move the cave back. I really do. I am sick of reading these posts pretending that somehow an entire faction’s best players abandoning a BG won’t have a massive impact on that faction’s ability to win the BG with those remaining.
Maybe with 2 hour queue times in AV. I am not certain where the exact cut off is for H/Hr to make AB/WSG more viable horde side. That also depends heavily on what the queue times are for those BGs. It probably is at this point with an 18 minute AB queue vs a 2 hour 4 minute AV queue.
I’m going to say this with the hopes that your head doesn’t explode…
It takes 40 people on voice comms to overcome the map inequities in Alterac Valley on a regular basis. That’s it. There’s nothing more to know.
Here is hoping that your best players will queue up AV during AV weekend so we can see whether you are correct. Guessing they won’t though.
The cave is “a” problem but it’s not “the” problem. The main problem with the AV map is that there’s not a single choke point on the map that favors alliance. That’s why SHGY to Icewing Bunker is basically the entire match.
There’s nothing to see, AV has been around for decades, the map imbalances are very well documented.
Probably not, but it would at least give Alliance more of a fighting chance. Right now it is a very painful loss in which we try to maximize rep gains as much as possible before losing.
So the choke points that have a funnelled area, alliance Archer towers adding extra dps against the horde, and faster battle rejoin rate = better choke point for horde…
Which spot are you referring to?
I have the victim mentality because SF is already capped by Horde and reinforced on our side of the ramp by the time I even reach Balinda?
We discovered scorched earth at ibgy. That’s what changed.
U know the choke point at ibgy has been used by the alliance over the years in there favor. The goal to get ibgy and keep the horde south but allow just enough to get by for the roaming 4 man team on defense.
Seen that happen many times over the years.
IBGY isn’t a choke point for the southern team. It’s only a choke point for people trying to get south.
Again I’ve seen alliance use ibgy as a choke point over the years and keep the horde south while having a team back cap and cap ib tower then they move on to tp it’s a slow pace but it was effective they would push the horde into the base and cap those towers and take the relief hut and win before the horde could rez in the cave.
In other words u can change the disadvantage into an advantage but it wont happen because alliance want to min/max honor so much