End the war on solo gameplay in WoW (Part 1)

[Snozh-malganis]

@Pyromor-shandris

This the confusing part,they don’t complaint about getting those but they don’t want soloers to get them ,even though they help in the long run in the environment a player does.

No one argues for solo players not being able to get conduits from rep

[Lumbagel-illidan]

Got it, and yes, on this account, we do 100% agree. PvP is one of my joys and the amount of grinding needed to get a baseline set that is worthless just made me decide not even to bother. So that’s another thing I used to love to do but… well… can’t really.

I think WoW’s biggest problem right now is that there’s clearly some form of solo content at play, but it is so overshadowed by even a miniscule involvement in Group Content… that it doesn’t seem worthwhile to solo/casual players (Korthia).

So you got people who raid Mythic or do high-end Mythic + (like you) saying: “WTF are you guys whining about. You can get ilvl 232 solo.” Which is 100% true.

Meanwhile guys just coming back like me to a dead guild on a dead faction, having to start over on Illidan Horde and saying: “Well, my options are limited. I can spend months grinding out a solo world set, or try to find carries/buy boosts for Mythic+ until I’m raid ready… or hell, why don’t I just find a better game. It’s not like the old days where there weren’t any.”

That’s the route I’m going to take I think… the game just isn’t for me anymore and that’s probably fine.

[Snozh-malganis]

@Olfen-ursin

Why not just give overworld content better loot? Why come up with another system that makes absolutely no sense?

Because overworld content is too easy to be awarded better loot.

The only way that solo players would get higher ilvl loot would be a torghast type system that’s very difficult.

[Foossnacks-area-52]

If there isn’t anything stopping the solo progression gear from being good in raid, then raiders will have to do raids, M+, and the solo progression path. Adding M+ to the game probably close to doubled most highish level raider’s chore list. If they made set bonuses only work in the content you got the gear from that might work, but you would need to expand what counts as tier, or else trinkets and such from other content will probably be BIS.

[Olfen-ursin]

@Snozh-malganis

Because overworld content is too easy to be awarded better loot.

This doesn’t matter.

[Kazinox-faerlina]

Because it is an mmo.

Solo players don’t deserve gear on par with gear that drops from raids.
Quests are braindead easy. Even LFR is harder than questing.
If you want a solo game play a skyrim or dragon age. You play an mmo for the coop.

[Phibbus-farstriders (Phibbus)]

@Snozh-malganis

The only way that solo players would get higher ilvl loot would be a torghast type system that’s very difficult.

That’s pretty much what I would like, but with Mage-Tower type encounters instead of the bland, procedurally-generated bosses that Torghast does offer.

[Pyromor-shandris (Pyromor)]

Loot wasn’t what this is all about it is the control factor even when the gear is approaching the high level to enter an instance of a mythic -raid they’ll complain because now it’s infringing on their competitiveness.

Soloers are not concerned about the mythic -raid but if they want to enter them it’ll be on their time not on others who forces them to be in. As of now,it is forcing you either are progressing with them or you are not progressing at all.

[Terranox-stonemaul (Terranox)]

Those don’t get much updates. MMOs are about having many players in them. The way you want to interact with them is up to you. Tying powerful power upgrades to just group content isn’t really fun for solo play. You’d likely want players to play with who are similar to your skill level in group content.

MMOs have good group content but they also had decent solo content like brawler’s guild and horrific visions. Torgast is ok but feels so unrewarding.

[Snozh-malganis]

@Olfen-ursin

This doesn’t matter.

Yes it actually does.

Rewards are based on difficulty. You’re never going to get the best gear in the game from doing trivial content.

[Terranox-stonemaul (Terranox)]

You can go to torgast with the lowest ilvl and do a 12 by yourself. That would be more difficult then a 15 at a decent ilvl. You get nothing from that. This isn’t true in this game. The more gear you get the easier it is to get more gear in group content.

[Snozh-malganis]

@Lumbagel-illidan

on this account, we do 100% agree. PvP is one of my joys and the amount of grinding needed to get a baseline set that is worthless just made me decide not even to bother. So that’s another thing I used to love to do but… well… can’t really.

The baseline set isn’t worthless. It just feels worthless because of how fast paced the game is.

As someone that had the chance to play with some solid players and push a couple toons too 1800 I started in blue gear.

@Lumbagel-illidan

I think WoW’s biggest problem right now is that there’s clearly some form of solo content at play, but it is so overshadowed by even a miniscule involvement in Group Content… that it doesn’t seem worthwhile to solo/casual players (Korthia).

That’s because this games endgame is focused on end game content.

Also solo players and casual players are different. I know casual players that push 24 keys because of how casual the schedule can be.

[Olfen-ursin]

@Kazinox-faerlina

Solo players don’t deserve gear on par with gear that drops from raids.

And nobody is asking for this. We’re just asking for better gear than what we’re getting.

@Kazinox-faerlina

Quests are braindead easy. Even LFR is harder than questing.

If you’re putting the time into the game, how simple the content is shouldn’t matter. There was a point in time where you could get decent gear in overworld content. Some gear in the overworld was BiS.

@Kazinox-faerlina

You play an mmo for the coop.

You know, I really feel like I repeat myself a lot on this, but a lot of the draw that came with WoW over the years was because of how solo-friendly it was.

Literally, on the back of the 2004 game’s box, was text that encouraged solo play as a viable option. Other things like dungeon finder were extensions of that in that you didn’t need to pug groups to get content done. It was a process that helped streamline an experience for solo players. But only until recently has Blizzard’s focus shifted away from these things that actually made the game better (inb4 “dungeon finder was actually really bad for the game”).

@Snozh-malganis

Yes it actually does.

Oh, I actually forgot to look and see who I was responding to.

Ignored.

[Snozh-malganis]

@Phibbus-farstriders

That’s pretty much what I would like, but with Mage-Tower type encounters instead of the bland, procedurally-generated bosses that Torghast does offer.

You are an extreme minority though. Most solo players just want the gear for doing the same trivial content.

@Terranox-stonemaul

You can go to torgast with the lowest ilvl and do a 12 by yourself. That would be more difficult then a 15 at a decent ilvl. You get nothing from that. This isn’t true in this game. The more gear you get the easier it is to get more gear in group content.

Not true at all. While yes getting more gear will help push certain percentages it’s not the main reason guilds fail or kill the boss.

[Pawzer-moon-guard]

@Snozh-malganis

Rewards are based on difficulty.

Not really, as far as I can see the best gear doesn’t come from solo content which would be where the ‘difficulty’ lies in. Because you can buy the best raid carries, and you can buy PvP carries to the ‘best pvp gear’, you can buy carries through the highest M+ etc. Or people can get carried by friends, a guild, etc. If it was all about ‘difficulty’ and ‘most skill’ it would indeed only come from solo content.

[Terranox-stonemaul (Terranox)]

@Snozh-malganis

@Terranox-stonemaul

You can go to torgast with the lowest ilvl and do a 12 by yourself. That would be more difficult then a 15 at a decent ilvl. You get nothing from that. This isn’t true in this game. The more gear you get the easier it is to get more gear in group content.

Not true at all. While yes getting more gear will help push certain percentages it’s not the main reason guilds fail or kill the boss.

You get more more gear just from downing a boss then any casual or solo player get’s and it just gets easier the more everyone gets gear. Even pugging people tend to want higher ilvl geared folks over people starting gearing up an alt.

You can make torgast difficult or do it on a low ilvl and get almost nothing for it. Even a lore score since it’s tuned for people of high ilvl. The solo rewards are pretty garbage in this game. Only stuff worth chasing is the cosmetics which stick with you longer then the gear.

[Snozh-malganis]

@Pawzer-moon-guard

Not really, as far as I can see the best gear doesn’t come from solo content which would be where the ‘difficulty’ lies in.

Solo content is hands down the easiest content in the game.

@Pawzer-moon-guard

and you can buy PvP carries to the ‘best pvp gear’, you can buy carries through the highest M+ etc.

You have to be carried by someone who had to earn the gear the legitimate way.

@Pawzer-moon-guard

Or people can get carried by friends, a guild, etc. If it was all about ‘difficulty’ and ‘most skill’ it would indeed only come from solo content.

None of that changes the fact that mythic raiding is hardest thing in this game

[Liadariel-runetotem]

@Lumbagel-illidan

Korthia is a deeply, deeply flawed avenue for solo play. By the time you can even qualify to boost your ilvl above 220, you’d have had to do boring, soul-crushing dailies for over 30+ days.

I agree and somewhat disagree. As a solo that doesn’t do Mythic I figure a fair amount of work is necessary for that 220+. M+ grind their dungeons over and over. For open world I don’t need much more than 227igear.

That said, I did like it better when I quested for gear, not boring dailies. Blizz got lazy and just decided the daily’s were good enough. There’s a few quest’s and even on the mission table.

Bottom line: they stopped open world questing for gear because they A. Didn’t have enough story, and B. Because it was cheaper to have NPC’S stand around doling out quests that boosted their time metrics and “people supposedly engaged in game.”

[Pawzer-moon-guard]

@Snozh-malganis

Solo content is hands down the easiest content in the game.

You can’t buy carries for solo content, so how so?

@Snozh-malganis

You have to be carried by someone who had to earn the gear the legitimate way.

Can be, sure. Not always, at some point someone has to earn it a ‘legitimate’ way but if you can gear an entire raid group with mythic gear 2-5 members at a time there are plenty of raid groups that can then perform carries with said gear rather than earn it afterwards.

@Snozh-malganis

None of that changes the fact that mythic raiding is hardest thing in this game

That’s false, top rated PvP would be considered ‘the hardest thing in this game’ for group content yet doesn’t give the highest level of gear. Mythic+ at say, key level 30-40 in time would be considered ‘the hardest PvE content in the game currently’ yet also doesn’t, etc.

[Kazinox-faerlina]

You’re correct, the way you interact with them is up to you. So when you want better loot you make the decision to do raids/pvp with other players.

I’ll admit, I’d love more solo content, and I’d be fine with difficult solo content rewarding some amount of gear. But it needs to be two things:

1. Difficult enough to warrant its reward.
2. Instanced. If it’s in the world then anyone can cheese it with flying, overwhelming numbers, or any sort of world buff.

@Olfen-ursin

f you’re putting the time into the game, how simple the content is shouldn’t matter. There was a point in time where you could get decent gear in overworld content. Some gear in the overworld was BiS.

That was back when there wasnt LFG and LFR.

@Olfen-ursin

You know, I really feel like I repeat myself a lot on this, but a lot of the draw that came with WoW over the years was because of how solo-friendly it was.

You claim old wow was solo friendly and yet retail hasn’t had a single group quest in years.