Before the Storm? Nah, I haven’t. I should because I have liked Golden’s books before. It’s not going to change my opinion, because even if the Desolate Council is depicted rushing into a fire to save a cox of kittens, it doesn’t really change… well, this:
Like… there really is not argument against that. That’s evil 101.
I mean that is basically what happens, yeah. Pretty much all of them are pretty sympathetic old men and women who react negatively to Sylvanas’s authoritarinism and use it as an opportunity to try and establish peaceful relations with humanity. They may as well of literally gone around saving puppies for all intents and purposes.
Man, Calia is going to be weird for you next patch then, what with her Lightforged Undeath.
They could have argued for a better deal, its not like Garithos could have taken Lordearon by himself. They could have put out the fires of Stratholme, resettle some of human places that were wasted on W3, idk. Its not like the forsaken could not have lasted longer than normal humans.
Thats besides the point, however. Whatever the reality of their situation, the fact remains that the first action of the forsaken as an organization was to betray and put the final nail on the last members of the OG alliance (even if they were *****) and then complain that the rest of humanity didnt trust them.
Eh, not sympathetic with cannibals and practitioners of slavery and human experiments.
Considering the Light is the primordial force of hope and the spirit of life, then if the undead can be redeemed, that would be the way to do it.
I don’t believe for a nanosecond that Garithos would of honored that deal if he even got a whiff of the fact that the Forsaken wanted any part of Lordaeron. Maybe they could touch that up in reforged now that they have less narrative limitation to work with, who knows.
And like I get that their first action being one of aggression towards the living would put a damper on trust, but it isn’t a thing that comes up that much. The only people who knew about it were folks like Kristoff who were d***s for their own reasons, and so for all intents and purposes their dealings with the greater alliance were a clean slate.
I would argue that after dealing with the worse aspects of humanity they sent a delegation to people they thought were better, got rejected, and THATS what they are complaining about.
Can we maybe have a little less arguing about who’s evil on a thread about how Blizzard is encouraging us to point fingers and call other people evil?
Fair enough Pellex, I got wrapped up in it and it kneecaps the purpose of the thread. I mean, beyond showcasing how polarized the discussion has become anyway.
Edit: Separate thread Gharion? we can continue debating there.
Can we resume this in a couple of hours or tomorrow? Im at college right now and the eating break is about to end ![:stuck_out_tongue:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/stuck_out_tongue.png?v=6" ":stuck_out_tongue:")
Its 20:30 for me here lel
That sounds good to me. I’m actually kind of interested in this conversation because we don’t actually talk about Garithos in any capacity beyond “INHUMAN” and examining his character, and whether he was right or wrong in a more critical way would be a nice break from Teldrassil.
Yes, BfA is so bad i’d rather talk about Garithos then whats happening right now.
I might of said something of that effect… But what I say never seems to matter to you, or you just have poor reading comprehension.
If anything, you buried my post because you disagreed with it. An attempt at forum censorship I would think.
So ill repost it.
You did, that’s completely my fault for choosing to press rather then disengage.
No. If someone tell you in real world something like “people from your country/race/religion are douchebags”, then they are insulting you, because you can feel that some of those things are an esential part of who you are.
But you are not an undead, and i’m not a draenei in real life. Those races just represents things that we like, not wath we are.
But yes, you can get mad because people insult what you like, but even so, they are not insulting who you are.
That is…half true Argyle. Are you familiar with racial coding? That is, the act of creating a race that shares similarities with real life counterparts or ideologies. I might not be, for example, a Native American in real life but I might very well identify with Tauren who are racially coded to be like a conglomerate of several Native American tribes and traditions, does that make sense?
Well, i don’t know exactly how respond to that, but i can tell you something: If someone says “Stormwind humans suck”, i really don’t care. But if someone says “all that medieval theme in Stormwind sucks, reminds me to the stupid european culture”, then i can get mad because i have european heritage.
Were it not for Sylvanas and the Forsaken Gari and the rest of his troop would have continued licking the hooves of that demon. As thanks? ‘Yeah, we’ll help you fight them off but you better get off the land your people have called home for generations and we lost. Also take those elves and dwarves with you.’
If you have a problem with a group of people betraying someone as willfully wicked as Gari, you are the one with a wonked moral compass, buddy.
Darrethy, you’re a good guy but you’re just feeding these people by arguing with them. This is the toxicity that you mentioned. Akiyass even outright said they didn’t read the book you mentioned and has already said their mind was closed to any other interpretation outside of their tiny opinion/peephole.
That’s kind of what i’m getting at though. Often it’s not just ‘Stormwind Humans Suck’ it’s that they suck because of some component of their character that someone doesn’t like. That’s where the problem lies, often there’s specific aspects of a culture they dislike, rather then something trivial like the overall aesthetic, you see?
Edit: I realize, that’s why I stopped Elleandra.
Oh you are just adorable.
So, apparently, just bc someone is evul the other person is completely entitled to also be scum.
Thats like saying now that the nelves have been genocided, Tyrande now has carte blanche to drop the moon on Org (specially the orphanage!) Without becoming as evil as Sylvanas
Which is to say, completely stupid and idiotic.
Im a bit busy rn to continue this, but i can take you on tomorrow if you like
See what I mean?
I caught you two together. Now you need to kiss.
I mean, you did choose to engage him with some rather loaded language. I disagree with his point, but Gharion is perfectly capable of being reasonable, i’v had some good conversations with him in the past.