1.15 threat multiplier in defensive stance, part of standard fury/prot, but warriors can also tank as fury/impale, especially as alliance.
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Oh, that’s what you meant. We here in these parts call that Fury/Prot.
That would make things quite different for horde. I don’t know horde Feral tanking in Classic at all (even though I played horde in Vanilla). I am VERY surprised if that is true though. I would have to check other sources.
Yup. Again, not horde so don’t know the horde specific issues. It doesn’t really change the initial questions of this thread however. In fact, I would say DFT is even more important for a Horde Feral than Alliance assuming your statement is true.
DFT is incredibly vital to horde tanks in general TBH, it’s rogue/feral prio for alliance, but absolutely MT prio for horde.
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Its MT prio period. No argument from me there. If you only get one though, I feel sorry for your guild. Its what happens AFTER the first one I think we are discussing.
Disagree, threat is an absolute non-issue for alliance in my experience, it’s why I took our 5th DFT as the MT.
If you actually have threat issues from gear, sure MT prio, but that basically doesn’t happen in my experience.
Perhaps it has to do with the rest of your guild. We have 4 TFs and 8(ish) R14 warriors. MT threat is of primary importance.
I’m a TF+R14 warrior myself, so that probably helps, but even the R14 warriors in my guild can’t touch me on threat. I struggle against fully wbuffed dps with 0 wbuffs tho, I can barely match them at that point.
They technically don’t have a weapon to enchant.
With our warriors spiking threat with windfury, you need a tank who can keep above them. It’s very important. A bear is OT at best, with many guilds not including them at all.
Of course, there are more relaxed guilds who don’t have as large raid wide threat, a bear is more forgiving in this scenario.
Can enchant weapons fine, BIS enchant is 3% haste counterweight though.
Rogue = Warrior(DPS) > Druid (Feral DPS) > Druid (Tank) = Warrior(Tank)
The 2% hit is absolutely monumental for the melee dps, and having it shelved on a trinket slot opens up some gear swaps for more AP or Crit
That being said, i’ve seen guilds give Cats the trinket over rogues with little issue, and i’ve seen other guilds have open revolt when literally anyone gets it, so it’s a very “Your results may vary” scenario
P.S. Don’t know about Shaman melee DPS, but i’d assume somewhere between the big 2 and Druid DPS
For bear form?
Edit: We are confusing different categories of weapon enchants. This was in regards to windfury, not permanent weapon enchants. I know it’s confusing terminology.
Windfury shares with poisons and sharpening stones. Not enchanting or counterweights. A warrior can have an enchant as well as windfury.
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Rogue = Feral(DPS/Tank) > Warrior dps/tank
Its equally as huge if not more so for a feral dps let alone a tank and unless the feral hasn’t collected non-hit gear for later use leads to a much bigger raid wide dps increase than rogues/warriors.
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If you assume that a feral (as tank or DPS) is viable, then honestly, they should be top prio. I say that because it is extremely difficult to get hit capped as a druid. Unlike rogues and warriors who have racials (weapon skill), talents and tier gear that hand out Hit like its candy, you give up so much to get hit on a Druid that it isn’t worth it; the sacrifice is too great. Therefore you AREN’T hit capped, and thus DFT is a bigger upgrade for a feral (especially tank) than anyone else. I am still not hit capped (at 8%) and I have DFT and Band of Accuria. I COULD be, but I would give up too much. It won’t be BIS for me to be hit capped until Naxx (I think, I would have to look it up, it might be AQ40).
Of course it is that initial assumption that is in question. I assert it is only in question because of how difficult it is to play and gear a feral effectively because of beliefs that carry over from 15 years ago that have nothing to do with patch 1.12 classes.
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If a guild brings a Feral into the raid or anything they should consider its loot priority just like any other class, especially seeing how most good ferals out dps rogues and warriors often with ease.
IMO it should 100% be feral prio but im fine being equal with rogues for it even if they need it less, as long as warriors are after us.
I definitely do agree that we are treated like second class raiders, its all about finding a guild that realises the content isn’t hard enough to not give Ret Pallys equal prio on onslaught ornot let mweaving hunters get ashkandi.
You arent wrong about druids. But nobody pushes hit higher than rogues. 14-16% hit is very desirable
Id say if your MT is a feral tank i have no issue at all passing a DFT to a MT. If theyre the OT they need to get to the back of the line
Once rogues go over their hit cap that Hit% isn’t worth ~32 AP sorry to say lol.
Rogues wont go over hit cap, and rogues utilize the DFT way better. Crit scales with hit for rogues, so hit is always a great stat. Also, equally geared, a feral will never outdps a rogue if the rogue knows how to dps.
This is what im replying to.
The individual dps increase for a feral > the individual dps increase for a rogue the majority of the time. Is a ~54 DPS increase for me.
Yes, crit scales with hit for everyone, also you just said rogues will not go over hit cap. I am talking about Yellow and Mainhand hitcap.
When did I claim this and how is it relevant in the slightest?
It was a quality troll post.
Good ferals don’t out dps rogues or warrior unless the rogues and warriors are in a coma. There is literally no setting where a druid will out-dps either class unless there’s a massive skill/gear disparity. I get you’re obsessed with druids but you’re just wrong.