Dragonflight Talent Previews - Hunter and Rogue

Community General Discussion
103

Restless Crew party wide forces 20% of raid comps to be outlaw rogues.

Restless crew raid wide becomes stupidly OP as just having a few rogues outrageously resets cooldowns.

I’m betting this ability gets changed dramatically to just like a haste buff or something. As it stands I can’t see how to balance it.

1 Like
104

Can’t wait to play my roguey .thanks :smiley:

105

/e Prays to Elune - Hope they garbage canned slice and dice… hope they garbage canned slice and dice… hope they garbage canned slice and dice…

Slice and Dice: Finishing move that consumes combo points to increase attack speed by 50%. Lasts longer per combo point.

/e :sob:

6 Likes
106

Then have talents that just reduce the cooldown on interrupts. Having interrupts as talents is going to lead to interrupts rarely happening and every PUG saying they’re not talented into it.

107
  • As far as i’ve seen the talents look great, specially the hunter tree.
  • BUT i have a review:
    The BM tree have pictured some beats, great.
    The survivor tree have pictured our beloved REXXAR, who is an Orc, obviously from Horde.
    And in the MM tree we have ANOTHER Horde character and ANOTHER Orc…
  • I know its hard for blizzard’s devs to accept this but there are ppl who play in the Ally side… And those players would like to have their side pictured too, we dont need TWO Horde characters, not mentioning they are of the same race lol, i know the allys have a few famous hunters like Alleria Windrunner or even a kinda neutral one: Hemet Nesingwary!
1 Like
108

So this is interesting…survival spec with barrage? Or even build your talents so you can opt out of wildfire bomb completely? Cant wait to try some whacky stuff with my hunter XD

109

First 4 rows of MM tree are a mess. Try to put 8 points in those 4 rows. How do you do it?

My best guess is like:

  • Aimed Shot
  • 2/2 Improved Arcane Shot
  • Improved Steady Shot
  • Rapid Fire
  • 1/2 Killing Blow
  • 1/2 Careful Aim
  • Multi-Shot

but that’s awful. It picks up the useless Kill Shot crit talent and misses out entirely on Precise Shots, which has been a core part of MM for years. You can’t complete the first 4 rows in only 8 talent points of MM without losing significant core pieces of the rotation. That has to change.

Two suggestions:

  1. MM has 1 more point worth of talents in the first 4 rows than Survival (though 4 less than BM), so maybe make Improved Arcane Shot or Precise Shots 1 point talents?
  2. Move Multi-Shot to the left side of the tree, after Rapid Fire. It being after a Kill Shot talent makes no sense thematically anyway. Then we could just skip that.

The alternative is pigeonholing MM so hard into AoE or ST that they’ll be absolutely awful at the other - ST without Precise Shots or AoE without Multi-Shot…

4 Likes
110

I seriously hope that Kidney Shot not being a baseline ability is not a mistake because I’m getting kind of tired of all the “extra” combo points making Kidney shot last longer than 6 seconds. With double Deeper Stratagem, we’re looking at an 8 seconds Kidney Shot.

5 Likes
111

Why is multi shot a talent?

5 Likes
112

So you can choose to take it or not.

113

Death Chakram instead of Wild Spirits? WTF?!

3 Likes
114

The number of options like this is starting to look a lot better, having 3-4 lines to go down for dps will give us more options. I would like perhaps a few connections going from the outer lines to the inner lines, the same from the middle to the outer lines though, just so players have more flexibility in their choices and can cross across the talent trees.

If this happens, and we get some refinements to expand out the earlier dps previews, my confidence in the talent trees is building a little.

115

Yeah there was a typo, they added it to the list. Kidney Shot is baseline! Though, I play rogue so :slight_smile:

116

I wish slice and dice wasn’t baseline

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117

Very stoked about the rogue tree. Theres so many different paths and builds you can make. It does seem a bit op but I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. Though, other classes should also come up to the same tier of op so players feel like they’re getting away with things :slight_smile:

118

lol…

/10char

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119

I never understood why they push slice and dice so much. It’s literally a chore, and to my knowledge there are hardly any if any rogues that enjoy it.

9 Likes
120

For Beast Mastery

Also including a few points about the class tree at the bottom. Some of it ties into the part about Beast Mastery as well.

Topic on the Hunter forum for feedback:

Positive

  • Beast Cleave - At 3 ranks, it will now be back to 75% of normal damage, but in turn, we will now also have access to Kill Cleave, which makes Kill Command deal 50% damage to nearby enemies as well. And it seems as if Kill Cleave doesn’t come with a soft cap of 5 or 8 targets, like Beast Cleave does. Although, the fact that Beast Cleave requires 3 points is a bit of a downer…
  • Talents for AoE, optional - It’s good to see that you can easily side-step the bulk of any talents(Multi-Shot, Beast Cleave, Kill Cleave) that are meant for AoE, if you’re in a scenario where it’s not required.
  • New talent ‘Call of the Wild’ - Seems interesting. Would like to know a bit more about the specifics, but looks like the old Stampede is making a return.
  • New talent ‘Bloody Frenzy’ - In the bottom right choice node. Seems interesting as well, could make for some fun setup for burst windows. Either way, the combination of Call of the Wild and Bloody Frenzy has the potential to be very fun to play with.
    • The ideal thing would be if the pets summoned by Call of the Wild, with Bloody Frenzy picked, if they were all affected by Frenzy’s bonus attack speed, even if Frenzy was already active when you use Call of the Wild.

Hmm…

  • Cobra Shot + Cobra Senses - The talent tooltip reads that Cobra Shot reduces the remaining cooldown of Kill Command by 1 sec. You then also have another talent called ‘Cobra Senses’, where the tooltip reads that, if you pick it, Cobra Shot reduces the remaining cooldown of Kill Command by 1 sec. Would each Cobra Shot, if ‘Cobra Senses’ is picked, reduce the remaining cooldown of Kill Command by 2 sec? Or would Cobra Senses be required for Cobra Shot to have that 1 sec CDR on Kill Command?
  • New talent ‘Barbed Wrath’ - Which combines the effect of how Barbed Shot reduces the remaining CD of Bestial Wrath, and now will also reduce the remaining CD of Aspect of the Wild. The part about you also being able to reduce the cooldown of Aspect of the Wild is decent, but not the part where we now have to talent into CDR for Bestial Wrath.
  • Wailing Arrow - As a new talent, seems a bit out of place – when put in the spec tree. If you ask me, it would be better suited as a choice in the class tree.
  • New talent ‘Dire Pack’ - Seems a bit odd. Granted that we don’t know how much damage Multi-Shot will deal. Also, why would it affect Steady Shot, but not Cobra Shot? For Beast Mastery, Cobra Shot replaces Steady Shot if picked. Also, why is it a square node when it’s not a new ability?
  • New talent ‘Wild Instincts’ - Might have the risk of becoming very chaotic at times, to the point where it may result in wasted procs of Barbed Shot charges. Especially when combined with the regular Wild Call.

Negative

  • Beast Cleave - There doesn’t seem to be any talent that increases the base duration of Beast Cleave, and Beast Cleave still has the regular 4 sec base duration.
  • Animal Companion, still a talent - For many players, picking this talent has more to do with personal preferences in terms of aesthetics and identity, not about a choice of throughput. Keeping it as a talent can easily have a negative impact on players, no matter whether they like using it or not.
  • Dire Beast - Is still the same as in Shadowlands, a plain “use-on-CD” ability. I still think it’s a missed opportunity to not rework it back to how it was in Legion, so that we can choose between a playstyle with Barbed Shot + Frenzy, or aspects involving Dire Beast. I for one very much enjoyed the “beast cannon” builds in Legion, even though some didn’t.
  • Aspect of the Wild - A bit sad to see that Aspect of the Wild is still present, albeit as a choice this time. If anything, it needs something more. It’s not a very interesting, nor fun, ability to manage.
  • Core functions now split apart - The fact that they’ve taken some abilities and picked them apart, only to then reintroduce what they took out as a stand-alone talent.
    • Ex: Barbed Wrath, this being its own thing, rather than keeping it as part of Bestial Wrath’s default setup, it really shouldn’t be done this way.
    • Same thing with Loaded Quiver. It didn’t feel very good to play when Barbed Shot only had 1 charge.

Final thoughts

Here are some thoughts on what could be done to improve the general composition of Beast Mastery as a specialization/talent tree.

Animal Companion - Not about throughput
Really, I can’t stress this enough, make Animal Companion a baseline passive choice that we can make. One that simply splits normal pet damage between 2 permanent pets, if we so choose. Or if we go with 1 main pet, that pet will then deal 100% of normal damage.

Beast Cleave - Increase duration
For the sake of gameplay, ideally, something like changing Beast Cleave to a 2 point talent(still @75% total damage), and then adding a small tangent branch node(1 point) directly below it that does this:

[Improved Beast Cleave] - Increases the damage of Beast Cleave by 10%, and Beast Cleave now lasts for an additional 6 seconds.

Call of the Wild - Embracing the “Beast Cannon”
Would love a talent or bonus trait of some kind that allows you to extend the duration of Call of the Wild, by using another ability.

Loaded Quiver - Shouldn’t exist as a talent
Barbed Shot should go back to having 2 charges by default. We all learned this lesson during Legion.

Dire Beast - Back to Legion design
It should preferably be reworked to how it was in Legion, so that we could choose between that and Barbed Shot. And with that, talents that have an interaction with Barbed Shot should be iterated on to also include elements tied to Dire Beast.

Wailing Arrow - To the class tree
Somewhere around Counter Shot. Make it an extended “branch” pick from Counter Shot. See the class section below for details.

Dire Pack’s tooltip - Needs clarification
Along with the icon, showing it as a new ability. It needs to be clarified what the intent with it is, as a talent.

Barbed Wrath - Should be reworked
The cooldown reduction for Bestial Wrath should be a default element of Bestial Wrath itself, like it is on live. Ideally, the reworked version should read something like:

[Primal Instincts] - Barbed Shot now also reduces the remaining cooldown of Aspect of the Wild by 4/8 sec, and Aspect of the Wild increases your Mastery by -/- for the duration.

In for the Kill - In the wrong position
Move the talent ‘In for the Kill’ down one step, to where Wailing Arrow was previously positioned.

  • In the place of ‘In for the Kill’, put a talent there that allows for A Murder of Crows to be affected by Beast Cleave, if picked. This will then give us a choice between that talent, and the talent ‘Bloodshed’. Allowing for a pick between AoE/Cleave, and priority target damage. Example:

    [Talon Frenzy] - While Beast Cleave is active, A Murder of Crows affects up to 8 enemies near the primary target.

Hunter class tree, a few things

Aspect of the Fox has long been an ability that the hunter community wants for to be brought back. While it was indeed at times a very powerful piece of utility, I would argue that with a few changes to it, this would allow the entire class to have raid/group-wide utility that, at times would still be very strong, but albeit situational.

I would love to see something like the example below put back, as an option in the class tree. As per the tooltip, it would have a substantially longer shared cooldown, however long is required to not heavily promote class stacking or other things similar to that.

Aspect of the Fox - Instant - 3 min cooldown/30 sec global(shared) cooldown
Party and raid members within 40 yards take on the aspects of a fox, allowing them to move while casting all spells and abilities for 6 sec.

For positioning in the class tree, there are a few things I would do at the same time.

  • Aspect of the Fox has been added in the place where we can currently find Counter Shot, to allow for the class to bring some additional utility, other than Primal Rage(which isn’t exactly a massive perk in group-based content). A lot of other classes/specs are getting additional raid/group utility, and atm, I think hunters are the only ones left out in this department.
  • Tar Trap has been taken out of the tree, the intent is that it should be given to us as a baseline ability, when we level up. Same as it works currently with Freezing Trap.
  • Improved Exhilaration has been moved out to take the place of the placeholder node they mentioned in the post, the one they wanted to be about utility(where Scare Beast was previously placed).
  • Misdirection + Fogged Crystal have both been moved one row to the left, to where Tar Trap and Improved Exhilaration was previously placed. And, a path has been added from Fogged Crystal, to connect to the new position of Improved Exhilaration.
  • Counter Shot has been moved down one row, to where Misdirection was previously placed. To make room for Aspect of the Fox.
  • Wailing Arrow has been added below the new position of Counter Shot. Again, I would prefer it to be about the utility(silence effect), not damage.
  • The new position of Scare Beast, is as a tangent node that extends out from the choice node for Scatter Shot/Binding Shot. I think that would be much more useful for any scenario where you would find value in picking Scare Beast.
  • Keen Eyesight + Master Marksman. And lastly, You can see the path added as a connection from Keen Eyesight, downwards to Master Marksman.

11 Likes
121

Bone Spike should have been somewhere in the general tree for any spec to take. Instead of Echoing Reprimand, honestly. BS is the most fun of all the covenant abilities.

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122

Yeah I didn’t really like the mm tree. If you look at the sin tree for instance its exactly what I think a tree should be one side is bleed based one side is poison based so you can make a pure build of one or the other or mix and match it. MM really seems to have very core abilities all over the place so it feels like making a build is just gonna feel bad because you’re always gonna lose abilities you had before.

7 Likes