Why do we still have affixes man omg literally the only reason I’ll never push keys.
Anyone else zone out as soon as they saw the ‘tiers’ of upgrades? Nah.
what low keys? the first key s4 m+2 is a s3+11 and it have a timer the only dung whit no timers are normal, follower, heroic and m0 and the latest is now on a +10 dif but gives 0 raiting
Was this written by an AI? It really bungled the timer thing. So many people seem to be confused about it. Heroic and Mythic 0 already have no timer, so why even mention it?
3 Likes
they remove the low keys +2-+10 and just change the number but the raiting and dificulty is the same in other words they just make m0 harder and make the entry point on +m +11 now renamed to +2
no whit these changes ksm ksh and portals will be on the s4 equivalents 10 for portal 7 or 8 for ksh and 4 for ksm
exactly +4 ksm
+8 ksh
+10 ports
where did you get that 2-10 will not have a timer they no longer exist m0 is on a +10 dificulty but you only have the amplificated dmg and 1 weekly lock out on loot and no rating gain those start on the new +2(old +11)
they just delete heroic dung rename m0 to heroic delete +2-+9 rename +10 to m0 and ajust the >+11 so they stat the count on +2 but whit a +11 setings
When something has problems, I will continue complaining until it doesn’t have problems anymore. No feedback means no improvements. Maybe you accept breadcrumbs because you’re hungry, I’m looking for a proper meal.
2 Likes
Great changes!
Now, why the hell doesn’t M +1 exist???
1 Like
The few people I know who genuinely enjoy M+ seem to be cracked out WoW addicts. The rest of the folks I know who run it do it for the gear and nothing else.
I only run it myself because it’s convenient content. If they changed it to be more inline with raiding I’d still run it. Even if that meant only three levels of difficulty and weekly lockouts. It’s just too convenient (vs raiding) not to.
1 Like
I suspect most of the M+ zealots on these forums are in the same boat.
I honestly cannot understand how so many players can accept this content as their endgame. Blizzard is barely trying these days. Recycled dungeons, only being able to make 9 new dungeons per expansion, but still charging more money than they ever did.
Modern WoW dungeons are some of the most boring MMO dungeons I have ever played. They just remind of something ripped right out of ARPG.
I guess people love grinding hallways of trash mobs for their end game on a timer.
5 Likes
I don’t get it either. I don’t get why Mythic raiding had to become such a perfect all or nothing either. Why were the days of out-power-scaling a dungeon/raid bad? Who was WoW trying to appeal to? Why did it work? Is it still working?
M+, to me, is a joke. All those micro power steps. One moment you’re in a +5 struggling (Yeah it can happen folks). The next you’re in a +7 wondering why it’s so easy. What is even the point of such overkill scaling?
Then you’re all the way at 20, watching groups just barely pass while you sweat your butt off, only to find out it’s a joke. Then you step into 21, 22, 23. It’s all still a joke. You won’t be an achiever in the eyes of these players until you nail your +27 with mechanic-avoiding tactics. Why even?
3 Likes
It would still be +20, yes?
Because you should be in (sic) i522 gear at that point. Everything scales up to “stay the same.”
S1 of SL: needed 20s
S2 of SL: 20s
S3 of SL: 20s
S1 of DF: 20s
S2 of DF: 20s
S3 of DF: 20s
… see how this works?
Can you guess what we’ll need for S1 of WW? 
You are wrong. Right about previous but no chance a +20 is needed in new system or its doa
Heroic will still have luck of the draw if you queue in. That’ll help.
I think most WoW players are so starved for content, that they will accept super repetitive content like M+ because the alternative is having to raid. Most raiders I know just want to raid log, they hate M+ with a passion and only do it because it gives them an advantage in gearing.
I would love to see M+ just have its own progression, have it completely separated out from the other pillars of endgame.
At the end of the day, M+ just feels like it tried to copy the repetitive gameplay loops from A RPGs endgame, but completely fails in WoW because it doesn’t have the core designs concepts that make that content fun in ARPGs.
I think they are trying to bring more build diversity with Hero talents, another system that just screams ARPG, but I think it is going to be another fail because of how obsessed the WoW player base is for balanced specs.
The game has just felt off to me since Legion, you can just feel the ARPG crap that the Diablo 3 developers that were folded into the WoW team throughout the entire game now.
I think a lot of WoW players that defend these systems probably never touched a ARPG in their lives, so they don’t really understand why these systems just feel so subpar in a MMO setting, because they never experienced them in a good ARPG.
3 Likes
So… it’s going from a 9ilvl difference between heroic gear and M0 gear to a 17ilvl difference between them…
A lot of people are talking about how these are good and aimed changes for more casual players but I’m going to disagree. A 13 ilvl jump is enormous, especially for less skilled players who lean on gear to help carry them more.
These changes for players like me who are fine just hopping into mid tier keys or into normal raid quickly are more or less fine but anybody under that mark is going to strugglebus REAL hard if there’s no way for them to get stepping stone gear to bridge that 13ilvl gap with relative ease. And anybody who talks about great vault rewards doing that is an idiot… you think the more casual M+ crowd want to sit around for weeks hoping for the right upgrades so they can beat an M0 more easily or start pushing low keys?
Yeah idk, I’m not convinced by these changes AT ALL. We’ll see, but I’m highly skeptical and this removing the smoothness of gearing is actually going to cause issues… this just feels like it’s been changed in the name of elitism from the M+ crowd who keep getting their way while raid gearing still kinda sucks and casual folks are now seemingly being punished.
Again we’ll see. Most WoW changes have been pretty good in DF but it’s still blizzard so I lack the trust.
2 Likes
Really?
Cause I read that as: A S4, +10 will be as hard as a current +20.
Which means I’m i488 and I can knock out a +20 in S3 no probs.
And in S4, I’ll be able to knock out a +10, around same diff.
But we’re scaling up to i522 … which would allow me to do +20s.
Same as every other Season.
I’m pretty sure that’s how it’s gonna work. 4+ years of precedent versus reinventing the wheel??
if you want a challenge then go try playing shooters competitively. trying to turn anything that’s pve into a comp setting is the most brain dead thing ever
2 Likes
When did I say competition? If you dislike content that challenges you that’s fine.
1 Like