Make Mythic+0 queue-able, or this system isn’t going to solve any issues for casual and solo players (who are going to get gatekept on account of their low item levels).
The biggest issue with megadungeons was their overtuning, overly complex mechanics, and the fact that you needed a pre-organized group for them. Now all dungeons are going to be megadungeons, the least popular type of PvE content?!
I would do more M+0 and lower level M+ if you could queue for them.
This change is only going to make it harder to complete the weekly Mythic dungeon quest, unless that quest is expanded to also include Heroics.
So true.
The easy Heroics and timewalking dungeons as we have them now are justified, given the meaningless rewards.
Harder, more time-consuming casual content means I don’t do it on alts. Especially when the gatekeeping is going to get more insane.
This is going to mean poorer metrics for dungeon completion. Blizzard is still failing to understand its casual audience. Players that love the overtuned, overly complex megadungeons are already doing raids and M+.
Ok So if im understanding the “Feedback” and the decisions made as a result.
Heroic dungeons are barely distinct from Normal dungeons at maximum level, and that distinction mostly only matters during a few days after players first reach max level.
NOW - Heroic = Mythic 0
Difficulty gap between Normal and Heroic, was 100% now 300%? (question as i dont know)
Achieves the “increase the difficulty slider” if that’s the feedback - neutral change.
Ilvl increase - positive change.
Players outside this bracket, irrelevant outside of a .0 patch - no change.
“Mythic 0” dungeons rapidly lose relevance a few weeks into an expansion, once the M+ season starts, with occasional exceptions for the weekly event quest.
NOW - Mythic 0 = Mythic +10
Difficulty Gap between Heroic and M0, was 100% now (30% per key) so 400%?
Mythic 0 reward gated by weekly lockout, remaining - no change.
Ilvl reward increased - positive change.
+2 to +10 brackets gone, loot availability hamstrung to once a week - negative change.
Methodical Dungeon Pacing no longer timer dependent - positive change.
Controlled by the group, leader or tank - no change.
The only truly endgame dungeon mode (M+) currently revolves around a timer. This means that other than new mega-dungeons, there isn’t really a place for endgame players who enjoy a more methodical dungeon pacing and gameplay.
NOW Mythic +11 = Mythic +2
2-10 = 0 (weekly lockout).
10-15 = 2-5
16-20 = 6-10
21+ = 11+
Difficulty Gap between old +2 and new +2, 400%+30% per key?
Reward scaled to +11 onwards - positive change.
Players previously doing +2 - +10 bracket content, gone and reward limited - negative change.
Players doing +11 onwards - no change.
So feedback didn’t include, removing affixes (troublesome implementation - Afflicted, or Bolstering) or removing tyr and fort - it is an experimental season after all.
You should take your own advice.
I think these are some interesting changes and the impact they will have on the game are small in season 4.
However, these changes will have a large impact come season 1 of war within. It seems like the jump from heroic (m0 currently) to m0(+10 currently) seems like quiet the leap in difficulty.
And for those who will be clearing m0’s before the raid releases it will give an even larger gear advantage at the start.
Overall I’m hopeful this will get more players interested in m+!
As long as it’s on a timer, it’s doubtful.
Overall I think this is a good and needed change, I just hope this isn’t the only changes we’re getting to m+ in s4 & 11.0
This change will be applied to the Season 4 only?
Or War Within doesn’t have the timer and this new difficult too
This has been a long requested change to retool M+ for people who don’t enjoy pushing high keys. Hopefully this new direction stays with TWW, now if only M0 (and M0 only) was in the group finder. I have a feeling that will probably be on the way sooner or later.
Looking forward to giving it a go in season 4.
The DEV team still don’t understand the main issue. How can you design a cool dungeon with time trial as the main design? You can’t, you won’t. You won’t create good dungeons with good encounters when you’re designing the entire dungeon to be a time trial. Removing the timer in low keys solves NOTHING, the DESIGN is still around a time trial, meaning it will always feel like a rushed experience. Because the dungeon is DESIGNED to be rushed… LOL
Hard disagree. CMs were fun and the rewards were nice. You just had a hard time finding a good group.
M+ is just weird since it’s literally far easier than heroic/mythic raiding but gives better gear.
If skill is supposed to matter here, this is not the way to go about it, and that said, solo content should definitely go up to mythic track if that is the measure of skill we’re going by here.
Currently, roughly speaking:
And I hate having yet another huge ilvl increase, invalidating, again, all my current progress.
Yeah, and with daily lockouts on the premades.
I’m talking about the folks who have been very vocal about no timer at all.
(I have no beef with the idea of queueable M0, though it’d be a wreck, especially at the new difficulty, and would probably drive more rege than fun)
Considering the hefty reward, I don’t see that as a problem. It should stay with just mythics.
That’s fine, people rage at anything. If the queue has appropriate ilvl gating and a message popping up saying “Most groups are unable to complete this content. Are you sure you want to queue?” that should be enough.
Should being the operative word. But history tells us people will lose their minds if anything queueable isn’t a guaranteed win and blizz would have M0 nerfed back to fit by the next .5 patch.
I suppose that’s possible, but at least the mode will be used if it is in the queue. Making it harder was never going to drive up participation. People who want keys may be stuck on it a little longer but not indefinitely.
You can put a piece of electrical tape over where the timer is on your screen, it barely matters. The only thing that depleting a key/failing a timer does is you get your key downgraded and it’s likely you won’t get rating increase (but you still can if you overshot the level from what you had succeed previously).
People stress about the timer way too much.
I want to time mine cause I play for rating.
Look at communities like WME, if you find keys stressful, and look for group posted with expectations such as “chill”, “completion” and “learning”. Your group won’t implode after a wipe, with those people. They have a code of conduct you must adher to, but for players who find keys stressful, it’s a good place.
I guess we’ll see if the folks saying they wanted it to be relevant longer actually meant it.
I echo that I don’t see the rationale of locking M0s behind a weekly timer, when you can just go to M+ and farm infinitely for better gear. If you want to slow down the pace of gearing just make it drop 2-3 pieces per run instead of each boss dropping items. That way folks who don’t want to dip into M+ have repeatable challenge content.
Also I don’t see the harm of putting in a random queue for M0s with an ilvl gate. You don’t have to use it if want a smoother run, but will increase accessibility.
My guild doesn’t do M+, i’ve pugged my way to 3k as DPS. Yes I had to take it slower, like get 16-17s across the board before i could get invited to 19s… then get 19s across the board to get invited to 20-21, etc. It’s progression. You can equate it to gatekeeping if you want but any pugger can climb.
I’m playing an alt, healer, and I’ve got him to 2500 in two weeks, 100% pugs. Playing a role like healer / tank will def help go up faster, easier to get invited.