Dragonflight Preview: A Closer Look at the Dracthyr

Community General Discussion
710

Oh-kay, sure

  1. Then where are the Death Knights healers at? Since you may have missed that theres more than one argument and one specification to my message so… where are the DK and DH healers at?
  2. Its not that different - there’s a lore reason why DH is just blood elves and night elves but tgeres nothing to technically having had a gnome or a human to dollow in any of these groups, so… DH arebound to elves, regardless of whether another race could have been given access to DH or not, it doesnt prevent them from playing ither rwces sure, but thats not the argument, the argument is that there’s a class and race restriction already and it isnt an unreasonable one
  3. Largely the same point as above really, some folks just want to play humans and only humans, surprisingly common actually in terms of fantasy games, and that locks out demon hunters for them - the argument of “Wont play new race/class because locked to new class/race” is a red herring

The real argument these folks are saying is this: “I won’t main this class based on appearance alone”, which… isn’t that a good thing?
When DKs became available, eveeyone made one, tried them, some stayed, some left
When Monks became available, extremely few tried them, even fewer got to max level with them
When DHs became available, same as DKs but with more pun names

This isn’t a new thing and it isn’t a good faith argument, it is tied to one race/class restriction similar to how DH is tied to elves, regardless of whether you can play warriors or priests if you aren’t playing DH
Disheartening people because they can’t be a gnome Demon Hunter isn’t a new thing, and it has happened even before DH with the EXCEPTIONALLY rare Worgen/Goblin players who wanted to play Monks

Is it a good thing or not? I honestly don’t know and really don’t care either
I know I’ll try them out, see what i think about them, and then see what I’ll main in DF to raid, play M+ with, and PvP if that strikes my fancy

But restrictive classes and races hasn’t really been a good faith stance in a very long time, but whi knows, maybe they’ll ease up on it, maybe they won’t, I’m inclined they won’t but I can veey easily be wrong

711

100% of everything below plate they can wear. They are best suited and designed for wearing mail armor though.

712

Except that isn’t the request
The request is to make a nonbinary race NOT nonbinary, but to have nonbinary as an alternative option (because as I explained earlier to the guy making said suggestion, if you associate gender and gender-representation based on visual ques which kinda makes sense at an extremely shallow level, then the lack of specific gender-visuals is the only way to show nonbinary representation)

And the whole “both parties can have what they want” was already addressed because their non-true forms already have a visage that provides one with boobs or more ‘masculine’-body models
Making it so you add gender visuals to a non-binary character just means that you are saying “Oh you don’t have to be nonbinary, its a choice to be nonbinary”
So… yah’
Its more than a little bit offensive to follow through on the ‘request’ that was made, and whilst Valarien wasn’t as upfront about this as someone else earlier on, its still damn offensive - Drac’thyr are nonbinary, they aren’t supposed to have visual ques relating to any gender essentially
And beyond that, as has been stated, their visage form or non-true form, already provides that option for those who for some reason can’t stomach having an actual nonbinary race in the game

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713
  1. Again those are classes, we didn’t get a new race like Illidari or better looking forsaken that could only melee and tank. We got new classes one of which has restrictions on which races can play it. But no race added so far has been lacking roles, so yes asking why those classes can’t heal is disingenuous to the argument of Dracthyr not being able to tank.
  2. Yes we have a class with a race restriction, we have no races with restrictions on class that prevent all role preferences to be played. Again saying Evoker can only be Dracthyr is fine. But then locking Dracthyr to only evoker prevents people from getting a chance to use on as their main depending on circumstances.
  3. I think you may be on a whole different conversation here. I was responding to you saying that a tank spec probably would not be added. Not sure what racial preferences have to do with anything, I want to play Dracthyr but If my raid needs to keep me in a tank position, then it’s an alt and I have limited play time on something I’m excited for because I have to keep my tank up to snuff first.
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714

If the race is “Non-binary” why do the visage forms have a gender? If you are going to do that kind of crap, why not add the “request” along with the bulky body option for both gender options to represent “Genderfluid” people? If you are going to cry about representation be consistent. It’s a live game, this is what patching is for, if you want “Non-binary” options, argue for it for all races, not just the one you happen to like. Maybe if you are as vocal as the men were about wanting more masculine dragons you’ll get it. Don’t demand a single race be catered, crafted, and locked just to please a very tiny percentage of players.

The race has heavy masculine characteristics in body shape 4. So, your argument is already invalid. The request is just adding a sexual dimorphism distinction they don’t have to add breasts to make them more “feminine”, breasts don’t make a woman.

You can keep the bland base body for both genders or let both genders have all options. (don’t care) Just add an option that gives a larger breast bone, wider hips, and thicker thighs. They don’t need fully shaped mammary tissue to appear more feminine.

715

Oh gg,now I’m confused which the humanoid form or the dragon form?

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717

(Edit: My prior post was restored. going to leave this here just in case it gets ripped down again)

Female players like myself, would just like to see options for a more feminized body.
Personally, I would like to see an option for a larger breast bone, wider hips and thicker thighs. They can keep the base option for those who wish to remain ambiguous/androgynous.

719

Drac’thyr aren’t inspired by the draconic races. They’re a compromise to getting full-fledged dragons. Therefore, they take their design cues from full-fledged dragons, contorted into humanoid form. Full-fledged dragons are gender neutral. As are Drac’thyr.

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720

The funny thing with the posts complaining about how Dracthyr appeal to furries is that there’s basically no way to design an anthropomorphic dragon race without it being appealing to furries.

You can make it as much of a horrible monster as you want, if it looks like an animal what walks on two legs then somebody’s gonna be into it.

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721

There’s a rule about this somewhere.

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722

They could at least try to take a page from their own book when it comes to their design.

Literally:

Look at how much more primal the lower left design is, even if posed “gently.” And the head-to-body ratio.

723

Because illusions can have genders and there are ‘gendered’ roles within dragon society (Alextrazsa is for an example a broodmother which means we associate her with being a woman, her visage form is also that of an draconian-elven woman, so we associate her as a woman) but there’s nothing to indicate that there’s anything even akin to that of a ‘gender’ within’ dragon society besides “breeder” and “impregnate:r”, and as I referenced earlier, the discussion was largely on the basis of associating gender-specific visualisation as representation (I didn’t make the argument that ‘boobs makes a woman’, that was someone else’s, I just continued to the conclusionary effect that non-gendered visual representation ergo means nonbinary representation)

I am actually for this, so I have no idea where you got the idea I am against this - I was mega happy when the barbershop allowed folks to swap their genders because it means folks can have more fun with transmog, it means in a very shallow sense that genderfluid people receives representation, and it is just fun overall for us who aren’t genderfluid (I have a friend who’s dealing with issues related to their bodytype and they aren’t genderfluid but they became tremendously happy that they could feel more in-tune with their character, when they feel more masculine, run around as a man, when more feminine, run around as a woman)

Again, dragons in WoW have largely had no visual representation in terms of belonging to one gender or another, we just have their names and illusionary (/visages) forms to go on (of which they can pick and choose and in-lore they do change over time depending on what they feel like)

Furthermore as I have repeatedly stated, visages still allow people to make this conscious decision to maintain this “Illusionary form = Which gender they feel represents them”, whereas to folks who actually considers the real gender of the ‘true’ forms, dragons and specifically Drac’thyr ARE non-binary (because once again, the destinction of gender has been and always has been derived from their visages which are literally per definition, illusions - this is social commentary that has, whether intentionally or not, existed in WoW since at least WC3)

And also, just saying, the stance of "minorities doesn’t matter so don’t provide them with any representation is not a very sensible stance to take, at least according to me (see how upset that a pair of, strongly implied, homosexual NPCs can be found in Ravendreth and folks reaction to that online, I’d argue that most folks also agree that representation is important to make sure that bigots doesn’t feel welcomed)

Bears, high femmes, low femmes, femme fatale, bodybuilders, Zarya from Overwatch, Brigitte from Overwatch, and so on, and so on, and so on - masculine characteristics equates to masculine characteristics, it doesn’t define gender, only gendered assumptions

Or to put it another way “You don’t have to be non-binary, you can be a woman or a man”, and the issue with this is how close it gets to conversion therapy, the idea that “Oh you just ‘feel’ like this, you ‘are’ this instead” - which is why I was telling folks earlier to stop it because, it has some really damaging and offensive implications, whether intended or not

Drac’thyrs are nonbinary in their true form, simple as that - changing that is saying, rather explicitly, “change non-binary people to not exist/not be represented”

There are 23 races that are playable by people in the game that ALL have extremely distinctive gendered features, Drac’thyrs is a 24th race that doesn’t have it in their true form but does have it as part of their illusionary form, so once again, unless the issue is that non-binary people have actual representation, what is the problem that you are having?

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724

well they certainly didnt give players who prefer to play females, very many options for visage race. at least you can still be a glorious male blood elf. those dracthyr males are gorgeous.

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725

You are still demanding catering a whole race to a minority group. I had stated you can keep the “non-binary” look as an option and the ambiguous gender options should not be limited to a single race if you want true representation.

Since you are going heavy on the catering for representation argument. Trans women play the game, the only trans female character is Chromie a Dragon. Maybe a transwoman would like to play a dragon since a character they relate to, is one. So, are you saying trans women need to just suck it up and deal with proxy dysphoria to please you? That makes your stance transphobic and bigoted.

Also “Visage form is Illusion magic” what is stopping them from using it to alter their dracthyr form as well?

726

There are 4 examples of both men and women in terms of visage models
I somehow at least imagine that there’ll be more than 4 total options for each one

727

i mean my only option as a person who plays females, is human. males get a handsome elf. did you know blood elves were based on fashion models ? you were likely based on mr. i cant believe its not butter

compare. no contest.

728

Yes, one could make it an option
Which would mean that you make a non-binary race optionally non-binary, which once again, is a reference to the idea that gender is a choice, and I already explained why and how this is a thoroughly bigoted belief

And you are correct, it shouldn’t be limited to one race to achieve real representation, and I think providing options that showcase representation that goes beyond a binary two gendered system is important, which is why as I stated I like that one can swap genders at the barbershop, and I think its important that non-binary races stay non-binary as well

Especially since it already provides options for folks who aren’t non-binary and want representation in 24 races rather than just 23 out of 24

729

I never really paid attention to what the base for the models were but looking at 'em now… my only question is this:
Do the female model really look human to you just because of the length of the ears or something?
(I’m asking this since I am looking at them both and they are both using the blood elf models, both the men and women, so I am kinda curious what it is that makes one of them more human to you and I can only think of it being the ears that does it)

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730

Chromie as a dragon has no bosom, either. Visages do. It’s almost like reptiles aren’t mammals or something :woman_shrugging: Sethrak have no jubblies either, no idea why this is somehow a new concept. Whatever you do, don’t play GW2.

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731

in female visage? thats the female human.