Do you "identify" with any of the Community Council members?

Getting a full set of honor gear in wod took a day or two of PvP on a new player. Without that it’s still a fail.

The difference between wod honor and conquest gear was in SL ilvl terms 3 ilvls.

It’s probably not a good idea to interact with GD too much lol. There’s a reason that this CC experiment is happening. That experiment may fail, but be careful how much “feedback” you take from this forum.

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None of them are about mounts, RP, or World content. From the outside, it just looks like a bunch of elite players discussing how to make things more elite from Raiding, PVP, and Mythic+. Not how to make things more enjoyable and maybe get a few more people interested in those activities.


What do you think has been the biggest barrier for you since Cata in regards to doing group activity? I see you’re alliance - and from experience I know I’ve had disastrous LFR and dungeon experiences by (as you mentioned) AFKing, trolling, being an overall rude person. Do you think it was based on time of day / part of the week you queued? Is it a faction thing? Is it because of addons like raiderIO or the build in scores in game? Have you just reached the point of not wanting to bother (can’t fault you for that)? Curious - because I still enjoy putting even though there’s a 50/50 chance of it ending in disaster, hah.

It’s been like 3 days. Relax.

Maybe (keyword) this person:

But, they seem more concerned about BC Classic than Vanilla Classic:

So…not really? Close but no cigar.

Don’t BS me.

Nothing in M+ is necessary for you to progress further into Mythic. You aren’t green parsing because you don’t have an IQD. Beyond a shadow of a doubt if you focused your attention on getting better at your rotation and less time worrying about IQD and just used Titanic Ocular Gland and Old Warrior’s Soul you could end up much better off.

No one at this point in the tier needs to be do M+. Wherever you are, it is a git gud situation. You are choosing to engage with content that you absolutely do not need to engage in because you have deceived yourself into thinking that you’re better off investing time into acquiring loot rather than getting better at the game (because you think you don’t need to get better).

There are people who do need to do M+ at the start of a new tier, but you are not one of them.


I think that’s what it will come to. I think devs are looking to understand why millions of players left such a perfectly designed expansion. But putting together a group of players who like the current system isn’t the research they need to do to find that out. I think it will devolve into discussions about what can be done to casuals to force them to play the game right.

I think you’re right on a bunch of that, but is there any talk about the problems with progression raiding in the CC forum?

There might be, and I might have just missed it. But raiding has a ton of problems these days, especially Mythic progression raiding:

  • loot nerf
  • the fact that the great vault is totally unsuitable for progression raiding
  • Spreadsheet Bosses at the end of each tier that everyone hates
  • long and boring fights that make progression exhausting (Sylvanas is the worst by far, here, at 15 minutes of dreck)
  • having to run M+ in addition to raiding because raid gearing is so poor
  • guilds can’t even run their raids the way they want
  • recruiting is still horrible, they STILL refuse to subdivide the guild recruiting forums by raid times or progression level
  • skips have been neutered, no longer are like BRF/HFC when they were actual skips

There might be raiders in the CC, but I haven’t seen anyone talk about raiding concerns.


It’s still pretty early. Have they even invited all the members yet?

I definitely have plans to address my concerns with the raid environment atm!

I don’t mind talking to people as long as they’re willing to have a discussion. :slight_smile: we aren’t always going to agree or see eye to eye, but it’s important to get others’ perspectives and learn from their experiences in order to come together and problem-solve.

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If 15 years of betas have taught me anything, it’s that it’s never “too early” to bring up concerns. Because before you know it, it’s “too late”.


Hi, I’m an RPer based on NA servers (Horde-WRA and Alliance-MG) and I’ve posted this in a thread concerning RP suggestions, and I’d love to hear any suggestions you and any other fellow RPers have if you wanted to build off of what I’ve already got brewing :slight_smile:

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Mythic plus was ‘supposed to be’ an alternate form of end game progression when it was created and NOT a mandatory part of raiding.

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So far, no I don’t. There is only one real thread sponsored by the Blizzard mod, and there are only 19 responses to it. Most of those responses are just personal opinions and they span the pendulum from “I Love It” to “Meh”. :woman_shrugging:


Going to answer your questions one at a time.

The underlying cause is Cross-Realm Play to be honest. I literally don’t know a single person on my server these days. I never see anyone from my server. I want to play the game with people I can build relationships with. I log in and go to Oribos or Korthia and all I see are orange name tags (horde) from other servers. I’ve tried to play Horde but know even fewer horde players than Alliance. There is no way in the game to meet people anymore.

Over the past, I have attempted content at different times. I would actually log in and fly for hours while waiting for my 45 minute average wait time queue to pop as DPS. I dare not queue as a tank or healer anymore, even though I prefer them more. It never pops at the average wait time. I did enjoy the warfronts while they were active. I queued for them multiple times. I did not queue for islands because they were developed as zergfests, not exploration. The biggest issue is that people have no accountability anymore. You’re from a random server and they’ll never see you again so they don’t have to treat you like you’re human.

The Alliance is on life support. Every single Blizzard employee seems to play Horde. The best stories have always been Horde driven. Everything skews towards the Horde. That is my perspective as an Alliance player. We were told before Legion that we would get a great Alliance fist bump moment. What happened? Our king was turned to dust in less than 30 seconds. Ummm Yay? Since then our characters have been written very poorly and have to rely on mcguffins to actually accomplish anything. It is surprising they can get out of bed in the morning.

These provide barriers to entry for people new or trying to return to content. Even simple content like Mythic and Mythic+ (less than 10). At least I have been told this is simple content. I’ve never done a mythic dungeon with a group simply because I know I don’t have the ideal spec and arbitrary number someone wants.

Honestly, if I could build relationships with people on my server and not have to deal with strangers then I would try it again. Even if the queues were longer. I don’t think that will ever happen and I don’t think they should actually remove cross-realm play as some people would like that. Just let people opt-out if they wish. And by opting out, I don’t want to start over or pay to transfer to a different server. This character was created in 2005 and I don’t want to abandon her.


The way raid lock-outs work for Mythic is defnitely dog-water. The structure of raids, the lack of solid skips, and the way lockouts work makes it such that guilds are very, very early in a tier going into “Extend forever” mentality and are ending up gear deprived in some cases. Blizzard really, really, REALLY needs to reevaluate how Mythic lockouts work.

I know that when I was raiding this tier, our raid group was at the point where Heroic was trivial and not particularly rewarding, but our main raid nights were Tuesday/Wednesday and our “Farm Night” was on Saturday. What this means is that Farm Night was only ever doing Heroic and Heroic was baby easy, and we’d gotten to the point where we’re running alts of alts because Heroic had been farmed out.

I feel like the situation would have been way less toxic if we could do prog during the week, and then on our farm night we could still go back and do the first three bosses on Mythic. You shouldn’t be sacrificing the ability to do earlier bosses just because your progression nights are earlier in the week. Blizzard should literally just copy over how Heroic works to Mythic. Nobody actually cares about degenerate Mythic split runs, it really, really, really doesn’t matter. Ion has it in his head that the World First Race actually matters and it doesn’t.

There are two connected pieces. Blizzard’s structure of raids this expansion has been really bad, and raid leaders are using the existence of M+ to justify extending indefinitely so their guild is more competitive than it would be if they farmed gear from earlier bosses appropriately.

Laying the blame solely on M+ is intellectually lazy.

The thread, and many of the comments about the Council are not about the concept as a whole, but about the INDIVIDUALS on it. That is what this thread is about.

You don’t want people to talk about their individual interests in a thread about their individual interests.

If people want to avoid that, they should not be making threads about the individual council members or posts about them maybe?

If you do, people are going to respond. You seem to want robots. Nobody, not the CMs, MVPs, or Council are robotic. We are all here to be part of a community, and that means interacting normally and discusing your own views and experiences with game content.


To be honest, I don’t know. I was looking at the “Feedback on 9.1.5” topic and it devolved into PVP loot and Master Looting.

At this point in my life, I doubt there is anything that Blizzard can do that would make me want to get into progression raiding again. I did it for four expansions and the environment just isn’t something that I think I would enjoy anymore. Joining a “casual”
raiding guild in Pandaria and then being told I needed to get Gold Proving Grounds to participate in Flexible Raids told me that. Especially when I specifically applied only for Flexible Raids. Now, I don’t think there are any casual guilds on my server.