The tl;dr is they don’t think nerfing premades is a good option because it would ruin the fun that premade players have. The fun they have is a direct result of just getting very fast easy wins from unorganized random groups with worse comps and 0-1 healers vs their 3.
These takes are absolute garbage. They are outright admitting they would rather premades have fun instead of the solo queuers, or low 1-3 player queue groups and actively ignoring the fact that premades are only popular because they get easy and fast wins.
The really irritating point is that Josh here wants you to go out and run premades without considering that premades only want specific classes/specs. Which means that if you want to run WSG you have to be FOTM or what is perceived as FOTM. Completely ignoring the fact that community perspective has always looked negatively on non-fotm even if they are a strong spec/class is also very short-sighted by the devs.
It would have been better if they said nothing because then we could at least pretend there was some competency behind these devs when it comes to pvp.
It’s an old school social mmo if you can’t be social enough to find premade groups maybe you should try the new expac coming out for retail. It’s much more solo friendly.
I would make it so you can only queue in specific numbers. 1-4 players will always be matched together. Then only allow full 5 player and full 10 player groups to queue together and 10 and 5 player groups would be matched together potentially. This would mean you’d never get replacements if people left when doing larger pre-mades, but I think that’s fine. That’s also how it works in rated PvP. This would mean you couldn’t queue with 6-9 player groups, but would make it easier for the matchmaker to put 5 and 10 player groups together while leaving smaller groups and solo players to themselves.
Also, add queueing from the UI rather than just from town and you’ll have more total players queuing as well.
wild i guess hes not factoring in how many people straight up just opt out of pvp in that case.
glad i already hit exalted. think we went like 40 games without losing… as someone who went though it, im telling you its not fair gameplay- why even allow solo que in that case?
You know why I love solo queuing in BGs? I can flag carry. I have done thousands of hours in WSG. I know the paths. I know how to play my priest. I know what I need to do to stay alive.
I can pick fights with people and destroy them in a healing spec. Or I can out heal their damage and make them give up even trying.
I can be the first one to “break the seal” in a clash and survive.
I solo queue because it’s a CHALLENGE. It’s not meta. It’s chaos. It’s FUN. It’s not a running simulator. I actually have to fight. I LOVE keeping up low gear/low level people in solo queue. No premade is going to take a low level.
Mass majority of my skills in pvp came from solo queueing.
Premading is “fun” in the same way that ganking lowbies or players who have 3 mobs in the open world is “fun”, it’s just comical griefing. It would be like if you could farm rank in a competitive moba/fps game by grouping with your buddies and fighting bots on the lowest difficulty, bots that are quite literally programmed to lose, for hours and hours.
I know what systems are good and bad based on their own merit. I consider all sides of the argument. The premade system is simply bad. You can argue against it, but you would be steelmanning the incorrect opinion for the sake of arguing or trolling. Premading itself isn’t fun and playing against them certainly isn’t fun.
This is one of those scenarios where the system would go “FUN DETECTED, INITIATE PURGE MEASURES” if premading was turned off and people could actually play the game without being massive griefed by purposely unfun mechanics such as premading.
So ya, WSG sucks (different issue just saying), premading sucks, SOD dies for me and many others if there’s no Rated BGs or arena at endgame. At least I didn’t mind leveling too much this time around, felt like less of a chore. I’ve been disappointed with WoWs endgame before but I feel like there’s a decent chance SOD gets more things right.
Queues should only allow up to 5 people. This way people can still play with their friends without forcing everyone to full premade or lose every game.
Thats actually not the TLDR at all. Not even remotely close.
no it wouldnt, its great to know what they are thinking and I applaud them for being honest, even as the loudest voices of cry babies are screaming for changes.
The main point, the TRUE TLDR, is that they want to create something that wont segment the player base too much, dont want to ruin organized PvP, which people actually very much do love and enjoy, and want to be careful because changes are VERY difficult to reverse.
Have you heard the phrase “exploit early exploit often”… so you want changes, but if people find a way to exploit them and benefit, youll be the first person to scream they shouldnt have changed it / rip away all the rewards right? yeah i thought so.
Not all premades run 4 priest 6 hunters. Many would love a mage, a druid, a shaman FC tank, a rogue or two, a ret paladin, a warrior, a warlock, etc etc. Every class has a spot in someones premade. If you actually took the time to learn PvP and find a premade you 100% could find a group and run them.
“There are people who live for 10v10 premade fights and saying “you can’t have that anymore” gives us pause.”
This isn’t being honest is it? People are asking for a solo queue or simply matching premades against other premades, so how in the world does giving premades their own queue prevent them from mathing other premades? They would only match other premades, so they’d be getting what “they live for,” right? Isn’t that win win? Pugs don’t have to deal with premades, and premades get to to exclusively match other premades, like Josh here, says they want to to! Queues being a bit slower is vastly preferable to the alternative.
So yes, OP the bad faith presentation of his arguments are in fact disapointing. The only people that’s against solo queue or pre VS pre is obviously on the Alliance side, and the catering is obvious. The only reason Josh is commenting on it now is that the population on SoD servers has been dropping hard the last couple weeks. They’ll come around, but not before it’s too late.
he needs to do ONE THING, tweet out that the level 40 bracers will not be added. boom 75% of premades gone and wsg in a way better spot with ppl freely queing up in smaller groups and only the occasional 10 man
If you force 10 mans to only face other 10 mans, almost nobody will queue against other 10 mans.
youll see premades drop to less than 1% of what they are now.
Sure people like PvP… but not enough to face only the top .1% of Crusader strike premade after crusader strike premade. It will force the FOTM meta 100x harder and if you want organized PvP you are basically SoL if you arent a hunter or a priest.
