Deserter for being Kicked

[Talacocheta-khaz-modan (Talacocheta)]

Do you actually have a solution in mind, or are you complaining just to complain?

Because we’ve been down this road many times already, through multiple incarnations of the vote kick and deserter systems, and what we have now is the best compromise. It’s not perfect, but literally everything else that has been tried was far worse.

They get paid very friggin’ well to come up with solutions with their game and the problems within it that they created. It’s quite a shame most of their solutions these days do nothing but eat more time unnecessarily.

… but hey, they’re trying, right? /rolls eyes

I agree, Chrace. Why should we have to keep telling the devs for free how to fix their game when they’re the ones being paid for it? It’s not like they listen anyway. (But I did give a suggestion anyway in another post.)

[Teksuo-grizzly-hills]

just don’t get kicked

[Idling-kiljaeden (Idling)]

Except the game can tell when someone is afk or not, so if it detected that the person was doing damage or healing, then they couldn’t be voted for that. Of course some would barely do anything to get around that, so maybe there could be a threshold of some sort to prevent barely there afkers from getting around it.

This yeah. The only reason the desertion debuff when kicked was implemented was for ppl who would afk at the start to force a kick if they didn’t like the dungeon. So having the debuff only go if you were kicked for being afk, and the system only allows that if you are afk - that would at least prevent everyone else who is kicked for other reasons from suffering with deserter as well.

[Teksuo-grizzly-hills]

filthy parents with their priorities all wrong let me tell you
jk btw

*solution: give your kid a key to the house? i think you really should. What if something happens to you and he’s stuck outside?

[Shamanatorz-shadowmoon]

I won’t even say that it’s baffling the mere fact that this was an oversight of blizzards devs part about the easy hijacking of the vote mechanism in island expeditions. They know all too well that this would be happening because it only takes 2 to do that. I’ve been in island expeditions where I joined a run in progress only to be kicked after 5 minutes in it (they probably kicked 2 other people before me so they couldn’t do it right away).

The whole debacle is exacerbated by the fact that when it happens, you get a deserter debuff and to add insult to the injury, have your loot denied as well.

I don’t ask much really - I know how the “community” can be. Just get rid of the deserter debuff for islands. I couldn’t care less about the kick, just don’t lock me out of other acitivies for reasons beyond my control.

[Rhielle-sentinels (Rhielle)]

Do you actually have a solution in mind, or are you complaining just to complain?

Because we’ve been down this road many times already, through multiple incarnations of the vote kick and deserter systems, and what we have now is the best compromise. It’s not perfect, but literally everything else that has been tried was far worse.

Exactly this. ^

Well it’s pretty simple. All of the kicks that are with a ‘reason’ but are not for the reason that the player is ‘AFK’ will not result in a deserter debuff.

… how does that solve anything? No one is going to spend the time to put in a reason when they can easily just do the other option and keep people from queueing again?

And there are other reasons to kick people that require a deserter debuff. Like harassment, bullying, just being a jerk, not doing their job, etc.

Your idea doesn’t work.

[Chrace-windrunner (Chrace)]

I won’t even say that it’s baffling the mere fact that this was an oversight of blizzards devs part about the easy hijacking of the vote mechanism in island expeditions. They know all too well that this would be happening because it only takes 2 to do that. I’ve been in island expeditions where I joined a run in progress only to be kicked after 5 minutes in it (they probably kicked 2 other people before me so they couldn’t do it right away).

The whole debacle is exacerbated by the fact that when it happens, you get a deserter debuff and to add insult to the injury, have your loot denied as well.

I don’t ask much really - I know how the “community” can be. Just get rid of the deserter debuff for islands. I couldn’t care less about the kick, just don’t lock me out of other acitivies for reasons beyond my control.

Anything and everything to feed that almighty /time played metric. Every last little bit helps.

[Shamanatorz-shadowmoon]

You mean, for blizzards metrics of the playerbase or my personal?

In any case, I highly doubt this will work well for that end. It will only make people play less and less of that activity - trust me, I’m running out of things to do in this game.

[Shamanatorz-shadowmoon]

So, when blizzard introduced the LFR-LFD systems, you mean they actually introduced it like a “use it at your own risk” policy rather than actually trying to play the content they are supposed to offer and manage?

[Méo-azjolnerub (Méo)]

Here’s a middle ground solution. If you were removed from a group due to being vote kick (you didn’t leave yourself) the game subtracts from your deserter debuff time the queue time you had to wait to get into that dungeon. And if you waited longer than the duration of the deserter debuff, you get no deserter debuff at all.

So a tank that gets vote kicked probably gets the full deserter time since they have instant queues, but a DPS gets a much reduced or no deserter at all because they’ll have to wait anyway.

The point is to not have DPS punished twice because of their already long queuing time.

[Skafest-sentinels (Skafest)]

Same thing just happened to me leveling a toon. It was a guild group of someone’s 380 pally tank and a leveling hunter in normals. I was actively doing stuff when I got hit with the IE kick deserter. I guess spriest isn’t good enough for them.

[Breakbeat-kilrogg (Breakbeat)]

Avoid pugs as much as possible, and dont bother complaining on here, you’ll just be pummeled by people who either don’t care or figure you’re lying.

Or…

Join as many PUGs as possible so the confirmation bias making you believe they are all horrible withers away. Also, when you come to the forums, tell the whole story. This way, people will believe you.

I’ve done thousands - maybe tens of thousands - of PUGs over the years on all my toons, and I have never been kicked from a group, even when I was doing novice things or making silly mistakes or lagging behind.

It’s the rarest of the rarest of the rare to be “kicked for no reason.” And yes, rare does mean that it still happens. But, if it’s happening regularly to the point where you feel sub time is being wasted and you need to come to the forums to complain, then yeah, the whole story of why you are being kicked is not being told.

It’s like if you got in a car accident one out of every ten or twenty times you got in a car. You couldn’t keep complaining that you are “getting in accidents for no reason.” No reasonable person would repeatedly believe you, and rightfully so.

[Izael-illidan]

Not the systems fault you did something to get kicked.

[Shamanatorz-shadowmoon]

Not the systems fault you did something to get kicked.

Why there’s always got to be one to always show up with this same old strawman saying that the person must have done something in order to be kicked?

While this tendency is a lot less likely to happen in dungeons, they can happen. However, they are more common in Island Expeditions, where it only takes 2 votes to kick people out. A group of 2 players can queue to the expedition, get to 99% of the content completion and then boot the other player to prevent him to get loot and - presumably - getting his piece of the loot. They can also just kick you out of the content right after it starts - no afk detection, nothing. Poof. 30 minute deserter debuff.

There is a post in regards to this theory on how the loot distribution works in expeditions and how it might encourage groups of people to do it.

Granted, it doesn’t happen that often, but the idea that it can happen is appaling. They need to do something about it.

Meanwhile, if you are pugging expeditions and you happen to get into a group with 2 other people from the same guild and you are unaware of their intents, just collect all the azerite you can, because it’s the only thing you can carry away with you if you get booted before the end.

[Nemsmess-sargeras (Nemsmess)]

damn straight. ff14 doesn’t pull this garbage. it also lets you leave without penalty if someone has already left.

is there a problem? no. we wait and we get a new tank. or healer.

in wow, people do not care at all about the penalty. its not a deterrent and its only hurting players who are wanting to play the game. way too often, i’ve lost tanks out of nowhere. at the start, after a pull, after a boss, DURING a boss. it’s nonsense. most likely, they are even proceeding to log out and play another character. after all, the game encourages you to have several characters.

receiving a penalty when being kicked solves nothing. besides, the way the game is structured, if you lose a tank or healer, there’s a good chance someone can and will switch to the appropriate spec to keep going. i’ve done it. so can you.

[Wariya-stormrage (Wariya)]

getting kicked for absolutely no reason

But you wouldn’t be able to see the reason of why you are being kicked anyways, so why does this matter?

[Actasanc-kirin-tor (Actasanc)]

Yep it happens and it happens to many people, not just you.

You can’t punish the people for abusing the system because computers aren’t telepathic and thus don’t know if a reason is justified, and in fact most justifications could be argued back and forth for days, weeks, or even years.

[Iostream-thrall]

Trolls kicked me from island and I get 30 min debuff. Reason number 301 this expansion and game is crap.