I’m pretty sure I am understanding correctly but I want to be sure I am not missing something before I consider going Fatebound. As assassination, our only method to apply Deathstalker’s Mark is from stealth ambush, unless we have an active Darkest Night. Is that right? I find it very difficult to maintain Deathstalker’s Mark from mob to mob and I often have streaks of combat where my Hero Talent is basically useless. Vanish resets the mob when solo. Is there a better technique?
You are correct.
Dealthstalker might be fine for raid bosses. For everything else, it’s a PITA.
I’ve been using Fatebound for quests and dungeons. Next week we will see how it goes with raids.
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Thank you. Gonna go Fatebound at least until I am just doing raids.
I am having the same problem with it. Even in raids, Vanish is just not up enough to use Deathstalker effectively. It feels bad to play. I thought I had a solution when I decided to rearrange my talents and pick up Blindside. But Deathmark requires ambushing from stealth (as you mentioned) so it would not apply it. In fact, Ambushes gained from Blindside may even be a totally different spell ID as even if I was able to get back in stealth with Blindside active, the Ambush would not mark the target.
I imagine it works much better for Sub considering the shortened cooldown on Vanish and also Shadow Dance.
So I am sticking with Fatebound for now, too. But I hope they will fix Deathstalker to make it work a little better for Assassination rogue. Maybe rework Shadewalker for Assassination so it reduces the cooldown on Vanish instead of Shadowstep.
The correct solution is to remove the stealth requirement.
Traditionally, stealth and vanish have never been designed as dps abilities. The Dragonflight rework forced Assassination to focus its rotation around stealth. This was and still is a bad design and the devs just don’t get it. I truly don’t believe any of the devs have played Deathstalker as Assassination.
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My main problem is how different sin vs sub are in application. Sub just re-applies it constantly, whenever and wherever it wants. Sin can get literally locked out of reapplying it due to many reasons…
- Boss intermission while vanish is on CD.
- The mark just going away when an add dies.
- Stealth breaking when approaching your priority target, etc.
It just feels terrible. But people have said this from the get go.
Stealth and Vanish literally always were dps abilities, right from the time i started in legion. You always saved Vanish to reapply empowered garrotes. The DF rework did nothing but give us an actual means of accessing those empowered abilities through Shadow Dance which meant Vanish could actually be used for utility.
Shadow Dance needs to be brought back. Tea needs to be removed. ER needs to be removed. Game changing capstones need to be added in their place. Theres nothing wrong with the stealth gameplay, it was just the only complete gameplay pattern cause the other capstones are abysmmal.
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Sub can keep Shadow Dance. It has no place in Assassination or Outlaw.
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It does whether you want to be childish about it or not. Class tree was supposed to bring themes from all 3 specs, and Shadow Dance was the perfect theme for sub to contribute.
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huh? Who’s being childish? How to lose an argument instantly.
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Oh im sorry. I skipped a step. Why doesnt Shadow Dance belong?
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Not gonna play your game. I didn’t like Shadow Dance on sin or outlaw when they had it. It feels good as Sub. Obviously the devs agreed. This thread isn’t even about that, but here you are.
So just because you didnt like it you feel it had to go? Sounds pretty childish to me. There were no games being played. I explained my position in depth, you cherry picked one line, then got upset i called you out. Between Blizzards apathy and the number of shortsighted players giving feedback, i cant tell who is doing more damage to the class.
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Yes, because I didn’t like it - as sin or outlaw that it should stay where I did like it - as sub. This isn’t a hard concept to follow…when people like things, they want them to stay. And when people don’t like things, they don’t want them to stay. That’s not childish, it’s just life, and it’s just my opinion. Calling me childish for sharing my opinion is a bit weird, and it’s kind of pointless to keep arguing back and forth over it.
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When they dont like things, they dont play them. Not liking it isnt the reason something should be removed. Something should be removed because it contributes nothing. Shadow Dance contributes a boatload. You had 2 other capstones you were free to play, instead you wanted the singular good one removed. Backwards logic.
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I mean you’re gonna have some number of players who like things and some number of players who don’t like things. Most people that don’t like things are going to want them changed.
You can’t just start calling anyone whose opinion is different than yours “childish” and say they have “backwards logic.” People are going to differ in opinions…that’s life man. My opinion is that thematically Shadow Dance feels better as a Subtlety-only skill…and it should remain only there. Obviously the devs agreed with that. You can think otherwise without resorting to insults. It’s ok.
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While you are making a logical point here, we have no idea why the devs removed shadow dance. Concluding they removed it because they agree with you that it “feels better” as sub only is a pure assumption.
Unless I am mistaken, we don’t know exactly why they removed it, and it may have absolutely nothing to do with the reasons you claim. Hell, they might even regret doing so by now, but we don’t know.
Right…we should only assume the devs loved it and thought it should stay, but removed it anyway. Good point.
You’re being purposefully obtuse now man. I’m not trying to be a dick or anything.
The whole point is that we shouldn’t assume ANYTHING because unless you’ve got a crystal ball or are a mind reader you’re guessing at the “why” as much as anyone else.
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So assuming the devs do something because they thought it was a good idea is wrong? Come on. That’s not obtuse…that’s just common sense. I don’t even know why i try to communicate in here, honestly. The thread isn’t even about that - it’s about how poorly Deathstalker’s Mark play is as sin. Even the Deathstalker defenders can mostly admit this.