If Warcraft followed any realistic premise, Anduin would have been murdered by the nobles at the end of BFA for stopping the war against the Horde. I love orcs, they are my favorite race in WOW. But I don’t even consider them to be good guys. They are one of the most violent races I have ever seen in a video game.
Their difference from other races that we truly see as villains is that orcs are much more charming and interesting. But they are undoubtedly a race predisposed to causing destruction without apparently needing to. Just as Saurfang rejoiced enormously at the possibility of killing again in “A Good War”. And he only felt guilt when he realized that this war would not bring him glory according to the orcish concept of glory. The war that Saurfang started was solely and exclusively out of his real desire as an orc for more land and military power.
People keep trying to paint the nature of orcs as something it is not. Orcs are an imperialist race with very obvious predispositions towards genocide. Garrosh is just a mirror that most orcs don’t like to look into. But he is the reality of the race, which is why he is a character with so much gravitas.
I could see like this. Daelin and the Kul tiran fleet chase after Thrall. However Thrall and his fleet sails into the maelstorm to try and lose the Kul Tirans. No sane sailor would ever go into the maelstorm, so the Kul Tiran fleet abandon the chase.
The orcs manage to make it out of the Maelstorm but their forces are scattered all over the Barrens shoreline. Daelin and co think the Orcs were killed as a result until he learned that Jaina was alive on Kalimdor. Only to find that the Orcs were alive as well.
Iirc the stuff with the Darkspear in the tutorial WC3 campaign takes place before the orcs sailed close if not into the Maelstorm and the “human” forces you fight in the third mission of that mini campaign are from Daelins fleet. They are listed as ‘Kul Tiran forces’ after all.
The reason why I view it this way is that the Daughter of the Sea song paints it that Daelin and his fleet had no idea that the Orcs were on Kalimdor until they arrived. There is also this line from WC3
Grunt:Warchief, our ship sustained heavy damage when we passed through the raging maelstrom. It’s unsalvageable.
So I wouldn’t say it was pure incompetence, but that the Horde were willing to do something near suicidal to evade the Kul Tiran fleet. To the point that the Kul Tirans abandoned the pursuit, not only for their own safety but probably banked on the Horde fleet from being destroyed outright by the Maelstrom. Only to find out that their assumption was wrong when they sailed to Kalimdor to ‘rescue’ Jaina.
Ironic that WoD was touted as showing another side to the Orcs… instead it showed them becoming genocidal conquerors even without demonic manipulation or corruptions.
The Iron Horde were the British Empire and the Seljuk Empire on steroids.
So the orcs are better sailors then the Kul tirans (who I will remind you have a veritable army of mage/priest/shaman hybrids called tide sages who’s whole schtick is commanding the seas) and able to navigate what is probably the single most horrific water hazards anywhere in creation.
Also as a reminder that it took precisely one tide sage to locate the wreck of Daelin Proudmoor’s ship which had been at the bottom of the ocean for like 20 years.
So we need to accept one of two possibilities: Either a bunch of orc refugees who had been lounging in internment camps for 20 years were just innately better then the best navy the alliance could muster OR Chronicles is trying to handwave a plot hole.
Also worth noting that a maelstrom is a colloquialism for a storm so this gets even stupider if it wasn’t THE maelstrom which was created by the well of eternity self destructing.
The Kul Tirans have a vertiable army of Tide sages who at this juncture would be a match for anything Thrall could do with water.
They literally have the ability to find any boat anywhere in the ocean whether it’s floating or not.
So either the Kul Tirans who are the best god damn sailors in the world according to everything we had been told up to that point were outmanouvered by a bunch of refugees (most of whom would have no idea how a boat works if they’d ever actually seen one) OR the kul tirans are objectively terrible at the one thing that they’re supposed to be good at.
Like I said, they could just have underestimated the orcs to ths point of not thinking they would survive the maelstrom and simply not bother in getting tired in pursuit of them.
Again: The tide sages would be able to confirm the status of the boat in question. Simply calling off the search on a hunch and not checking with them just tells me that Daelin and the Kul tiran fleet as a whole must be the result of a multi-generational eugenics program wherein the trait they were looking for was stupidity.
Or ~and this is just a hunch~ Chronicles isn’t infallible as a reference point for lore.
I love how you put words into my mouth and you jump to that conclusion. Instead of the orcs getting through it via pure blind luck. Remember, their fleet was scattered after they sailed through the Maelstrom. Most probably died as a result. Therefore it is not unreasonable that the Kul Tirans would believe that the orcs would die as a result.
And how you ignored the rest of my post. Why is that? Oh right, I brought up how even in WC3 the Kul Tirans were pursuing the orcs by bringing up the third mission of the prologue campaign. But according to you, that is only brought up in Chronicles vol 3…
Well given that THE Maelstrom did exist in WC3, as the WoE lore etc first came from there and that the Darkspear Isles were close to the Maelstrom, I reckon they are one and the same. And we know that the Kul Tirans made it as far as the Darkspear Isles. Since you fight a faction of humans called ‘Kul Tiran forces’ in the third prologue mission.
Honestly I feel that ohgodimblind is being obtuse on purpose and there is no point trying to argue any other point to them.
It is clear they are set in stone on their view. Considering they waffle posted me (aka, oh you like pancakes, therefore you hate waffles) and tried to pretend that WC3 did not have the Kul Tirans fighting the orcs on the Darkspear Isles.
Actually, I can acknowledge when I’ve made a mistake; As I apparently have with this particular mission. I mostly attribute this with a combination of the prologue being overshadowed by other events in the campaign, the fact that I haven’t played it in like… 16 years at least and the fact that the kul tirans are flying the colors of Lordaeron (The traditional colors for them would be a sort of teal green).
My point does stand however, that the Kul tirans did a craptacular job of tracking them and also failed to contribute to any of the major story beats of WC3 outside of trying to pick a fight with the orcs and their allies after thrall had gone to great lengths to avoid conflict with the alliance.
