To be fair, the difference between a bronzebeard dwarf and a wildhammer seems to be entirely cultural, while dark iron dwarves were changed into something else.
Biologically(is that⌠Whatever) probably. They are mentioned being taller and more nimble, and you could see blizz doing some minor changes for being more surface based dwarves.
Their culture though definitely needs a nod somewhere.
Every Wildhammer earns their Storm Hammer as a right of passage. Warriors, hunters, shaman ect. They never leave home without them. Plus the gryphon thing.
And again. Gilgoblins one would expect to be water minded in their racials.
Trolls are probably easiest to work with.
Differences in their resistance and a few modifications to regen and berserk.
Addin OPâs idea on mounts and heritage?
This could be an amazing idea.
These are all fairly reasonable expectations⌠and also all things we probably wonât even see happen either because itâs easier to just slap a skin on a race and call it a day with no other effortsâŚ
It would also be nice to see some sort of option that would just change out visible race tag to that of one of the races made available through customizationâŚ
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Still worth asking I think. Got to let blizz know if there is interest in this sort of thing.
Who knows maybe they just didnât think of it themselves.
Oh, donât get me wrong, I agree⌠itâs just they havenât had a very promising track record when it comes to anything like this⌠they tend to steamroll in one direction and ignore player input 90% of the timeâŚ
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This is a good thread Bagzak created. One of the big issues I have with sub races being customization is the potential lack of extended lore customization. Things that donât make sense:
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Eredar without warlocks
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High elves without paladins
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Wildhammers without druids
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Gilgoblins without some kind of water breathing.
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Grimtotem without warlocks and rogues.
Other things lost if these just become customization:
Racials
Voice lines
Potential extended lore
Heritage armor
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Iâve been a big supporter of these options for High Elves and Wildhammers but I also support them for other races. Iâm fine with some of these âsub racesâ being rolled into their parent race but it worries me if theyâre stuck with very alien aesthetics that donât fit them. The High Elf idea has been used a lot and iâll use it again here because I think itâs the most simple alternative racial for any of the sub race looks.
If you pick a Void Elf and choose the âHigh Elfâ aesthetics you can tag yourself as as a High Elf and it opens up extra class options such as Paladins. By choosing to be a âHigh Elfâ you get these Alternative racials.
Arcane Embrace: Does the exact same thing as Entropic Embrace except itâs an arcane aesthetic and arcane damage.
Arcane Rift: Exact same thing as Void Rift but the visual is arcane.
Their 1% Shadow resistance becomes 1% Arcane resistance.
As for Wildhammer I donât know what their alternative racials could be. But like the High Elf option I would give them the option to tag themselves as a âWildhammer Dwarfâ and doing so would open up the class option of Druid to them.
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Plus one support. You have brought up a lot of valid points and ideas I would love to see realized in game. After all, this expansion totes greater character customization as a major feature and I would love to actually feel like a Dark Ranger or a High Elf or a Wildhammer when choosing those customization options. I would love to hear your ideas regarding Dark Rangers as customization.
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My issue with the inclusion of more and more playable races is that it inherently leads to less development time for each individual race. Even before allied races, the current races lacked development.
Beyond Volâjin dying, what have the darkspear actually done since their rebellion in MOP?
Beyond Baine complaining constantly, what have the mulgore tauren actually done since the centaur in Cata?
Beyond⌠nothing, what have the Pandaren done since MOP?
While beneficial for player customization and autonomy, I think the inclusion of more playable factions detracts from the story. There is a finite amount of focus Blizzard spends, and when we have so many different playable races I believe it becomes spread too thin.
I can vouch that the Darkspear sent many of their Shadow Hunters and troops to Draenor and then helped during BfA as Nazmir is focused on Rokhan as well as the Drustvar invasion force is led by the tribe (Also the Arathi Warfront has the Darkspear as one of the 3 forces)
But yeah. The problem with Blizzardâs storytelling is that they donât really write the race, they just write a leader and⌠well. Thatâs it.
The tauren havenât done anything during BfA but since Baine appeared and shuffled around the story. It kinda counts for Blizzard, I think
And sometimes they kill that leader and forget to get a replacement for more than an expansion
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Clearly other people do, though? I guess I donât understand why you would argue against something other people want on a basis of âthis isnât important to meâ.
Thatâs an inherent issue with Blizzardâs writing, though. Theyâve chosen to focus on character driven stories when in the past theyâve had much better success (in my opinion) with stories that involve more ordinary people of the factions, and if they could get back to that thereâd be plenty of room for developing new (and existing) races.
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I mean I donât think itâs important to the premise of Shadowlands and what theyâre trying to do. Theyâre trying to make customization options available for those who want to portray their character the way they want. An armor set or racial isnât really important in that regard. Nor is making and writing it into an entire Allied Race. Heck, itâs better the way it is now so people donât have to dump money on race changes.
Itâs also more irrelevant seeing as how Blizzard said they wanted to slow down on Allied Races in quantity and only add them when it aligned with the core narrative being told, I just donât think that the specifics of a Wildhammer having exactly 14 feathers on a piece of armor is all that important to the story of⌠you know. The Shadowlands.
Then we would end up with more limited customization overall for our characters.
This is my biggest gripe with the current allied races. They are just copies of our races with things that I wish I could use for my normal character really.
I say I like the added in customization for our character just very simply as options to choose from on our character screen. I like that way more than allied races or giving the sub races a in game story written reason to be on the alliance or the horde. I never had an issue coming up with my own story, there is enough there to build upon.
Anybody could say ⌠hey I want to fight the real threat so I joined so and so. Look at any place in our world and itâs been affected by greater evils.
This is what Iâd like too. Right now to me it just feels like cosplaying the Wildhammer or Sand trolls. Without those additional racials and story elements it feels half baked.
For some folk these things do matter. And this isnât looking to make them ARâs, this is a halfway setup. Just adding the flavor the various sub-race/groups should have had anyways.
This is relevant as its about the races and sub groups theyâre adding through customization. And again this isnât for ARâs, more of a half measure.
I would want there to be a option, like when you change posture for orcs, to determine that if they added it.
Just a switch you set so you can be a Wildhammer Dwarf or a Sand Troll rather than what it is before. Kalzhun makes a point that in both of those cases though just Troll and Dwarf can suffice, so Iâd be a little more willing to skip that bit.
Still Iâd like to see the optional racials tied to that sort of setup. Where you just select it at character creation or at the barber.
Less so if they add things like Gilgoblins, or Sanâlayn, or Dark ranger.
because barbers do amazing things in WoW now. lol
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But adding all this stuff essentially makes them into a new Allied Race. And I donât really think a race should just be able to swap racials by going to the barbershop. Granted, I know Iâm a Zandalari and I have one single customizable passive, but four? Eh⌠I just donât think it works.
But this âhalf measureâ is bordering on Allied Races.
hereâs the thing with introducing new leaders
blizzard was completely incapable of handling their leaders before ARs
now theyâve got even more pieces to juggle
they are not capable of introducing more characters to their story
When it comes to wanting to know what is reasonable, I use that term because I know that the whole point of customization races are to be able to put them in the game more easily without having to take as much time or resources to make them an allied race.
There are some issues that I see, currently. People have made arguments for these customization races to get certain classes, like Druids for the Wildhammer and Paladins for High Elves which make sense. Another issue I see is an example I used involving Sanâlayn as a customization race for Blood ElvesâŚhow do you explain Sanâlayn Paladins and Demon Hunters? Paladins can be given an explanation, but then how would you explain Demon Hunters? If they could be them, then that means Illidan had Sanâlayn among his ranks in which would be confusing. Of course, they could add a new Demon Hunter starting area with new races, but would that make Sanâlayn be Sanâlayn or would they still potentially be cosplaying Blood Elves?
Seeing as you select a parent race and class before customization with the new Shadowlands character creation, I find it hard to imagine being able to code it in a way to lock out or add classes depending on which race you select. Then the question arises that if they went that directionâŚwhy would these races just not be allied races instead, given all the space for new races on the new character creation screen?
This is why Iâm trying to figure out what is reasonable in terms of expectations and what isnât. Itâs also why Iâm worried of races just being plopped onto parent races as a sub race and then forgotten about with no in-game presence at all.
Also sharing racials is fine when it makes sense, and I feel that they should be reasonable and donât mess with balancing PvE or PvP (like Gilblins with water breathing). It shouldnât be something that makes guilds min-max and force their members to, for example, make every member a Tauren and change them to a Taunka because theyâre fighting a cold heavy raid boss.
Just my opinions, of course. Iâll add more thoughts later.
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I think differently. Bagzak is suggesting that theyâd mostly be cosmetic or minor changes. Blizzard has already introduced the ability to switch race at the Barbershop by adding in these customization. differences in Racial being tied to that or a separate button really isnât that far off.
I think its more a matter of having them be present. Not necessarily that they need to be heavily involved.
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Theyâre asking for story, heritage armor (albeit within reason), mounts, story, cutscenes, etcâŚ
At that point they should just make a new race.
Though Iâm totally cool with them recoloring current Heritage Armor. Iâm still baffled that the Magâhar are the only ones who can choose when thereâs multiple Lightforged and Nightborne color schemes in the files.
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I say just give people an achievement.
Earn rep with the high elvesâŚ
Get title.
This would unlock a new more arcane version of the void elf traits.
Give void elfs an racial version of paladin. but with this trait have the option to change your paladin skills to holy.
Gaining the Title High Elf. Boom.