No one’s suggesting the timer doesn’t get reset, we’re suggesting that in TBC you could get partials on when it gets reset, and that it was possible to get 80 energy shifts instead of 60 due to spellbatching.
The reset is entirely the problem, because you aren’t getting partials with a full reset so you’d never get 80.
But if the energy gained from right when you shifted got batched until after you shifted, wouldn’t you get 80? And why are you so sure partials didnt exist? I’m saying partials are PART of a reset.
At the very top of the thread in which the addon author lays out the various under workings of his mod:
Yields 1 shred per tick, and 1 powershift/tick. Probably too mana intensive, but requires >testing.
Thresold at 18:
40
60
shred
18
38
58
shred
16
powershiftYields 1 shred per 1.5 ticks, and 1 powershift per 3 ticks. Sweet spot? Maybe. Requires testing
Threshold at 16:
40
60
shred
18
38
58
shred
16
36
56
shred
14
powershift
Notice how it starts at 40 every time? That’s Furor, and nothing more. At no point are partial tics even accounted for. I remember using this addon and it was fantastic for the few weeks it actually worked, since it literally played my class for me and let me do pretty damn good DPS.
This indicates to me that partials were gone at least as late as Patch 2.4.2, but most likely in Patch 2.3 or Patch 2.4. Either way, partial tics and background continuous Energy tracking died at the end of TBC, but before Wrath pre-patch.
This addon doesn’t seem to leave any time for a partial to start, so why would partials even be a factor in this addon in the first place? Instant Cat>Caster>cat powershifting doesnt apply partials, we know this already.
And you still haven’t answered the spellbatching thing.
That’s the point, trying to leave room for a partial doesn’t GIVE you a partial, else he’d tune it to shift you at a later time to make the one-button macro more efficient. As posted above, you could wait halfway through a tic and get diddly squat until 2 sec after you shift.
What about it? Spell batching wouldn’t change anything for us one way or another unless partial tics were something we could squeeze out.
Read the post again, the part where people mention latency and having to time the energy tick right before their shift in order to get the tick in their next shift. Combined with wolfshead helm, this would give us 80 energy total, just like before.
You’re missing the point. They want to minimize loss by avoiding any delay in shift since that’s just dead regen time otherwise. Plus, this whole thread is mostly trying to min/max when it is best to use Powershifts to not run yourself OOM and whatnot.
At no point does anyone even consider getting partials, and yet if they still existed and could be manipulated appropriately, they’d absolutely trying to maximize partial tics for efficiency’s sake.
Look at Post 37 by Mijae, page 2.
Also remember this entire thread post-dates the stuff in the OP from EJ and is from the time period in question.
If it’s just about dead regen time then why would they be talking about waiting until after a tick to powershift. That would waste so much time if you weren’t getting energy out of it.
So basically, you are suggesting they made two, separate, targeted, undocumented changes to energy in two different patches, which would greatly affect how the class plays whether you shift or not?
Have you seen the mp5 swapping mechanisms found on current patch feral?
You’re waiting until after a tic so you can use it and immediately powershift, and all the testing you see on that thread is whether to shift at various thresholds. Each threshold has you shifting once you consume Energy beneath a certain point and trying to balance Energy earned against Mana used against overall DPS. The highest DPS is obviously achieved by shifting the MOMENT you use a skill and can’t use another in the next GCD, but that’s just prohibitive as hell on our mana, the goal in the thread was balancing that act.
The dead time would be from using energy and then waiting for a partial tic time to pass before attempting to powershift in order to game the energy income. Since that’s never once discussed and two different posters highlight the complete reset of energy tics, all within the Patch 2.4.2 era, I see no reason to think that EJ in this period was just outright ignoring the existence and/or usage of partial tics.
Yes. I see no other reason to conclude otherwise given the FeralKit addon discussion and the very awkward Wiki post. All of the 2.4.x patches have incomplete lists of undocumented changes, including API changes. I don’t think the final death of the smart macros during Sunwell era was actually recorded officially.
" its too hard to time the energy tick right before you powershift, but it can be done." Does this sound like theyre spending the energy to you? Or does it sound like they’re trying to powershift within milliseconds of a tick to have it carry over to the next shift. Because having a 1 second window to prepare to powershift is not “too hard”.
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Where in the thread I posted do they say this? The WoWHead post (marked incorrectly for what Patch it was even posted in given the dates) is by someone that a) doesn’t seem to understand how Feral works and b) contradicts the EJ post.
If waiting for a tic was worthwhile, we’d see it in the thread in which someone made an automated addon to intelligently do the shifting for us when it was optimal to do so.
EDIT:
http://web.archive.org/web/20090414034727/http://elitistjerks.com/f73/t25842-feral_powershifting_macros_thresholds_mana_management/p8/
Post #180 - June 25, 2008
angi
I need the manapot for a battlerezz, so chain chugging manapots is no option for me. Not smashing the buttons means loosing energy at the shift because you reset the energy tick timer each time you shift and the later you shift the more of the current running tick you loose. That is the big advantage of the macros you can smash them and don`t have to worry if the powershift is an energy gain or not. If an ooc procc is lost, you quickly destroy the energy of 3-4 shifts. If that happens more than once in a fight, the whole powershifting was worthless.
Yeah, that settles it.
Zero energy, full reset is accurate to the last patch of TBC.
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The classic mechanics were 1.12 ONLY because they didn’t have data prior to 1.11. They have all the TBC data so we are getting 2.4.3 base. People always forget the only reason they did Classic that way is because they didn’t have the data. It doesn’t mean they have to do TBC the same way.
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Yes, call the organization that kills more animals than any other on the planet.
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Correct me if im wrong but didn’t that addon rely on energy number conditions to work? How would it be able to detect people’s latency and calcluate the perfect number of milliseconds to shift at? And what type of powershifting is Angi talking about where losing an OOC procc is worth 3-4 shifts of energy? You keep on seeming to imply you know exactly which of the posts from these threads are correct and which are wrong simply from your own memory.
Yes, which is why you spammed it.
Angi misspoke about missing OOC because someone above them mentioned it themselves, and they were both immediately corrected in the subsequent posts. Just read the thread.
It didn’t because it didn’t need to. Had it needed to, it would have either a) required a manual input of your average latency or b) would have yoinked your current measured latency the same way it was pulling all sorts of other info. Given the host of conditionals it worked with in selecting your next action, a “no-action” could have been worked in just fine while you continue to spam a button.
No, I’m just finding accurate information from places I know that got checked rather religiously. A WoWHead comment that implies partial tics and a need to time is less trustworthy than a 9-pg thread that repeatedly explains the lack of partial tics either directly or indirectly and with not a single repudiation in sight, despite there being hosts of other back-and-forth posts correcting other misinformation.
This post is after 2.4.3 hit.
http ://thedruidsgrove.org/archive/wow/t-12796.html
Annikk
09-01-2008, 06:57 AM
I have honestly never used powershifting in a serious dps scenario. The timing needs to be really exact for you to get any real benefit from it
That doesn’t negate what I’ve been posting, as waiting too long to shift after a GCD means wasting part of a tic. And all the models in that 9-pg thread show going from 0 to 40 from Furor, and then 60 once 2 sec pass from the moment of shifting. There was always a slight delay on Furor activating so you’d shift in at X, but not get the Furor bonus until 200-400ms later, bu the tic was always 2000ms after.
just reroll rogue, feral is dumb
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