Covenant Compromises are Impossible

Like an RPG should be. That’s the point you’re missing. You can be really good at one thing, or be the Jack-of-all-Trades mediocre damage across all things.

Like I said, you being afraid to make a decision is not the game’s fault.

Not modern ones anyway. People want to be great at everything and still have free choice.

But that isn’t enough because they’ll run into the “meta slaves” and elitists still.

That’s why classes exist?

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And you want to effectively dissolve that distinction. Point?

Since when? Classes still exist. The topic is Covenants. Not classes.

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Because to be able to swap from Fire to Frost or Beast Master to Marksman you had to invest hours upon hours to get the artifacts, legendary items and gear. If you are someone who for example does DPS and Heals you limit the ability to be able to swap specs.

I find it interesting that people keep trying to put it under the “die hards” where as my hunter for example, I might only want to swap to Beast Master to tame a pet. There are many reasons one might wish to swap between specs and from what I am seeing of Covenants the beneficial spells between a DPS and a healer are in different Covenants.

I still don’t understand why other players having the ability to make more choices in game in anyway impacts anyone’s ability to not do so and still have fun. It doesn’t matter to me personally, but I am always hesitant with ANY game system that limits player choice.

My point is that those ‘simple solutions’ that people are talking about are really not simple. You can’t just reskin or swap the abilities like in those ideas, you have to essentially put each covenant’s entire system within every covenant because each covenant ability has the covenant’s talent tree based off of it.

But you absolutely can. It’s so simple.

I love this panda! xD

I don’t think you’re awful but a cool
Straightforward dude!

It’s the same principle. ‘I’m a rogue, but this is a ranged fight. Blizzard please give me Hunter abilities and a Bow.’

‘I’m Venthyr, but this is more of a Bastion fight. Blizzard please give me Bastion abilities and make it snappy.’

Bruh don’t question the logic of the 4/12 mythic spriest who doesn’t use shadow word void how dare you.

But Covenants aren’t limiting player choice… in fact player choice is a core feature

You want choices without consequences. We want choices with consequences.

In my esteemed opinion, there are four types of players.

1.) Serious raiders/PvPers/M+ that would benefit from being able to freely swap between covenants.
2.) Casual raiders/PvPers/M+ that still aim for min/max (god knows why) and would benefit from being able to freely swap between covenants.
3.) Casuals that still want to do instanced content and M+ and are often rejected because they’re not optimal. They would benefit from Blizz’s attempt to break the meta
4.) Casuals that don’t do any instanced content and couldnt’ one way or the other.

So really breaks down if group 3 is the biggest group.

Right up until you want to swap to a different covenant and then need to swap back either for performance or class spec and unlike artifacts they will not stay where you left them and you can work on them the entire expansion, you will lose your progress and if you choose to go back it will be much harder which will limit those who play multi-specs.

Personally I think as people start getting into them and there is a huge imbalance between wanting to play their DPS spec over their Heals you will find less people playing multi-spec and as the community experiences those challenges they will find that the swapping is much more punishing than they imagine and they will find out that it doesn’t just impact those ‘min/maxers’. Time will tell. Right now IMO it’s more about hating on the ‘min/maxers’ than seeing the potential impact on a more casual game play.

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That’s exactly player choice

You dont lose your progress by switching, you just work on a quest chain or progress bar to get back into the covenant.

Everything else you said is irrelevant. It is chiefly player choice that covenants enforces whether its choosing for the first time or switching

And multi spec isn’t a problem when the game is so trash that you make a bunch of alts to 120 to play.

All covenants are good and bad at something. Switching to optimize for every piece of content is doing what someone would hate the min maxers for

Because min/maxers pull this stunt every time there’s a new expansion coming.

To you. To me it is not. :slight_smile:

Enjoy your day.

I agree a core feature of covenants is limiting player choice

A tangental ramble about people playing multi spec does not support or take away from your argument that covenants aren’t player choice.

Simple as that.

People lock themselves into one spec for majority of the time anyway.