Honestly, I’ve never had that problem after eating Taco Bell. And when I get Taco Bell, I get the a ton of stuff.
I can feel you on that. I never was able to get into hardcore raiding because of irl commitments.
I never even stated against that. I’m not even saying Destro isn’t broken. Affliction getting gutted is why I swapped to hunter from warlock.
My only point was that you can’t just look at overall and say the low specs are trash.
BM does have its issues mostly derived from very weak tier compared to MM and SV having absurdly good tier but it’s also because being a ST focused spec and not having the aoe burst outside of spirits for fights like mythic artificer where you need burst on the platforms.
Tldr overall isn’t a good indicator due to multiple factors.
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OK LOL! That was pretty good
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fotm players aren’t too many, but flavor of the patch players are MANY.
look at the overall trend for parses per percentage of the playerbase and it steadily goes up everytime, and you can see this being hyper mirrored in classic wow where majority is 2 specs.
20’s aren’t overly more difficult than 15’s (highest i’ve done was old scaling dungeons equal to 27 bcus legion “base” dungeon scaling for kara/cathedral was higher) but the difference for overall damage at 20 is similar to 15 because it’s only 30% more health in total, it’s when you have a dedicated group of players optimizing their cooldowns (which isn’t many sadly) that you get the more ridiculous results bcus you’re not just haphazardly using your cooldowns as you do with a pug.
You’re right that would be unpopular.
I think Blizzard has given up trying to limit big pulls at this point and figures spec imbalance at the top end is probably the best case scenario. It always ends in pulling larger and larger packs because that is what is required eventually in an infinite scaling system.
When they’ve done other things like aoe cap, higher tank damage taken, less threat, etc which all makes larger pulls harder the player base revolts.
Even things like too many priority interrupts, too high unavoidable damage, etc. get railed on.
my point wasn’t that it’s a decisive loss for those specs, but an indicator that there is clearly a problem if their overall performance for a raid is lacking with good and bad fights you can get a general idea of where things sit.
bottom 5 in overall don’t have a single fight where they’re close to top, and vice versa for the top specs aren’t worse than middle of the pack for their worst mechanically challenging fights even jailer.
i’m probably more emotionally charged in this debate due to it being warlocks and foxing sick of seeing them being overpowered pieces of sheet while hunters continue to get worse and worse every xpac after a “rework” that literally no one asked for after nearly 20% of the entire playerbase was playing marks which wasn’t even top 3 dps at the time it was just fun with a niche with very clear spec identity… getting reworked from that in an xpac all about “spec identity” 
my azeroth in heaven i’m learning to use a blood dk ability the more i think about it.
anyway, didn’t mean to be as toxic i was, but it’s exceedingly frustrating seeing them refusing to balance the game because it’s not hard to do they just won’t.
Did you folks forgot to nerf survival hunter? Completely outliner in mythic+
Which IMHO is unfortunately limiting.
Imagine a game where tanks have mechanics that limit pull sizes to something like 5-8 mobs.
Then you can have wildly out of balance damage profiles and find balance in things like a two tank, two AoE team pulling 10-16 mobs at a time being competitive with a one tank 3 DPS pulling 5-8 at a time.
I’m somewhat guilty of this, but this is mostly from perspective of it happening in oversized pulls, especially with the current seasonal popping three mobs in, that turn into a different single mob, and having to pull off something like multiple loyal beast interrupts in the middle of a complete mess.
At some point it gets more anxiety inducing than fun. Add in explosives and a tank that thinks that’s also the cats job… And it’s a log off and do something else experience.
Taken from Josefine in this thread on Demon armor removal https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/en/wow/t/demon-armor-removal/1212115/13
What really doesn’t make sense is that they’ve tried this before.
The reason the talent even exists is because warlocks were too squishy after losing the old Demon/Fel Armor (or maybe it was part of Blood Pact then? I forget) despite the extra stam.
From 8.1.5 patch notes:
If it didn’t work before, why do it again?
If the point is to free up a talent choice, just make it baseline. And if button bloat is an issue, just make the darn thing passive. Warlocks are supposed to be tanky, but without the armor, all the added stam kinda just makes them mana sponges for healers.
ww are getting some CHUNKY buffs.
theyre gonna wake up one day and be like “DAMN IM GOOD!”
im all for better buffs than boring 3-4% flat increases but chunky 20% increases are spooky heh.
I’m curious about outlaw. will it be enough to outshine the other specs? those are chunky buffs too… interesting.
Where are buffs for other classes that need better AoE? Since we’re giving WW monks better single target, why not give other classes better AoE to compete with Locks, Hunters, and WW?
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Do you even know why Destro is that far ahead? Because if you do, then you should know it looks like it’s getting fixed in 9.2.5 possibly.
Well even outside of mythic plus normally mass pulls are a nice change of pace, but now if you are playing certain classes its just a place to do tank damage and feel bad about your choices. Its not a major thing but even in raid there are sometimes just big trash pulls and its fun to blast them down. I enjoy blasting down the pantheon trash on the characters that can and feel like afking on the characters that can’t. At least to me this feels like a design flaw even if the damage type is highly situational.
Its not enough to stop me from trying the low aoe classes every once in a while but it is a deterrent.
Couldn’t agree more.
Please buff affliction!! I love the spec but forced to play destro or demo. I was hoping to some sort of a buff if anything but hey since destro is so op right now I won’t hold my breath till dragon flight.
Why would you limit pull size when people love pulling big. I’m glad Blizz is finally listening and might give every spec decent AoE now going forward
Seems like Blizz is still trying to limit pull size after Tazavesh. Some of the mobs are brutal in there.
If they really wanted to limit pull size, just make a bunch of caster mobs that don’t move, have multiple spell schools, and can one shot the party if not interrupted
It’s understandable and I probably didn’t help matters but I think we both agree we just had things worded a bit differently.
Either way no hurt feelings are issues over here.
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As if Shamans needed any nerfs lol
Only positive is taking my windwalker through Torghast. I want to see things blow up lol
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They did this in Shrine of the Storm and people hated it.
For the most part people want easy no mechanic mindless pulls they can aoe down and feel good about themselves.
Like reaping.