I’ll take 12 stories worth experiencing over 0 stories worth experiencing.
Legion and DF shouldn’t even be uttered in the sane sentence. One is GOAT, the other is one of the worst expansions. DF is worse than SL honestly.
1 Like
This is a ridiculous take.
Covenants and legendaries ruined the gameplay.
There weren’t any fundamental systems designs that ruined the player experience in DF that I can think of. Shadowlands was actively anti-player. Dragonflight didn’t feel that way at all.
I get what your saying OP, but it also created the hero problem, every single player is some huge hero that’s going to save the day. Instead of us all being a simple adventurer working together to get it done. Many complained about this problem and wanted to go back to being that simple adventurer.
I think a combination of the two could work. Class stories without every single player being the center of the attention.
2 Likes
SL is my most played expansion and DF is my third least played (skipped Cata entirely and skipped most of MoP).
SL dropped the ball at the end of 9.1 and through 9.2 narratively but 9.0 was incredibly strong. The anima drought era of SL was actually amazing from a lore PoV and the raid was amazing. Strong leveling campaign capping off with a great raid. I think only really WoD beats SL in terms of having an amazing first month.
I agree that class fantasy is important, but Legion did disservice to it. The most artrocious had to be the Priest one.
Many races have various takes on specific class, so if we take Legion then in case of druid, you onl had nelf lore essentially. Tauren, Troll and Worgen Traditions were nonexistent, and that is supposedl class lore as well.
I was also not a fan ot turning shadow magic to void magic. Shadow magic was much more versatile, and could be applied to many cultures. Void is very specific, all consuming and supposedly makes user mad.
Maybe we should get bigger focus on racial lore and while at it expanding on various class branches.
2 Likes
Whats wrong with a troll mage being in or around the kirin tor? They accept all races.
They even have tauren now.
Race Andies smh.
Has Reddit memespeak really devolved to race andies now? Yeah, people care about their racial identity. It’s as important as class identity. The intersection between race and class results in themes that just class reductionist themes tend to flatten.
“What if there was an international Hunter’s guild where we talked about our kills?” = Stale; what does this have to do with my Elven Ranger? Or Troll Headhunter?
1 Like
They accept all races because the Kirin Tor as an organization was homogenized and flattened. This didn’t work out well for either the Kirin Tor or Trolls it turns out/
1 Like
No it isn’t. It really, really, really, REALLY isn’t.
Yep, this is why the game is so bad. I hate to blame one guy, but WoW has turned into a boring ARPG under Ion
1 Like
Not an Argument/10
1 Like
You can literally just swipe your credit card and change your race. Your race has almost no impact on the game. You have a few grains of spice on top of your steak. For the longest time race was basically not acknowledged at all other than as a string and maybe a few starting values - faction played a role but race was not really a thing.
Class is the lens you interact with the World of Warcraft. Class matters.
Ease doesn’t really mean anything now that people can 1-70 in a single day.
Oh look, how embarrassing, someone who wants to talk about “for the longest time,” but doesn’t realize that race/class combos used to give various unique abilities (Hello, priests!) didn’t you take the opportunity to relive what you clearly missed out on with Classic?
Anyway, the abilities you use have very little impact on the narrative, which is where the Class Hall actually comes in. Class orders were largely unique only at the surface level. You were not interacting with them in “class specific ways,” the mage tower was a better example of that. It was just a coat of paint, thus “lens through which you interact with the game,” doesn’t really hold water here.
Sorry, Class Halls were primarily a narrative device, not a “unique, super special gameplay hub.” The narrative requires absolute homogenization of organizations which is bad. Stretching where class fantasy is generic which is bad.
Race matters, racial lore is what the Warcraft universe is built on. Not some silly, rushed fantasy of “What if, like, a bunch of different hunters of various races all had the same personality traits and sat around talking about their kills? Isn’t that so epic and unique :DDDDD”
2 Likes
It’s really not.
“The Alliance of Lordaeron”, “The Dark Horde”, “The New Horde”, “The Alliance”, “The Burning Legion”, “The Scourge”, “The Illidari”, these are many of the most defining forces in the World of Warcraft universe.
The only race that really matters that much in total isolation is probably the Night Elves, but even then if you look at the War of the Ancients the conflict was eventually defined by a coalition of forces coming together rather than just one single race/society.
Can you explain a little more why are you upset about my proposition?
Especially when Tauren Druids would benefit from it, so their only purpose wasn’t to be nelf sidekick, and actually expand on their lore a little more to make it more distinct?
3 Likes
Notice how none of the things you listed are homogenized and are composed of distinct races with specific arcs. You are literally proving my point.
“No, The *World of *Warcraft (lol) universe is built on factions involving distinct races!!”
Yes, precisely, thank you, I couldn’t have said ti better myself.
That’s what Tauren are though.
This whole “every race is equal to every other race” thing is some sort of new-age modern propaganda being applied to a fantasy universe.
Tauren haven’t really… done anything. They just kind of existed, got bullied a bit, signed up with the Horde since the Horde helped them first. They mostly exist so Horde can mooch off Kaeldorei lore via Druids.
If you think so little of Tauren then that is even more reason to flesh them out to not be so one dimentional and I’d love some Native American inspired druidism.
There really isn’t.
Tauren are fine. They’re just a backdoor to port some lore into the Horde. They’re useful functionally in that way. Ultimately they’re just “Druid stuff, but Horde, and also a bit more Shaman stuff”.
The factions do things. This whole “every race needs to be going out and doing an equal amount of stuff” is just silly. Gnomes are a meme race. Goblins are a meme race. They’re supporting cast that add flavor to the faction they play a part in, but they’re not an important or defining characteristic, they are consumed into the larger melting pot of the Alliance.