Hunters are another class that’s pretty near and dear to my heart, so I was wondering if there was any interest from the hunter community to have me add them into another project I’ve been working on for Mistweaver Monks:
I just recently got access to the beta (yay), so I’d be happy to try and pass along feedback to the beta forums as well.
If you have Beta, than harp on the devs about the excessive 2 and 3 point nodes in the BM tree. There shouldn’t be a 3 point node in any talent tree across all classes/spec.
BM could use 4-6 points of freedom via reducing the 2/3 point node costs.
To be fair, many improvements we’ve seen have come from preferences being hammered out and made clear not over the course of its own expansion, but a couple expansions prior. Some of our improvements going into DF were things noted also in BfA but not changed in time for Shadowlands.
Simply put… True, they probably won’t make it to DF, but the systems through which powers are granted now has actually complicated our (ability to give) feedback on their relative potency, fun, functionality, interest, etc. of those powers, so projects like this probably wouldn’t be entirely in vain; we’d at least be learning something from them (beyond, even, that it’s hard to agree on anything).
That said…
The wording here makes it sound like you want Hunters to give feedback on Monks. I’m guessing that you are instead looking at how you might rework trees, in general, recently completed one such mock-up for Mistweaver, and may now be moving on to the Hunter Class Tree and Spec Trees?
Alright. In that case I’d suggest three primary tenets:
Feel free to create obligatory nodes even prior to the capstone tier, so long as any playstyle deviation/addition they create can be avoided (e.g., via a passive choice opposite them in the same node, such as Serpent Sting / Master Marksman) and those nodes are incredibly easy to path to.
Take talents that currently seem slightly too expensive at 2 points and reduce them to one point at still great enough effect to feel appropriate (in the sense of a fully filled node), and then buff literally ALL other talents up to remain competitive with it, OR, increase the value of the first point of two and adjust talents elsewhere to be more synergetic with the 2-pointer (such that you’d still likely want the second point if taking the synergetic talents).
Obvious examples: Natural Mending, Rejuvenating Winds, and whatever new talents may be made for Exhilaration. Since frequency and potency have multiplicative returns, those would be synergetic, such that the first, inflated point would be optional but very good, a further point in the other nodes nearly obligatory if having taken the first point, and a second point in each optional but very good again.
The goal here is that every single point should feel good and meaningful, but two-pointers can still be useful as sort of a pathing-friendly short-hand for what would otherwise be the core talent and a further investment available right below it.
Lead into the capstone tier (e.g., across R7) not with throughput or generic personal utility (% avoidance, etc.), but rather things that can build off of the many choices taken above them. For instance, you might have a talent that causes a part of the effect of your Aspects to be shared to your party, raid, or nearest X allies, another that grants your F/T/C passive to them, another that gives a further shared charge across all Aspects, etc.
Taking at least one of these paths down to the capstone can be considered semi-obligatory —with relatively cheap paths to each but not simultaneously to all— but where really getting both ends (say, giving the raid both your Aspects and your Leech/Speed/Fort) would ultimately cost you capstone talents.
I can toss you a TTM mock-up later, but it will likely use orphan node headers to the capstone tier, because I simply think that is by far and away typically the best way to build an eclectic class’s capstone tier, and many of the capstone effects will not yet be concrete, only descriptions of the general effect or gameplay intent.
Neat. I mentioned a TTM mock-up before, so I will pass that and its explanations along to you after work.
In the meantime, this is the Discord link to a temp server on workshopping Survival talents if you want to talk there. Figured giving out Discord info directly over public spaces would… not be the greatest.
discord.gg/3grJqzm5
Edit: Sorry, I wasn’t able to find the time to do a full explanatory write-up, but here’s the TTM mock-up. Obviously still WIP.
Orphan Nodes (as seen on the DH Class Tree, 2nd tier, are used for Tranq and Misdirection, since we don’t want those being pathing-limited). Their being on the tree also lets me offer alternate variants of each (Viper Sting and Second Shadow), so at least that’s one silver lining.
Ideally, though, they’d be baseline, with glyphs taking up any space for QoL options.
It’s meant to be imported into TTM(TalentTreeManager). A program you can download for your PC to view and tinker with the talents in a talent-calculator styled presentation.
There might be a Mac version, though I kind of doubt it since I think I needed to update Microsoft Framework to run it? At any rate, if you can get to the discord, I’ll just run you through it when you’re free.