With the way frost DK plays, specially with how they tuned pilar of frost to be a flat 45 sec CD. Doesn’t it make sense to just have breath and ERW just be 90 second CDs at this point?
5 Likes
Can Breath get removed, please? I’d prefer a style of play that requires a brain, not this mess.
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Am I in the twilight zone? BoS is the one part of frost that you actually need some brain cells to maximum your breath uptime.
A non-breath spec is the literal ret playstyle of DK, hit pillar and spam oblit and HB when it lights up. You can’t get more braindead than that.
3 Likes
… At the same time, BoS being the Voidform for Frost DK. My Blood DK had to pay the price on her RP economy thanks to Rune of Hysteria being removed due to it being too good with BoS.
I inherently have nothing against BoS. But I just don’t like the fact that RP feels so dogwater to use when not used. At least Frost Strike hits decently now…
Like I said, wouldn’t be surprised if they remove it at this point. BoS has always been a polarizing ability.
1 Like
They nerfed everything in frost except for Breath after admitting a very large portion of the community hates the talent, even when alternate builds were still behind breath builds. Thats enough proof to show its going no where.
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If you are having troubles with Blood runic power and need hysteria, you are playing wrong. Death Strike shouldn’t be pressed but once per 5 seconds unless it’s just absolutely needed. There is no benefit to spamming away your RP with how it is now.
At what point were you actively using Hysteria as Blood, and why?
Remove BOs please.
4 Likes
More RP Capacity = More Globals for Death Strikes.
More RP Generation = Less Runes and Globals needed for Death Strikes.
A more resource efficient option and an alternative to FC.
I’m aware of what Hysteria did.
To my recollection the situations in which it was actually ever worth taking were very few and far between as Blood.
It’s not as bad as taking Rune of Apocalypse as Blood.
I just think it was a decent alternative and like Hysteria as a runeforge for Blood since you know RP being a lifeblood for Blood DK in all.
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Sure, and walking down the street is still faster than crawling. Just don’t mind the people on bicycles and vehicles cruising by you.
Again, to my recollection it was rarely a worthwhile alternative. Rarely being “almost never”.
Interesting analogy and opinions.
1 Like
The analogy fits the comparison to Rune of Apocalypse that was rendered. Neither was typically used as Blood in comparison to Fallen Crusader.
This really isn’t a question of opinion, either. Fallen Crusader was just blatantly better than Hysteria for most of Hysteria’s relatively limited lifespan if I am recalling things correctly. There’s a reason for that, and it’s due to the relative strength of Fallen Crusader compared to other enchantments and most of the other runes the class has had.
In damage dealing, perhaps. It’s like you are comparing Strength to Runic Power under context of running content. In that case, of course FC is better!
I like how my RP flows efficiently with Hysteria. It just feels smoother. Less RP needed for DS. More RP to pool. It’s a QoL that is just as good as FC defensively. (EDIT: Well… Feels good anyway)
I guess people don’t really value defense as much when people just want to rush things.
1 Like
It never did that. It only affected your RP cap and RP gen. The cap increase was negligible and the RP gen was a procced buff.
FC is just better in general. It’s an incredibly potent Strength proc, which influences more than just damage.
Hysteria’s relative increase to defensiveness was unreliable and generally low-impact for Blood, which made Hysteria situational to the degree of being an incredibly niche runeforge. Again, these situations were few and far between, and I remember maybe one instance of this during Shadowlands before weapon swapping for runeforges got hit.
That would imply Hysteria was notably better defensively. My recollection of that difference was that it was a marginal difference if a defensive use case was actually why it was taken.
It was just an unnecessary runeforge (with the design and potency it had, anyways) for any spec but Frost generally speaking, and it fed into the negative design cycle of Blizzard not adjusting BoS properly to make it a more consistently usable ability.
At this point, hysteria being good or not in DF doesnt matter since DS has changed to the point that you dont want to spam it since each damage instance only counts once towards increasing its heal. So you cant stack up a lot of damage taken and then churn out 4 relatively high healing death strikes. You get 1 DS and the rest would be the baseline.
Even if Hysteria was good in DF for blood (it wasnt) and if it still existed, it would be worse now just because of that DS change. The increase in strength not only increases your damage output, but increases your parry so not only is it offensive, its defensive with Blood as well as providing yet another heal. Its just better than gaining a higher RP cap and a proc that might happen.
Think what I meant to say was less Runes and Globals needed for DS. But you know what I meant. Relatively speaking, if you generate more RP from runes with Hysteria, you do get the benefit of “Less RP needed for DS”.
While the RP gen was a procced buff, so was FC. The 4% heal on proc was whatever at best.
Let’s see… 4% Max Health Heal and 15% Strength on Proc. Not counting with Unholy Bond.
Is it a powerful damage increase? Yes.
Does that mean FC is better in general? Probably. Since we value damage a lot nowadays.
Does that make Hysteria not a viable alternative? Not really.
Yeah, I don’t know about you but 20 RP cap along with Ossuary with Unholy Bond gives you a total capacity of 34 Runic Power. Almost an extra Death Strike.
20% RP Gen means every rune you spend gives you 12 Runic Power up from 10 when it procs.
I think you’re underestimating Hysteria a bit as a viable alternative to FC. Also didn’t Bonestorm used to cost Runic Power rather than Bone Shield Charges?
Between you and me, I kinda want some variety other than using FC all the time. And rather to conclude that Hysteria is better defensively, I am saying that it is a viable alternative to Fallen Crusader for Blood Dks.
I am also not really a fan of how Runic Power functions in general as a Death Knight lately. Runes are just objectively more valuable than Runic Power and as a fundamental of the class, these two resources are constantly fighting for a resource that all classes use that is a Global Cooldown.
For Blood DK, this is not really the case since RP is a metric of how sustainable you are after taking a couple of hits thanks to how Death Strike works. More RP from each Rune from Hysteria Proc, more RP to hoard to fend off a big blow that you just received, more healing opportunities and is also a metric that healers don’t have to worry about you as much since you are a health yo-yo.
You pretty much know this and yet I don’t understand why you would underestimate Hysteria. I think it’s to each on their own.
For Frost DK, Runes are funneled into Runic Power for BoS to consume constantly. If you are not using BoS, you are at a mercy of RNG called Runic Empowerment/Corruption to get your Runes back whenever you press Frost Strike and last time I checked, Frost Strike don’t hit as hard as Obliterate unless you actually crit with Shatter.
In a nutshell, I really do want some variety and I wouldn’t be surprised if they removed BoS because they have been kinda incompetent with it. I really liked the idea of Rune of Hysteria. It’s just a shame that it got removed because Frost abused it to the point of its removal.
EDIT: Also… ahem… I should probably say “Was” since Hysteria doesn’t exist anymore. 
You are missing the parry increase from the strength proc.
An extra Death Strike means nothing right now with how DS works, and what does any of this have to do with the topic exactly? You literally derailed this thread to talk about Hysteria being used as Blood for half the thread.
On average, the difference was not a big one. The proc was a relatively short buff and a relatively low given value to the proc increasing your RP gen.
No, you got more RP to spend on Death Strike, but the amount of RP given extra by the proc was not particularly great.
The heal from FC is a free minor bonus, and isn’t the main point of taking FC. The Strength proc is the point.
It’s a powerful damage increase, and Strength is factored into Bone Shield armor given and Parry.
So no, FC is not just a raw damage runeforge.
Hysteria was an alternative. Viable in the sense that using it wasn’t going to prohibit you from clearing most content, but the question is more one of why you bothered to use it. It was a niche runeforge.
Bonestorm did cost Runic Power, and if memory serves that cost was capped at 100RP.
If Hysteria had significantly higher uptime, it might’ve been more competitive. It really wasn’t.
I’m not underestimating it, because I was there and tried it. It was a niche runeforge.
Having several high-power runes in play means more things that potentially either get adjusted around the class and its specs as they change, or more things the class and its specs get adjusted around. I don’t find the idea of either situation appealing.
Most weapon enchantments aren’t terribly exciting. They’re enchantments. In a world where enchantments alter gameplay significantly I might care, but I prefer the current design in terms of spec and class health.
I’m a fan of DK’s resource economy in general now. Runes and Runic Power have been hammered in as a set of codependent resources. Each provides the other for Frost and Unholy, and Blood has a more balanced approach to both due to its importance placed on Death Strike.
I’m not underestimating Hysteria. It was just a relatively unimpressive rune in most or close to all situations.