BROKEN - Hand of justice gives Paladins windfury

[Toebytter-stormreaver (Toebytter)]

If it was in vanilla then it should remain even if it helps warriors.

#NOCHANGES

[Williams-akama (Williams)]

Not going to be fair being one shot by plate wearing Paladins in battlegrounds.

They already 1 shot rogues even with out this assuming they have the right gear.

This just makes it even more absurd,.

[Harmondale-whitemane]

Absolutely broken. Can’t believe this game ever made it past the beta.

[Williams-akama (Williams)]

Neither can I considering all the QA issues that should have been addressed before it went live.

Been noticing DR’s for CC are messed up, From what i can tell Druid “Bash” is on the Warrior charge / rogue cheap shot DR instead of the Hammer of Justice / Kidneyshot DR where it belongs.

People think that BG’s are going to fix everything, but IMO it’s going to make very little difference in reality because so many game mechanics are broken.

Blizzard REALLY needs to fix a lot of stuff, and I have no idea where they could begin to make the biggest difference; he’ll just making a simple post of “We care and we’re working on it” would be enough for me.

Want to give us a little more? Time tables on various issues…

[Juri-grobbulus]

Batching… for a better world. For a future you can believe in. Wholesome, inferior, batching.

[Theloras-herod]

If only they had had an actual beta instead of a streamer shill fest…

#IfOnly

[Harmondale-whitemane]

It’s turning out that this bug is caused by…BATCHING!

Anybody surprised?

[Gàldin-yojamba]

Nope.

If only they had had an actual beta instead of a streamer shill fest…

What do you think i seen this particular streamer testing in the beta - how to break the game for their own benefit - they never once created a bug report about it.

[Lawrence-grobbulus]

Imagine being a Rogue complaining about PvP. :>

This is normal behavior present in Vanilla, it is not a bug.

[Theloras-herod]

Imagine being a Rogue complaining about PvP. :>

This is normal behavior present in Vanilla, it is not a bug.

[Faeriefire-azuresong]

Its shamans too, I had a shaman hit me 4 times in one swing timer event and 2 of them crit I lost 2600 hp in 3 sec. Checked my combat log and it was all melee damage.

[Harmondale-whitemane]

Hand of justice huh giving two extra swings versus one is normal vanilla behavior?

[Gàldin-yojamba]

It is happening with all extra attacks across all classes. Could you create a Shaman only thread so the masses no longer think its horde targeting the alliance - and that its an actual issue?

[Harmondale-whitemane]

Funny how 99% of the people defending this exploit are Paladins.

[Gàldin-yojamba]

@Lawrence-grobbulus

This is normal behavior present in Vanilla, it is not a bug.

Well actually i discovered some information specific to paladins and rek charges.

@Gàldin-yojamba

The proof is reckbomb

Wouldnt you believe what i just found on a pserver forum.

I’ll quote it.

Since /startattack doesn’t seem to exist in vanilla , I did a bit of googling and found a macro equivalent of it.

/run if not AtkSpell then for AtkSlot = 12,72 do if IsAttackAction(AtkSlot) then AtkSpell = AtkSlot;end;end;end; if not IsCurrentAction(AtkSpell) then UseAction(AtkSpell);end;

Only thing to note is that you NEED to have your Attack button somewhere on your bars, in order for this macro to work.

those attacks all came instantly, same as now

Those attacks all came instantly because they were stored hits. So as soon as you attacked anything, the stored hits would all go off at ther same time.

What this macro today is doing is storing a hit and using it at the same time due to spell batching, then granting an additional unprocced free hit because you exploited a bug with spell batching to make the game think it had a stored hit.

HoJ does not store a hit - it uses it instantly. The same is happening with rek. You are tricking the game into thinking it is storing the hit while at ther same time using it.

More comments from 2008 in regards to macro usage.

By [Menjina] [on 2008/06/08 at 2:02 PM] (Patch 2.4.1)

I think the reason for it is the internal cooldown on “startattack” , so that somestimes
the startattack is not ready yet while switching targets. The “stopattack” should
prevent you from it.

/stopattack
/targetenemy
/startattack

So we know that in 2008 /startattack had a cooldown.

OK WE STRUCK GOLD HERE

http://blue.cardplace.com/cache/wow-paladin/1069149.htm

I’m going to recap on Reckoning and hopefully have the current sticky replaced since it’s filled with 35 pages of the same questions and answers over and over, and a lot of the builds and videos on the first post were pre 1.8. So petition to the GMs for a sticky plsss.

Ode to Mchammar for patronizing Reckoning, and props to him for the original post.

Let’s begin with the Talent description:

Reckoning (Rank 5)
Gives you a 100% chance to gain an extra attack after being the victim of a critical strike.

There are two main functions of reckoning:

Instant Counterattacks
The first, and by most accounts the intended function of reckoning, is to provide an instant counterattack to the targeted enemy whenever you get critted. This can be a spell crit or a melee crit. There are several situations where this will fail, namely if you are stunned or otherwise cc’d, and if the enemy is out of range.

Additionally, the spell at its present state is not working quite as intended. Instead of an instant strike, Reckoning will shorten the cooldown of your swing timer to 0… which means that after it triggers, despite how much time you lost until swinging, you have [Your weapon speed] seconds until your next hit. Ideally, the instant attack would be independant of your regular swings, but this is not the case. Still, reckoning will provide some boost to DPS in all situations, although how far through your swing timer you are when you get crit will have a very significant effect.

Reckoning Bombs:
Reckoning bombs are what makes the difference between a “pretty good” talent, and an outstanding one. The term “Reckoning Bomb” is used to denote the instantaneous consecutive swings granted when a Paladin has “Reckoning Charges” saved. Here’s how that works:

The first and most important condition of a Reckoning bomb is the Paladin MUST HAVE HIS AUTOATTACK DISABLED. Do this by using “t” to toggle it on and off, or just leftclick anywhere on the screen.

The next order of business is to get critted. Just standing there is a perfectly good way to do this, but this step will vary greatly by situation.

The last thing to do is to enable autoattack, by right-clicking or pressing “t”, or your attack button. Done properly, you will attack the enemy multiple times in the space of a second, hopefully creating a significant dent in his life.

The max amount of bonus attacks you can get through Reckoning is 4.

Seals and Reckoning

All seals can proc off Reckoning, and multiple times. It’s sometimes useful to activate Wisdom or Light to get a lot of bonus hp or mana back, or use Righteousness for some bonus damage. Using Justice may be redundent, as it will just cause them to go immune to the 2 second stun.

The only exception is Seal of Command. You can only have one Seal of Command proc within a Reckoning bomb, and rightfully so, as Reckoning would easily be the most devistating skill in the game if you could get every hit to proc a Seal of Command.

A Short (And Subjective) History (Thanks Nidhogg)

Reckoning originally reset your swing timer + gave you the extra attack if you were in melee range. This was nice, but did nothing if they were behind you (rogue) or at range. There was a bug with this, where if you had a Reckoning attack but were stunned, your swing timer was bugged, and you would not be able to attack until you were crit again (to fire your reckoning off).

They patched this, and gave it its second incarnation. This was the current form minus the charges. This was the most fun you could have as a Paladin to date in my opinion. Unlimited stores equalled insta-shotting anyone with enough charges stored up. The fix was to give Paladins a way to still have the talent be useful (instead of useless by being stunned from behind) and also to fix the attack swing bug the original had.

Well Blizz didn’t like this new method of killing people. Sure it was situational, but it had adverse affects on PvE content. You could, if devoted enough time, one shot the outdoor Raid bosses. There are instances (I dont have the links) of a Paladin getting Kazzak to 50% and even killing him in one swing.

Blizz realized that they had struck gold with this talent fix but needed to fine tune it, so they added a reckoning limit, and voila. They should go one step further and explain the conditions it fails and call it working as intended… but whatever.

What You Want Weapon Wise

You want whatever your using to be as slow as possible to make the best use of instant attacks, since Reckoning isn’t normalized damage. A Sticky out now that shows the best SoC damage on weapons is a rough showing of the best Reckoning weapons out there, but it’s for sure, the higher the max damage, and almost retroactively, the slower, the better.

@Gàldin-yojamba

As seen here, no macro was used. This is pserver rubbish and never worked that way in Vanilla.

Datestamp from 2006.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuPEzEoexLI

Tells you to stack charges and not to attack anything at all. ‘Target yourself if you need to’.

In regards to the actual sit/stand proccing of crit ractive abilities - Can I sit down to force a crit and gain a charge?
Charges will not generate off auto attacks or npc attacks by trying to sit down and force a crit. However, ability crits from physical abilities such as Sinister Strike, Hamstring, Auto-shot, Aimed shot, etc will generate a charge if you’re sitting.

This was later proven to infact happen (as seen in the vid). Upon Classic release Blizz implimented a change. That change is -

Being critically struck while using /sit to sit does not cause abilities like Enrage, Blood Craze, and Reckoning to activate.

Using a work around to get a proc on something that is simply not an intended game mechanic is otherwise known as an exploit. You want rek stacks - do it the old school way where you stand there, not attacking and wait to be crit by whatever is attacking you. The amount of time it takes to get a 4 stack or ‘rekbomb’ balances it out.

You still certain this is vanilla era behaviour?

[Theloras-herod]

@Gàldin-yojamba

You still certain this is vanilla era behaviour?

dude, you don’t wanna go up against me on Vanilla/Classic Reckoning mechanics lol

https://github.com/LightsHope/issues/issues/854

How to be a Gankadin

Murtaughs Reckoning HQ

originally published on warcraft movies on 2006-02-24
https://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=15930

FYI that “blue” post that you linked, wasn’t written by a Blizzard dev - it was written by a player named Baconn - and he replied back to me just over a year ago on the forums here:

“Normally if you’re sitting down you would not get Reckoning charges from auto-attacks. However, you could gain charges from random NPCs by constantly sitting and standing up due to server lag: mob would try to attack you as your were sitting, so it’d be a forced crit. However, if you stood up just as you were getting hit, the server would see you as if you were standing and get a Reckoning charge.”

World of Warcraft Forums

TLDR - Spell Batching says Hold my Beer…

[Gàldin-yojamba]

@Theloras-herod

dude, you don’t wanna go up against me on Vanilla/Classic Reckoning mechanics lol

Yes i do.

@Theloras-herod

“Normally if you’re sitting down you would not get Reckoning charges from auto-attacks. However, you could gain charges from random NPCs by constantly sitting and standing up due to server lag: mob would try to attack you as your were sitting, so it’d be a forced crit. However, if you stood up just as you were getting hit, the server would see you as if you were standing and get a Reckoning charge.”

They changed it to specifically not work for Classic.

@Kaivax

Being critically struck while using /sit to sit does not cause abilities like Enrage, Blood Craze, and Reckoning to activate.

All you did was find a workaround from their change - otherwise known as an exploit.

[Theloras-herod]

@Gàldin-yojamba

All you did was find a workaround from their change - otherwise known as an exploit.

Creative use of game mechanics

Seal Twisting also says Hold my Beer

World of Warcraft Forums

PS They changed it so you couldn’t mash X on Classic as was the case on Private servers, none of which had spell batching ever enabled.

YUGE DIFFERENCE MY DUDE

[Harmondale-whitemane]

Creative use of exploits.

[Theloras-herod]

again, Spell Batching and Seal Twisting say Hold my Beer - not to mention Totem Twisting as well but who’s counting lol