Bring Twink Queues Back

[Oäk-bloodhoof (Oäk)]

Seems like if hes the same Ilvl as u its a class balance issue

[Lannfear-dalaran]

1000 + 20% = 1200 (for additional weapon dmg)
1200 + 20% (240) = 1440 (for primary stat)
1440 + 28% (403) = 1843 (for vers)

That is 84% more dmg from every attack and does not include procs from weapons. This is over and above someone in BoA’s.

Seems like if hes the same Ilvl as u its a class balance issue

Read it again… the gear adds that much more power to their abilities. If I had that gear I would be adding that much to my abilities.

I did not compare Stormstrike to Rampage, just the extra dmg output over and above their own attacks. I am not comparing overall dmg in a BG.

This has nothing to do with class. If I was a warrior in BoA’s I would have 84% (plus weapon procs) less damage than them.

[Welfarê-silvermoon]

The weapon proc alone does 1600 dmg + 28% versatility which is another 450.

Where in the world are you pulling theses numbers out of? You seem to think that you can math your way through your argument but aren’t even remotely close.

2k dmg for a proc where people run around with ~4k health. You don’t even have to press the button and you do half their health.

Yeah, only if you are 100% critting for 50% pvp damage in which everyone knows doesn’t happen 100% of the time. Seriously?

NOt gonna even touch on the fact that you didn’t even bother to count the targets versa/armory and other BASELINE stats that reduce incoming damage but hey, way to be 100% incorrect 100% of the time.

And for God’s sakes, comparing an enhancement shaman to a Fury warrior and justifying your stance on gear. Please just quit now before someone with the time on their hands comes in and really makes you feel stupid.

[Kangmurloc-dark-iron]

Show me your numbers from a BG.

My personal numbers have no bearing on our subject.

Compare Gearing options and Obtainable Gearing options is what needs to be compared.

Entry Level Options vs Middle Bracket Options vs End Bracket Options.

Compare level 40 - 46 - 49, this can be done to any Bracket.
(20-26-29,30-36-39,60-66-69 etc.)
Wowhead scaling feature will allow us to easily compare the numbers that matter, STATISTICS.

Having access to these numbers is all that matters.
Blizzard is not required to give anyone FREE STATISTICS and yet Scaling is a thing.

[Lannfear-dalaran]

And for God’s sakes, comparing an enhancement shaman to a Fury warrior and justifying your stance on gear.

I am not lol! I am comparing gear between the two, Which Juga said was "almost identical’. Saying something is identical is a comparison.

Where in the world are you pulling theses numbers out of? You seem to think that you can math your way through your argument but aren’t even remotely close.

Math us through what really happens then.

NOt gonna even touch on the fact that you didn’t even bother to count the targets versa/armory and other BASELINE stats that reduce incoming damage but hey, way to be 100% incorrect 100% of the time.

I was not talking about hitting targets, I was looking at the armories that Juga linked. I was comparing the stats between the two that she said looked almost identical.

Tell me then, how does weapon dmg work? If one weapon does 7k dps and another does 9k dps, is that not more?

How does main stat add to a warrior’s abilities? Does not 20% more Strength equal 20% more damage?

How does versatility as a stat work? is Not 28% versatility equal to 28% more damage?

Please enlighten us.

[Lannfear-dalaran]

My personal numbers have no bearing on our subject.

Because you want to hide how much of an advantage a twink has over a leveller.

Compare Gearing options and Obtainable Gearing options is what needs to be compared.

You are linking the boot pics again.

ilvl is clearly not everything is it? look at the stats of the two toons above again, how it is the warrior get 84% increased damage on all their abilities with the same ilvl gear? I am just talking power gains vs someone in BoA’s. Same ilvl, but nearly double the damage increase to their abilities.

Take a look at your skada/recount next BG and you’ll see vs the leveller warriors on your team. I am not talking overall dmg, but the same abilities on the same spec. Look at how much they hit for on average compared to them.

[Lannfear-dalaran]

Wowhead scaling feature will allow us to easily compare the numbers that matter, STATISTICS.

20% more primary stat (stat is short for STATISTIC)
28% more versatility (a STATISTIC that increases dmg done)

That is more than 50% right there (when you multiply them together). STATISTICALLY, the dmg output would be 50% higher for doing the exact same thing for a twink vs a leveller in BoA’s.

And yet the ilvl STATISTIC remains the same. Something tells me you need to find a new STATISTIC to compare gear with.

[Welfarê-silvermoon]

First off, Sul’thraze damage isn’t 1600.

Sul'thraze the Lasher

https://imgur.com/5LcXSb3

Secondly, Strength, while it contributes to damage, IS NOT directly proportional to the increase from it.

The base DPS of your auto-attacks (including ranged attacks made using Shoot or Auto-Shot is increased by 1 for every 14 attack power you have. For example, an AP of 28 will give you 2 DPS. Your DPS is then multiplied by weapon speed to give the real per-attack melee or ranged damage:

Weapon Damage = (Weapon DPS + AP/14) * Weapon Speed

If dual wielding, an off-hand weapon will also receive DPS from AP with the normal damage penalty of 50% by default. Disregarding dual wield specialization talents, the offhand damage is then:

Offhand Damage = [(Weapon DPS + AP/14) * Weapon Speed] / 2.

The bonus from attack power uses the weapon’s base speed, not your attack speed (which is often faster because of haste). Thus, attack power and haste will give a greater DPS increase together than separately.

Chew on that for a bit. 20% increase, indeed. I listed the issues above. Weapon swapping warriors that can obtain 500 additional strength with crusader procs if the RNG is nice to them. Couple that with the ~300 they have with gear and now you can see the disparity you are referring to, but it certainly isn’t gear based.

[Lannfear-dalaran]

Chew on that for a bit. 20% increase, indeed.

=) Chewing away, math is great.

So 28% versatility equals what?

EDIT: I see: 28% more damage and take 14% less damage.

[Lannfear-dalaran]

First off, Sul’thraze damage isn’t 1600.

I was going by the wowhead link, I don’t have it myself. That is good to know.

[Welfarê-silvermoon]

Still want to say that a twink warriors advantage is gear based? This also leads back to what you consider BiS, Crit, haste, or versa. There can be numerous item sets that increase each of this secondaries but only YOU can figure out which one best suits your playstyle. That’s why some of us twink, to put together these little pieces of puzzles ( characters) and make them work.

Sul’thrazes base proc is 175 damage, as my screenshot shows, I get 181 damage due to versa kicking it up a few.

[Lannfear-dalaran]

Still want to say that a twink warriors advantage is gear based? This also leads back to what you consider BiS, Crit, haste, or versa. There can be numerous item sets that increase each of this secondaries but only YOU can figure out which one best suits your playstyle. That’s why some of us twink, to put together these little pieces of puzzles ( characters) and make them work.

Sure it is lol, just not to the extent I thought. Puzzling out what is best is a great spect of this game and I don’t think it should be removed. I just think the disparity (wherever it comes from) is way over the top right now.

I want to play low level BG’s while levelling and not have it basically decided by the number of twinks on each team.

I do appreciate the effort to bring in the real math and SS’s of the dmg done. It is helpful.

[Kangmurloc-dark-iron]

Because you want to hide how much of an advantage a twink has over a leveller.

My documented Images within these threads say otherwise.
Wowhead is there for everyone who would like to obtain these numbers.

Would you like some help on how this site works?
Can we walk you through the process of actually comparing/observing
Gearing Options, which will Display the Root of all Power.
Stats.

We have a perfect tool to observe the difference in stats.
Where is your contribution?

[anon50458587]

I would pay you to show me one player 1 shot someone in this game without burning absolutely every cooldown with potions, trinkets, consumables and berserker buff AND hitting a crit at the exact same time. Without all the moon’s being in absolute and complete alignment and RNJesus throwing the dice your way, it will not happen.

[anon50458587]

I want to play low level BG’s while levelling and not have it basically decided by the number of twinks on each team.

In a game where gear score decides the player I find it perplexing that people complain about BiS twinks having an unfair advantage in battlegrounds. I wonder if these same people complain about gear at 120? Probably. Being outgeared and being absolutely steamrolled by other players doesn’t just happen at the low levels it happens at the high levels as well. But I don’t play at end game, I play low level expansions.

[Lannfear-dalaran]

In a game where gear score decides the player I find it perplexing that people complain about BiS twinks having an unfair advantage in battlegrounds. I wonder if these same people complain about gear at 120? Probably. Being outgeared and being absolutely steamrolled by other players doesn’t just happen at the low levels it happens at the high levels as well. But I don’t play at end game, I play low level expansions.

Some might, but I don’t complain about anything at 120, I find it to be way more in line than in lowbie BG’s (when twinks are present). When twinks are not there, lowbie BG’s are super fun for me. When they are in the game, my entire experience is a categorically worse.

Just so you know, ‘who has the most twinks, wins’ works both ways. I am saying the experience with twinks on my team steamrolling the other team is equally bad as being steamrolled.

[Lannfear-dalaran]

I would pay you to show me one player 1 shot someone in this game without burning absolutely every cooldown with potions, trinkets, consumables and berserker buff AND hitting a crit at the exact same time. Without all the moon’s being in absolute and complete alignment and RNJesus throwing the dice your way, it will not happen.

Recently, there was a SS showing exactly this. Where do we collect payment?

[Lannfear-dalaran]

My documented Images within these threads say otherwise.

You showed an images of boots’ ilvl. ilvl is a pretty useless stat to indicate the root of all power. Even just the versatility difference is 28% lol, with the exact same ilvl.

Put on all your gear and swing your sword around so everyone can see what the cumulation of all the BiS gear actually does.

Otherwise you just keep ‘documenting’ the same useless information and emotes.

[anon50458587]

Please link. I would absolutely love to see a character without cooldown, buffs, potions and trinkets do enough damage to 1 shot a player.

[Eilane-kilrogg]

I posted like 4-5 screenshots of my non-twink toons doing significantly more damage than the majority of the team. I’m not sure what you really want, gear disparity happens, one shots are extremely rare and terrible players are extremely common. Warriors, Hunters and Druids are going to dominate BGs < 110. 110 will be dominated by Mythic raiders from Legion using BFA Azerite pieces + neck and > 111 will be players who farmed Timewalking gear / Azerite gear.