Let us casuals who already once seriously raided in our young age experience the game in a relaxed manner.
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Casuals have been raiding classic wow no problem for 6 years.
literally nothing has changed that is preventing “casuals” from raiding.
Casuals raided Vanilla Classic just fine without LFR.
Casuals raided TBC Classic just fine without LFR.
Casuals raided WOTLK Classic just fine without LFR.
Casuals raided Cata Classic just fine without LFR.
Literally nothing changes in MoP Classic which requires this entire new game mode for “casuals” in order to raid.
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Casuals won’t play it. Enjoy your dead mode in 2-3 months
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Casuals have been a vast majority of the classic population since 2019.
The casuals will continue to be the majority for MoP as well.
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People said the same thing when we were asking for rdf, Casuals have been running dungeons in classic wow no problem without rdf. It was bs then and it’s bs now.
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RDF makes sense though because dungeons are a quick 20 minute thing you can do 10000 times over if you want.
A raid is a once a week event per character on normal.
Completely different set of circumstances.
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YOUR definition of casual is not EVERYBODY’s definition of casual.
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My classic wow server had tons of guilds that didnt clear BWL while it was current, didnt clear AQ while it was current, didnt get remotely close to naxx while current, or SSC, or TK…
They didnt cry and complain for an easier method of raiding.
They showed up, got gear what gear they could… gave it their all… and cleared it when they could. The MoP devs are continuing to embrace that and i commend them.
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Rdf makes sense to you because you want it. Lfr doesn’t make sense to you because you don’t want it. That’s the whole story. The argument we made for rdf is the same argument we can make for lfr. If you don’t want to use it don’t use it. Stop trying to decide how other people should play.
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Or its literally exactly what i wrote.
The need to find instant groups for something you want to do 100 times a week has more of a purpose than something you would do once a week.
I literally wrote that and you wrote that off as nothing LOL
LFR absolutely kills a vast majority of guilds who only plan to run normal raids since there is no point in doing normal with LFR in the game. The ilvl difference is trivial for 99% of the content… so whats the point of trying when you can click a button and like 3 ilvl worse gear for doing nothing.
All it does is widen the gap between heroic guilds and casuals. Casuals go to LFR… sweats do heroic… everyone in the middle is force downwards since they arent good enough / sweaty enough for heroic. Pug scenes for normal 100% die with LFR.
I personally think killing 50-75% of casual guilds for a toxic wasteland of crap raiding is bad for the game… and the devs completely agree.
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Pretty much true. There are minimal groups in Retail for even new raids on normal now. Its either LFR or straight to heroic. Tho I think Mythic difficulty did add to this on the other end as well.
Heroic is the new “Normal” in retail, or LFR is depending on how you look at it.
I do still want LFR though, being entirely honest, I do not have the patience to do coordinated raiding on more than like two characters. So id be running alts through it 100% of the time to well, kill time.
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Normal in retail exists like the first few weeks… but them m+ comes out and the gear is so bad ilvl wise there is no point outside of tmog.
Kinda sucks tbh how much normal raiding is gutted in retail.
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That’s bullsht. I don’t know any guilds that announced to their members that they were no longer doing guild runs so you all just go do lfr. Nor did guilds announce they were going to do guild runs with lfr. When I read your posts I never know how much is lying or how much is sheer stupidity.
Because finding a pug always sucked. People said the same thing about dungeon pugs when rdf was added and it was 100% true. Auto queues are always better than finding a pug
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Everything you said is wrong.
LFR is raiding without a schedule, without a pre-determined team. Log in when u are able to. That does not exist in it’s current form. Casuals literally cannot raid right now.
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How about if you don’t like it just don’t use it
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Yup. M+ has better returns on time spent than normal does.
It does 100%
Though I think having a total of 4 difficulties along with M+ definitely killed it. M+ in general is a big culprit.
That’s not what he said, and no they do not announce it, people just stop going to the raids and start doing LFR. There is a shift that comes with LFR and it does affect casual guilds.
They sure as hell would have to announce it in the guilds I was in, or at least talk about. People join guilds to raid and if the guild stops raiding members are going to ask why.
It wasn’t people doing lfr but people quitting. You’re blaming the difficulties with casual guilds on lfr when the real problem was the steady decline in players all through Cata, MoP and every expansion after. No doubt now you’ll say people quit because of lfr. Just like when we argued about rdf people said people quit because of it.
1 Like
This did not address at all the body of what I sent to you.
They players do not announce, they just do. Engage with that and there’s a discussion.
Swing and a miss. Really easy to prop up arguments over nebulous things. People quit, people moved on, people stopped raiding normal to raid LFR. All of the above could be causes. You cannot rely on one while discounting another cuz you disagree with it. Unless you have sources?
I certainly did address it, you just have a reading comprehension problem. If guilds stop raiding because players move to lfr, or for whatever reason it would be a topic of discussion in the guild chat. Leaders would make some sort of announcement.
Hmm, somehow I missed your sources when you proclaimed
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Once you go through and back yours up, go ahead and call me out.
I supposed and noted a shift. If you have any real facts to refute me besides insults and sarcasm please do. I welcome it. Which will be interesting since I put forth a supposition.
Yup, in the past tense.
As in “jeffy went and did LFR this week so we lost X role.”
Start seeing more absences marked on raid sign ups. I will also say that yes, in my guild people directly stated they would be raiding LFR as primary if it was added.
Again tho, I noted several factors I believe added to the shift. Not all of which are LFR.
Again, I want LFR. I would also like to discuss the potential ripple effect of it since we now will have two versions of two expansions without it to compare.
Will normal raiding drop off due to people who wanted LFR but didn’t get it?
Will the numbers for normal raiding go up?
You just want to argue my dude.