laughs in Lone Wolf I have to kite everything or else I’m going to die. Every time I get to cast Aimed Shot, all I can think is “I don’t have any CC left and conc shot is going to wear off, so please aim faster before this mob eats my face.”
This happens at the beginning of every expansion. BM will get better.
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No idea how this is a thing, realistically, my BM hunter is always competitive in any content I am doing and beats most classes even remotely around my gear levels, though granted I’m not exactly pushing high M+ on him.
What’s more, it is a relatively easy spec to play (it’s my “mental break from healing” alt), and is highly mobile, meaning that while other specs/classes need to stop dps for mechanics BM hunters can usually keep doing damage. For this reason, stop looking at pure DPS numbers and make sure to include TOTAL DAMAGE DONE, which is far more important.
Biggest mistake I see is multi-shot spam when your pets are doing the dmg, you only use MS to trigger the pet cleave timer on packs. The rest is cycling cooldowns constantly.
You must not been raiding with good players or high level content then. It is undeniable that BM is lagging compared to other spec/classes
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Actually. If you look overall at any raid tier, BM is only 6 or 7 specs up from the bottom. I’m in my phone so I can’t pull up the logs right now, but they’re pretty consistent with only one fight where it’s above the midway mark.
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I just went through the logs from Normal. I use normal because there was a bigger sample size, but the results appear to be consistent across all tiers. These are the 75th percentile marks. Again, I’m not trying to massage data. I’m just trying to get an accurate representation of the specs when they are played properly, and I’m trying to avoid any special circumstances that might skew the data.
| Fight | BM | SV | MM | BM of 24 specs | MM of 24 specs | BM/MM Dmg |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Overall | 2982 | 2935 | 3347 | 15 | 3 | 89.1% |
| Shriekwing | 2357 | 2354 | 2784 | 15 | 4 | 84.7% |
| Huntsman | 3506 | 3592 | 3946 | 20 | 7 | 88.8% |
| Destroyer | 3020 | 2781 | 3399 | 11 | 1 | 88.8% |
| Sun King | 2915 | 3123 | 3471 | 18 | 4 | 84.0% |
| Xy’mox | 2871 | 2773 | 3159 | 12 | 5 | 90.9% |
| Darkvein | 3206 | 3160 | 3565 | 18 | 6 | 89.9% |
| Council | 2467 | 2350 | 2694 | 9 | 1 | 91.6% |
| Sludgefist | 3796 | 3429 | 4314 | 9 | 2 | 88.0% |
| Generals | 2678 | 2658 | 2919 | 16 | 7 | 91.7% |
| Denathrius | 3020 | 3131 | 3215 | 18 | 9 | 93.9% |
That parse rank wouldn’t be very important to me if all three specs were roughly equivalent. Right now, BM and MM are separated by TEN CLASSES, and roughly half of the DPS specs.
Imagine what this looks like in Details:
| Rank | Class | Spec |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | Warlock | Affliction |
| 2 | Druid | Balance |
| 3 | Priest | Shadow |
| 4 | HUNTER | MARKSMANSHIP |
| 5 | Death Knight | Unholy |
| 6 | Rogue | Outlaw |
| 7 | Mage | Fire |
| 8 | Druid | Feral |
| 9 | Rogue | Subtlety |
| 10 | Shaman | Elemental |
| 11 | Shaman | Enhancement |
| 12 | Warrior | Arms |
| 13 | Monk | Windwalker |
| 14 | Paladin | Retribution |
| 15 | Demon Hunter | Havoc |
| 16 | HUNTER | BEAST MASTERY |
| 17 | Warlock | Demonology |
| 18 | Hunter | Survival |
| 19 | Death Knight | Frost |
| 20 | Warlock | Destruction |
| 21 | Warrior | Fury |
| 22 | Mage | Arcane |
| 23 | Mage | Frost |
| 24 | Rogue | Assassination |
If one spec is that MUCH stronger than the other specs though, people are going to expect you to play that spec. When raid leaders look at you to determine your worthiness, they expect you to be competitive within your Class, not your spec. This is just too much to overcome.
This has only been this bad since Ion took the reigns. Prior to him, most specs were reasonably competitive. Certainly for Hunters, I could always play any of the three specs, and I would be right there with the other Hunters.
In fact, during my entire raiding career as a Hunter between Wrath and WoD, I never had to play MM or BM. Even when RSV wasn’t as good as MM or BM, I was never asked to switch specs because it was “close enough” to those specs that isn’t want a big deal.
That is no longer the case.
Close enough would be SV and BM. I’m perfectly fine being the middle of the pack if I’m not being forced out of the only spec that sill feels like a traditional Hunter.
Middle of the pack (or lower) is hard to justify to most raid leaders when another Hunter in your group is topping the charts. Warcraftlogs shows MM at spots 4 and 5 for most fights, it’s performance is still significantly higher than most other specs, so the difference in details looks very Dramatic.
I’ve been using the “I prefer BM” argument for awhile, but I can see the writing on the wall, and I’ve been stashing my Soul Ash for the MM BiS Legendary. I don’t want to play MM, but I do want to play.
If it’s not better tuned by New Years, I’m going to have to switch.
11 Likes
I’m not sure what your saying here. Is not damage per second a result of total damage divided by time?
And in that case wouldn’t looking at either show you MM has superior numbers (in the case of two equally skilled/geared players).
Also this argument some have brought up now and in the past about BM not having to stop moving for maximum dps is puzzling…if it is such a bonus to BM and such a detriment to other dps classes/specs then the logs would show BM at a more respective level to those other classes/specs due to the other classes/specs performing lower than their max dps because of having to move for mechanics.
In my opinion the fact that BM doesn’t have to stop dps upon movement for mechanics and is still almost bottom of the barrel is more telling about the bad state of the spec.
10 Likes
Couldn’t have said it better myself. I have always mained a BM hunter. I’ve pugged nearly every aotc for heroic as a BM without issue. Once some of the other raids come out with more fights centered around being a dps check over mechanics, SV & BM are going to get cut just for not being MM.
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I know this is 12 days old but seeing how I play Tenac AC in Torghast I can confirm my second pet stays out until my primary pet is revived which is plenty of time.
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I agree! I think it has to do with alot of other classes and MM buffed and BM was just left alone, stripped from all the things that buffed us in BFA, we are but shadows of our former selves. There is no way to keep up with the lesser geared other classes now in a raid. Our legendaries are terrible, conduits are bad and LOL have you been in Torgast? How many defensive things can we get? the most dps they give us is how many times we can kill mawrats? and get a buff from them?!
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Yet bm does torghast with ease.
I’ve been playing BM hunter since shadowlands dropped. I do feel like they need a buff, at the bare minimum their legendary’s. They are fine at low ilvl, actually pretty good. When I was in mythic 0’s and every one else was around the same ilvl, I was almost always in first place. But now that i’m at level 205 ILVL, and everyone else is around it, i’ve went from being in the top spot in raids, to having to not make a single mistake to get in the top 5, and that’s if I get lucky with crits.
They went full retard with the nerfs before SL actually went live. They need to buff BM about 12% across the board to make it even vial seeing how we have no legendary that is worth a damn.
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Ah yes, the random 5% dmg nerf to BM 1 week before SL was released. Completely unneeded. Now, BM is dead for high end content.
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BM is fine. MM will pull higher numbers in most cases, but that doesn’t mean BM is “dead.”
When there is 15-20% difference in MM vs BM that means bm is dead for all content.
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What was the difference between BM and MM in 8.3? So brokenly ridiculous you wonder why every hunter wasn’t just BM, and yet people were still playing MM.
MM had a niche in M+ due to high 5 target burst though.
Unless you are in a cutting edge mythic guild, a skilled BM will do fine in raids.
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Well, not literally “dead”. Y’know, the same way how MM was “dead” last expansion because of how strong BM was. To the point where you’d be declined to groups if you’re not the “correct” spec. To the point where the dps difference is more than 20%. Yeah, that kind of “dead”.
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