It’s an MMO. Pushing content and progressing is a core design of the game in almost literally everything you do. The mature “reee” really does wonders for your point. It’s convinced me to take you seriously.
This does nothing to address the extra design complexity that a sub-spec inherently brings to the table. You aren’t just arguing that you can take the inferior option, and that I can take the optimal one - you’re arguing that Frost be put back into design hell all over again, and that the entire spec be set back for your convenience.
It’s really silly to imply that just because someone isn’t pushing higher content that efficiency doesn’t matter or still have an impact. I even just explained why it matters.
Again, you handicap the entire spec when you tack on a sub-spec with a slew of design side effects that cannot be avoided. This isn’t about optimal, it’s about not re-making a mistake already learned.
Oh forgive me, I’m sorry I’ve included a minor meme to break up the borderline copypasting I have to do every time someone brings up the same bad arguments.
No, an MMO is an online game where people play a larger game together. What they do within that game is kind of up to them. There is a reason there is much more to do in the game other than end game raid dungeons. I have played this game since classic and have almost never played the top tier end game dungeons while they were live. I do not have the time - I have a job, wife, kids, etc. I log on to PVP, talk to friends or do other random miscellaneous things around the world. The way I play the game is no more correct or wrong than yours. The point of the game is for the community to have fun.
If you read the whole thing, the man is claiming that 2h was almost never VIABLE. Again viable doesnt equal optimal, so the reply is correct. 2h was viable, it was basically never optimal
For the people in the back now.
VIABLE. DOES. NOT. EQUAL. OPTIMAL.
AGAIN, if you only want to play whats optimal, dont play it then. omg hard concepts.
So back to my origional point. People arent stating that 2h is/was (except for VERY few times)/will be better than dw. They just want it back for aesthetic purposes. There are people that are so against this, they even argue a transmog into a 2h. Think about that. They are against a TRANSMOG. Something that has actually 0 impact on ANYONES gameplay.
Do try to not to make wild accusations. That is in no way said or implied in my posts.
The way you used it wasn’t a meme, but a poor way to take a jab and paint people you disagree with as either raging, or autistic based on the history of said meme. So please, forgive me for having no patience for that kind of low tier trolling.
I left off the RPG from the MMORPG that this game is. My point still stands that this game has progression as a core element of its design in multiple aspects of the game since literally 2004, making the mockery of such an element really off base. Even playing the game casually, you’re still playing for some amount of progression unless you take extreme measures to avoid it. You don’t have to be bleeding-edge to progress through content, or for balance and optimization to matter - the casual PvP you mention still requires balance, and consideration no matter how often you personally play it. And that still doesn’t invalidate that said balance absolutely matters to a large portion of the playerbase and cannot be dismissed on the premise of, “Eh, doesn’t matter to me.”
You’re literally saying don’t include two handed because (in your words) it cannot compete with dual wield and players always go for the meta.
So, why not remove every single talent and just bake in default upgrades that you automatically receive upon leveling up? I’m following your line of logic. This is exactly completely in line with what you said about disincluding two handers because “they will always be inferior and thus players will choose the meta.”
That’s one of your most dishonest uses of the word “literal” to date. Well done on missing the point of the discussion that delved into viable vs. optimal.
You very clearly implied that player choice should not be allowed because progression is the only thing that matters. So, why are you backing down from removing talents completely Monkiy?
Why even have Arms Warriors, Protection is clearly the optimal spec for warriors since other DPS can out-DPS Arms most expansions. Same for Ret Paladins versus Holy and Prot Paladins. Remove them, not optimal for the class.
That’s one of your most dishonest uses of the word “literal” to date. Well done on missing the point of the discussion that delved into viable vs. optimal.
I haven’t been in this discussion for a few days but you have heavily implied this on a few occasions, and I’m nearly certain you said it verbatim but for arguments sake I’ll leave it at a probably.
But you can wield a 2-hand as Frost right now. You can’t use half the frost abilities since it’s for duel wield but no one stopping ya. It’s like a sub rogue saying why can’t I use a sword… I really like swords instead of daggers…